I had this idea at 5:30am this morning when I was waking up for work and also had (and still have) a mild fever....but I cannot se a good reason why it wouldn't actually work:

Would it be possible to fit a nozzle into the turbine housing of the turbo, to direct a high pressure jet of an inert-ish gas (say CO2 or whatever) to spin the turbo up faster?

You could trigger it on WOT and just push 3 or 4 bar or compressed gas thru a hihgly directional nozzle. Presumably if you could pulse this jet the effect would be even greater?

I know this is probably an idiot idea...but I need someone to tell me why it cannot be done.

re: the gas running out...well...so does NOs, right?

 

Might create backpressure problems in the headers

Just a thought

Trout

 

I don't thing the turbine wheel would like super hot gasses on one side and super cold CO2 on the other! It could probably complain by exploding to tiny bits.

George

 

Hmm....the temperature differential could be a bit nasty, I suppose.

Ok..how about a more volatile gas that would ignite a bit in the hot turbine? In fact, you could use a heck of a lot less gas if you did that! Presumably it would shorten the life of the turbine, though? A bit like Anti-Lag?

 

If you want quick spool up, then how about using 10 minature turbos in parallel

H

 

T_Steve, i think you're now heading into the right direction. A bit of Gas would probaly behave as Anti-lag but why stop there!
Why not use a bit of O2 & H2, that could promote a self sustained combustion and we would never have to worry again about porting heads, manifolds and turbos in general. I like it !!!

George

 

Pre Turbo NOS (intake side) is the way to go for fast spool up...

Grant

 

aint worth the hassle.. run anti-lag or fit nitrous and use it off boost..

David

 

Put a fuel injector in the headers, and use a wastegate as a BOV to plumb the waste air during a gearchange into the manifold to burn with the fuel.

Obviously it would need some measurement of pressures, and some refinement, but it does work to solve lag between gears.

Traditional anti lag might be nice too.

Paul

 

I've got an idea for faster spool up - you could rig up some sort of belt from the crankshaft pulley that will enable the turbo to be driven by the engine until there is enough gas to spin on it's own and then you could disengage the belt.....

Trout

 

Trout,

What about modifying an old AC unit, so that instead of engaging/disengaging with "temp", it works with boost ?

Mark.

 

The belt idea had crossed my mind....but modifying an aircon unit I LIKE!

Paul, putting a 5th injector into the exhaust headers? Wouldn't this dramatically increase the temperature in the turbine? How would this be better from traditional anti-lag?
And would it even work when the exhaust was cold?

Anti-Lag is great once the car is up and going through the gears, but it didn't think it helped you get on boost quick when you were at low revs (e.g. trying to overtake someone in 5th)
that kind of thing. Kind of aiming for a more "V6" kind of torque curve with this idea

Hope you all had a good xmas!

 

Why not just get a BOCU.....see other thread. It sounds absolutely unbelievable, but the pic is there for all to see

 

-ahem- yeah, right....with pics, huh?

Good job the aussies know what they are doing, huh?

 

and you like the idea of modifing an A/C unit... <shakes his head in disbelief>

someones been drinking too much..

 

still drunk as a skunk from last night!

Why do I always get ill at xmas when the doctors are all closed?


In theory a belt on the turbo shaft would make it a supercharger....so that's cool. I have absoloutely no idea how the AC unit works (nor do I really care) but if it has got a really strong high revving clutch system inside that won't explode, then what's the problem?

Get a 90degree entrance turbo, extend the shaft through the elbow, fit AC clutch to the front, belt/chain from driveshaft, bob is your uncle.

I'm not planning to DO it...I thought I might ask you, david!

I reckon it would work really well for the 5 minutes before something went CRUNCH.

 

Normal anti lag can't give you spool up when you're already on power. The tricks it uses to burn the inlet charge very late, whiles in the ex manifold means that power is going to be very low. It tends to be used to when off load, either between gears or just prior to a launch (launch control).

Easy way would be a supercharger that's disengaged after a certain point, or just get rid of the turbo altogether.

Garret do an electrically assisted turbo, designed for normal passenger cars, not really needed on racing cars.

Paul

 

Superchargers don't give the power turbo's do.

Hmm...Anti-Lag sounds better than I thought!
Presumably this could be added to the fuel+ ignition maps on a standard car if the ISCV was opened on the exhaust phase of the cam to allow air into the headers? This would cause a small explosion in the hot exhaust headers, causing a standing wave that would drive the turbo?

How much would this shorten the life of the turbine blades?
Is it even possible?

 

steve now your talking... antilag is apparently a feature in the old ecu's

you could modify the map so when you it puts more fuel in at relatively low load and there was talk of messing with iscv..

David

 

WTF? You means it is built in to a standard car, just not enabled? I suppose this is similar to the legendary 5th injector on the STi. Fitted, but not enabled. Hmm.

So are you telling me that there is a completely seperate map within the ECUs for Anti-Lag? Presumably there must be a pin on the ECU connector that you can set Hi to trigger this?

lol...or do I just press the 'headlight washer' button at exactly the right moment? (kidding!)

Surely this gives a very large explosion, though, (vergin on detonation) within the headers? And this would result in the turbine blades getting extremely hot, and being put under an unreasonable load at the same time?

It sounds good, but destructve!
Surely there must be a better way.............