EcuTek2 - Post Mortem
18 May 2003, 06:12 PM
#1
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Test Drove an MY02 with Ecutek2 on Saturday...... I was disappointed. I was wanting the effect of an MBC (Dawes) but done safely. I did not get this in fact I hardly noticed a difference over standard. The PPP kicked the Ecutek2's *** in the fact that you got the high boost (slight) kick in your back feeling. Time to go for Ecutek3...........
18 May 2003, 11:09 PM
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Ecutek have their own forum now at http://forum.ecutek.com/
This could be discussed there and you'll get response from the Ecutek gurus as well.
Cheers,
Wrexy.
This could be discussed there and you'll get response from the Ecutek gurus as well.
Cheers,
Wrexy.
18 May 2003, 11:48 PM
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The kick in the back is nice with an MBC or an overboosting car. Cars also vary one to the other. It is also possible to use an MBC with a remap, although I think I am the only one that supports this. Having fiddled with MBCs the quality of the control they give is embarrassingly good, and I flit myself between three port solenoid (with a judge on the gears to give full boost even in 1st and 2nd gear) or an MBC. Certainly the standard 2 port solenoids in the classic or new shape cars do not give the same hit. Some people prefer the smoother delivery.
The problem with an MBC on the new shape cars is part throttle high boost conditions which can cause high EGTs and lean issues (particularly with the staged fuel pump operation on part throttle). In addition, the "run off" areas of the map you hit with an MBC are far from optimal on the fuelling. So a remap can benefit here, plus the ability to run higher boost levels than the original fuel cut without fuel cut defenders.
The problem with an MBC on the new shape cars is part throttle high boost conditions which can cause high EGTs and lean issues (particularly with the staged fuel pump operation on part throttle). In addition, the "run off" areas of the map you hit with an MBC are far from optimal on the fuelling. So a remap can benefit here, plus the ability to run higher boost levels than the original fuel cut without fuel cut defenders.
19 May 2003, 11:44 AM
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Yes agree with Russ, but the car was standard apart from a back box and was faster at higher revs than a standard car but still suffered the bog down feeling at slow speeds in 2nd gear, i was told the throttle response was as sharp as on the 03 but it was nowhere near and as for the claimed 265BHP the guy needs to come down off his cloud, i would say no more than 235BHP.
The test for me that it failed on was the 50-70mph in 5th which was in a word, disapointing.
My car felt so much better, but it was an improvement over a standard car,what i want to know is can you notice the difference as much on say a decatted car as you could on the standard version ?
I would like to try it but only if it could be removed if i wasnt happy with the GAINS it supposedly offered.
Zippy
The test for me that it failed on was the 50-70mph in 5th which was in a word, disapointing.
My car felt so much better, but it was an improvement over a standard car,what i want to know is can you notice the difference as much on say a decatted car as you could on the standard version ?
I would like to try it but only if it could be removed if i wasnt happy with the GAINS it supposedly offered.
Zippy
19 May 2003, 11:55 AM
#5
So just to check, are we comparing a PPP with ECU and exhaust mods including removing one cat, to a Ecutek Tek 2 with just a backbox?
Cats kill throttle response.
Paul
Cats kill throttle response.
Paul
19 May 2003, 12:50 PM
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Paul,
We're trying to establish if fitting an Ecutek2 to a decatted 01> car will give the same kind of percentage increase as fitting it to a standard 01> car (With only a WR Sport backbox - All Cats still intact)
Hope that makes sense?
Cheers
Nick
We're trying to establish if fitting an Ecutek2 to a decatted 01> car will give the same kind of percentage increase as fitting it to a standard 01> car (With only a WR Sport backbox - All Cats still intact)
Hope that makes sense?
Cheers
Nick
19 May 2003, 01:12 PM
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If you use a map optimised for a car with an uppipe cat on one without or vice versa you will run into performance or reliability problems (not setting fire to the uppipe cat).
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19 May 2003, 01:50 PM
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Russ
We have done one with only a rear silencer and whilst this was a custom map, I was also dissapointed. The owner was very pleased and was determined that he did not want any more than the rear silencer.
The main reason for the difference is that because the cats create so much back pressure, the hot burnt gas from the last firing does not get fully extracted. This means that the next charge coming in will be a hotter mix and more volatile. The result is less fresh mix to ignite and less ignition advance possible.
Russ, if you are just comparing your car immediately after it was done, this will add fuirther dissapointment. Get 200 mixed miles on it and then compare. Until this is down, the ECU has not built up its correction tables and will be running very conservatively.
