Gridlock Mikey

OK so i've seen a few cars with this mod on, i'm told that it's safe and im told that the overall benefit is that the car uses its power far more efficiently, delivers it better etc.

Now the thing is that I'm a mechanical retard when it comes to Scoob engines, so i've looked at as many threads as I can about fitting them etc and duya know what?...............I can't make head nor tail of most of them

I have asked "knowledgable" folk and i don't think i've heard the same story/opinion twice. It all seems to point to "These Dawes things are the conkers..........BUT beware of this that and the other". (Never beware of the same thing though)

I get the same feeling about it as i did when choosing an exhaust. 100 opinions (Which is all good don't get me wrong) but no one actually saying why they specifically chose a certain type.

Lets take wheels for example, people can discuss those 'cos you can see them and everyone tends to know about rim size, offset, tyres etc. If i posted up.."should i buy superleggeras? The answers would be positive. Either a definate "yes because...." or a definate "No because....... "

Can this not happen with the dawes issue?

It seems that the only people who know about them ultimatley are the guys who spend all thier spare time under a bonnet, attatching this guage, testing that guage, tightening this inlet and closing that gate

I don't think that i am alone in wanting to know the simple things about dawes.

Is it safe
Can it simply be plummed in and left
Do i really need to be worrying about knackering my engine
Will a fraction of a turn really matter

Should i bother to learn or should i just leave it to the "clever" people and go without.

Mikey (Wants to go quicker without spending £'000s but doesn't want to blow his car up)

Comments

ScoobyJawa

Flippin' eck Mikey - just buy it - you know ya wanna

Piece of cake. Plumb it in between the turbo output to the wastegate, remove the t-piece and block off the end of the pipe to the actuator. On in 15 mins then an hour or so to set up to hold about 1.1/1.2 bar or around 15 psi, then leave it. Job done, no probs, then leave it and you're fuel cut stays in place so the engine will be fine. Oh, mine was fueling fine and still very rich at just over 15psi held (10% Co2) when checked so fueling is also cool

Gridlock Mikey

Thanks for that scooby

Anyone else got one and just "bunged" it on?

Anyone know of anyone ******* thier car up?

Mikey

nom

Easy peasy. I'm a mechanical retard too & I couldn't believe how easy it was to do. Putting the boost guage on was far harder! And both are easier than remembering how to spell guage/gauge/guauge
I stuck the boost guage on, wizzed around a bit to 'calibrate' the guage (i.e. find out how wrong it was as the standard boost is a sort-of known quantity ) & then plumbed on the Dawes & adjusted it. Safe as long as stupid boosts aren't requested, although fuel-cut comes in before too high boosts to damage anything turn up anyway.
My advice is to find a nice piccy of your MY that someone has stuck up & follow that along with The Best (TM) set-up on one of the many threads out there... hang on... nope, can't find it. "$^&£^%&"$ search

mega_stream

I'm in the same boat m8, dunno what these guys are on about...

Interested myself in getting one of these, specially as I been told I can get near PPP ecu performance from my00 with its standard (ae801) ecu

I've still not found a site with the U.K price in for these, also was told I need an AFR meter, which the dawes site can't show me due to them not being in stock

So its a dawes, afr meter, and boost meter...thats all thats needed right?

Subzero

Mega

I think that the performance should be better than PPP from reports on here. It's just that John Banks has worked out that it is even better with it as well as a PPP.

F

nom

I'm not convinced it's as good as PPP, but then it's a bit cheaper and there's not much in it... and I think it's probably not a good idea to start that argument Definately the best value mod though!
No UK dealer yet (I believe someone's trying) but direct from Dawes works fine. 10-14 day delivery seems to be the norm.
You don't need to get the AFR from Dawes, there are plenty of other ones out there, and I'm not convinced the AFR is needed unless there's a load of other mods on the car - reports seem to be that the mixture is as good () as usual with the Dawes on.
Boost gauge an absolute must, though.

ScoobyJawa

You will get better than PPP performance. Not sure what PPP is officially supposed to give but my MY99 with full decat and ITG filter got 266bhp and 257 torque

nom

Ahh, but that's technical performance, as opposed to real performance.
Who cares anyway? The Dawes is rather more affordable

Gridlock Mikey

Decent Boost Guage anyone?

Mikey

How do you spell guage by the way

mega_stream

Mikey YHM

mutant_matt

Arguably better performance than the PPP if used with a FCD (Fuel Cut Defender) as the PPP has a higher fuel cut so you can run more boost. The advantage over a PPP without the FCD is that you get more boost lower down in the rev range with the Dawes but less at the top so it's a close call.

I think the PPP quotes 237bhp and 259ft/lbs torque. If installing the Dawes, I would not be happy without at least a Boost gauge and AFR gauge of some kind, but personally, I'm going to install a Knock Link too before putting the Dawes on as I'm like that (and even then I'll do a run on the Select Monitor as well to monitor advance and AFR too).

Matt

Gridlock Mikey

Matt, keep it simple in here mate
because i am

Mikey

HarryBoy

Mikey,
I have put up some instructions for the installing a Dawes on UK MY 97-00 at http://www.geocities.com/harryboy_scooby/

Hope this helps.

Harry

[Edited by HarryBoy - 2/11/2002 3:26:57 PM]

[Edited by HarryBoy - 2/11/2002 3:27:42 PM]

ScoobyJawa

They may be dyno figures but trust me the car absolutely flies now - its so much faster than with just the decat and a shed load more torque now too - really shoves you in the seat.

True about the fuel cut on the PPP being higher but a factory fitted PPP does not make the most of that and a UK ecu can easily run similar power with a Dawes. If you add a Dawes to a PPP then thats a different matter

I've just got a boost gauge (thats how its spelt ) no Air Fuel Ratio gauge (AFR), however straight after fitting the car was RR's and put on the select monitor and all was fine.

mega_stream

ScoobyJawa, where did you get your car r'roaded?

Slightly o/t but nevertheless related, how easy is it to fit a kock and lamba link?

John

Gridlock Mikey

how easy is it to fit a kock and lamba link?

HAHAHAHAHA

See how none of us can bladdy spell

Mikey

Gridlock Mikey

Harry Boy, Really good site, helped alot. I understand what it's all about now (ish)

Mikey

ScoobyJawa

spock fer yesalf

John - was done at Power Engineering as part of the big RR day at the end of Jan. Fitted the Dawes in the morning, set it up and then went to the RR figures I got I posted earlier. My car is an MY99 BTW with Black 800 ecu.

As for fitting a Knock or Lambda sensor - no idea

ScoobyJawa

Yeah your brown 801 should be just fine. I got the standard Dawes the deluxe is supposed to stop peaks and spikes and react fractionally quicker but I don't have any probs with my boggo one

Should get some nice gains with that zorst

Andy Hobson

I'm waiting for my Dawes from the group buy. I got my car dyno'ed at PE on Saturday so I could get some before / after numbers. I have to say I was a bit disappointed with my numbers. Only 236bhp / 245lbft for a MY00 with full decat and K&N induction. The guy said that he has done so many he can tell from the engine when it's running too rich. He said mine felt like it was drowning in fuel

I'm hoping the Dawes will lean out the mixture a bit but it sounds like it's the old Green label ECU bag of sh*te syndrome again. I got some quotes for a black label ECU from a breakers but the best was £225 which is a lot to just get back to last year's spec !

BTW -
PE reckon they're going to have their 99/00 phase 1 ready in the next couple of months - better late than never

Paul_H

Just a note of caution. Adding a fuel cut defender into the equation has the potential to wreck your engine.

Don't get me wrong - I've got a Dawes on my car too, I'm not against tuning, far from it. But these kind of modifications need to be applied with moderation, monitoring of the engine, and knowledge of the consequences. If you get it wrong it WILL go bang.

ski

Is John Banks going to add his salt to this thread

Paul_H

"Will a fraction of a turn really matter?"

Here's a scenario. You want a bit more....you give the Dawes an extra turn.....you hit fuel cut whilst overtaking....you have a head-on collision and die.

Doesn't the answer have to be yes?

Lars

I use a Dawes MBC on a standard MY99, run 1.1 bar and the bleed hole enlarged to 1mm. You need a Boost gauge to be able to set the Dawes.
When you start to adjust the Dawes you can do several turns and nothing happens, but when the spring is compressed, half a turn on the MBC gives around 0.5 bar (7 psi)
I run with a AFR lamda device, but it OK for the first two times you floor the pedal, then it heat up and you can't trust the reading.
Is it safe ? There is no free lunch, and no free BHP.
My fuel use went up around 10%
Power is GREAT, I removed the Dawes and went back to standard 0.9 bar and 218 BHP, it was like driving my whifes Ford Ka, and after two days the Dawes was back.
Next Month I do a vacation trip to France 1000 miles, and before I will remove the Dawes. Reason I do not trust it if I go full power on the German highway for hours, and I do not trust it in the mountains, It will try to spool up and keep the 1.1 bar, Intake temp will raise and, and OK I'm chicken

john banks

Very wise Lars.

NM

Cant you just turn it down to standard boost ????? Or do you have to remove the unit ???

Neal

Subzero

Lars, you're frightening me! Stop! I was just going to try this mod but now I'm scared. I drive to work in mixed fast/slow traffic and I don't want melted pistons or anything else. I thought that the fueling would be OK to about 15 or 16PSI but you're saying that on extended runs the AFR is useless? ARRGGHH!

F

Gridlock Mikey

DOH! its happened again

Mikey

Subzero

John, if the sensor says you're lean but you may not be, then I guess the ECU is getting the same info. Wouldn't the ECU then put more fuel in anyway to compensate? That's safe isn't it?

Floyd