We have done one with only a rear silencer and whilst this was a custom map, I was also dissapointed. The owner was very pleased and was determined that he did not want any more than the rear silencer.
The main reason for the difference is that because the cats create so much back pressure, the hot burnt gas from the last firing does not get fully extracted. This means that the next charge coming in will be a hotter mix and more volatile. The result is less fresh mix to ignite and less ignition advance possible.
Russ, if you are just comparing your car immediately after it was done, this will add fuirther dissapointment. Get 200 mixed miles on it and then compare. Until this is down, the ECU has not built up its correction tables and will be running very conservatively.
19 May 2003, 10:51 PM
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Quick question...
I have an MY02 which had a standard "TeK 2" from Nick in Cumbria... it's just been de-catted last week (up and down pipe, he saya he can re-map if for me again to compensate but not sure when..
is the engine going to die in the meantime ??
Midlife....
I have an MY02 which had a standard "TeK 2" from Nick in Cumbria... it's just been de-catted last week (up and down pipe, he saya he can re-map if for me again to compensate but not sure when..
is the engine going to die in the meantime ??
Midlife....
20 May 2003, 01:47 PM
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It seems chaps that we need to cough up for the full de-cat and then a custom re-map to achieve what we want as nobody can build a map for my car in particular that would still keep the up-pipe cat in place.
The Palmers car with the Ecutek upload for cars with only a partial de-cat is no faster than a standard car with a Dawes device and i would actually say it was significantly slower.
It would be good if the Palmers mapper was prepared to use his Ecutek examples and map cars with different exhaust configurations.
1= Full de-cat
2=Up-pipe cat still in.
3=Centre Section backwards.
1 and 3 are there but what about number 2 ?
Zippy
The Palmers car with the Ecutek upload for cars with only a partial de-cat is no faster than a standard car with a Dawes device and i would actually say it was significantly slower.
It would be good if the Palmers mapper was prepared to use his Ecutek examples and map cars with different exhaust configurations.
1= Full de-cat
2=Up-pipe cat still in.
3=Centre Section backwards.
1 and 3 are there but what about number 2 ?
Zippy
21 May 2003, 12:24 PM
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I think it's important to remember here what you want (all info in an IMHO manner 
) - an MBC controlled car tends to 'feel' quicker as it's rather 'all or nothing', so there's a punch when the boost comes that feels fast, and also the fairly large lack of difference between 30% & 100% throttle also shows. All feels nice & quick, but there's less control... A nicely set up ECU controlled boost should build quickly (but not suddenly) and give good granularity throughout the throttle-travel - so power can be gradually pushed in rather than slammed in. [IMHO mode off] This will feel slower [IMHO back on again ]. But it isn't necessarily so in 50-70 times, etc. and most definately won't be if driven in real conditions (ie on roads with curves...) rather than just playing on straight flat things.
So, do you want a fast car, or just a car that feels fast?
(The Daws is still a fabulously good value bang-for-buck, though)
) - an MBC controlled car tends to 'feel' quicker as it's rather 'all or nothing', so there's a punch when the boost comes that feels fast, and also the fairly large lack of difference between 30% & 100% throttle also shows. All feels nice & quick, but there's less control... A nicely set up ECU controlled boost should build quickly (but not suddenly) and give good granularity throughout the throttle-travel - so power can be gradually pushed in rather than slammed in. [IMHO mode off] This will feel slower [IMHO back on again ]. But it isn't necessarily so in 50-70 times, etc. and most definately won't be if driven in real conditions (ie on roads with curves...) rather than just playing on straight flat things.So, do you want a fast car, or just a car that feels fast?
(The Daws is still a fabulously good value bang-for-buck, though
)
21 May 2003, 04:18 PM
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Nom
That's a very good point. IMHO its essential to have the throttle give an effect for all of its travel. On a fast bend, on track, you want to feather the throttle to adjust the understeer/oversteer balance through the corner and a car that was very binary on the throttle would have to take the corner slower, to avoid losing the correct line or even spinning out.
(that sentence was a bit long
)
That's a very good point. IMHO its essential to have the throttle give an effect for all of its travel. On a fast bend, on track, you want to feather the throttle to adjust the understeer/oversteer balance through the corner and a car that was very binary on the throttle would have to take the corner slower, to avoid losing the correct line or even spinning out.
(that sentence was a bit long
)
