UkLegacyT

as above, next mod on my engine is to ditch the 90 degree turbo entry and go for the under-manifold front entry, as seen on the later cars.

question is, apart from a later inlet manifold, power steering pump, and header tank, is anything else needed?

also, does the later p/s pump bolt straight on?
and is the abs in the way of the new induction pipework or not?

thanks
ian

Scooby Racer

I think that the cast water rail across the top of the block my get in the way. It was certainly changed for the later, front entry turbo engines. Could be wrong though.

Big Bear

The later P/S pump will fit the earlier cars .

Big Bear

Oh yes and you will need to modify the throttle cable mount as the cable is shorter on the earlier car , you will also have to change one of the P/S pipes , as the original ones will foul the inlet pipe to the turbo .

UkLegacyT

cheers guys

scooby racer, yeah i know the pipe you are on about, forgot about that, does the later one use a water pipe that bolts onto the same holes as mine? im assuming so, as the blocks are vertually identical (closed deck on mine).

ian

Scooby Racer

I'm fairly sure that it will fit. Some of the steel pipework that runs across the block to the water pump, heat exchanger and heater hose may be a bit different but I'm sure you can mix and match to suit. For info I just used the old spec inlet manifold but made spacers to lift it by 8mm or so and ditched all the crap standard fuel pipework in favour of goodridge hoses. This left just enough clearance to fit the turbo inlet pipe made by Samco. With the PAS pump I just fitted a later model resevoir (remote) and hose fitting which bolts to the same place as the early pump mounted resevoir. I also needed to 'displace' the steel feed and return pipes a little bit down towards the head.

Scooby Racer

I didn't mention that I left the old spec cast water rail on top of the block as well! The Samco hose is quite flexible and squeezed in the gap no dramas.

ustolemyname??stevieturbo

iTrader: (1)

The later manifold will require quite a bit of work to make it fit. You will also need to add a Throttle closed switch, as the later TPS is only a potentiometer, whereas the early cars is a pot, and a closed switch, with 4 wires, not 3.
Fuel rails are also different, as are the breather pipes etc, but if you use the manifold complete with pipes, it may work. The water pipes across the top of the block may also need altering.
You will need to alter the power steering pipes, to clear the new induction pipe, and yes, the newer pump will bolt straight on, but you must get the appropriate pipes for the pump, as the older ones are different.
It is quite a bit of work, so dont expect it to go smoothly in a day, as Im sure there will be oversights.

David_Wallis

it would be easier to do the conversion with a spacer and leave the manifold as it is.. IE raise it up..

I've looked into doing this and think you could get away with not changing the ps pump... im sure stevietubo said there was a problem with doing this??

one of the pipes is in the way though.. and if you are altering fuel pipes then change to parallel feed

David

ustolemyname??stevieturbo

iTrader: (1)

Fuel pipes may be awkward. Power steering pump does need to be changed, to allow the use of the appropriate pipes, and the smaller angled reservoir. You need to to make room for the pipe to pass through the front beside the reservoir.
Various breather pipes, and water etc will need altered too.
For the early car still using the original ecu, I would prefer to raise the std manifold as it is less complicated, and saves messing with the TPS.
I still havent done my car yet, but will someday.

UkLegacyT

guess thats sorted then, i will use the original manifold and raise it up. ive already lifted it 10mm using the insulator plates, but will make some alloy spacers too. should 10/15mm further do the trick?

will use later pump.

i intend to change the fuel rails to parallel.

what about the injectors? are ther any available to suit the phase 1 inlet? ie.550cc

ustolemyname??stevieturbo

iTrader: (1)

Arent the ones Pavlo is selling Phase 1??
I raised mine 20mm, which looks like enough clearance, and doesnt mess things up too much.

David_Wallis

They wont fit phase 1 rails, without a spacer being made... much easier to fit phase 2 rails...

I now have phase 1 manifold, Phase 2 Rails and 550cc Injectors.

David

UkLegacyT

excellent, will raise another 15mm to be sure, and get phase 2 rails and 550's.
with my walbro pump, and also the fse thats in the shed, should sort the fuelling requirements

ustolemyname??stevieturbo

iTrader: (1)

Im not too sure whether the Apexi AFC will be able to compensate enough for the 550's, it is quite a big jump from 380cc, and you may run into difficulties, or more annoying, very high fuel consumption.
Im just guessing, but I may be wrong.

UkLegacyT

no, its a good point actually steve, hadnt thought of that.

the apexi can adjust standard fuelling by +/- 30%
would this be adequate? or is it best to use 440cc's ?

however, if using 440's, would this provide enough fuelling for a planned 350 - 400bhp?

UkLegacyT

would phase 2 rails and 440's bolt straight onto my phase 1 inlet?

David_Wallis

you need to make some brackets.. flat piece of metal.. drill a hole in one end and bolt that to manifold.. then fit rail and scribe around hole in the rail.. then remove bracket and drill and tap the bracket... I have some pics of mine to post up yet.. will be in diy fmic thread soon.

David

UkLegacyT

brackets shouldnt be a problem, so fairly straightforward swap then, makes a change!

im making a diy up-pipe on the weekend
started it, but busy at the minute

will look out on your thread for piccies, always follow it anyway.

ian

Pavlo

I wil be creating some base maps that are set up for 440 and 550 injectors soon enough.

Paul

UkLegacyT

keep us informed mate

David_Wallis

Friday Probably!

David

UkLegacyT

that soon!

excellent. will speak on sunday if you go to elvington david

paul, i presume you wont be at elvington due to the travelling distance??

ustolemyname??stevieturbo

iTrader: (1)

My old Apexi does seem to cope OK with the 440 cc's. However when adjusted so that it doesnt drink fuel at an incredible rate, there are flat spots. When adjusted so there are no flat spots, then it is very thirsty. Mine is just the old one, which only alters fuelling per revs. Yours may be better than mine if its the newer blue screen one.
I think I will go for an ecu eventually, when I get the money.
Fitting the Ph2 fuel rails is pretty straight forward.

David_Wallis

Dunno if im off to elvington... but paul is coming up to mine tonight and stopping until well lane... hence having a map for 550's

David

UkLegacyT

steve, yes mine are the newer blue screen controllers, they have loads of functions, so hopefully they will cope.
however, think i will wait until david/paul have done base maps, so hopefully after having that done, there shouldnt be any problems.

what sort of cost would there be to alter my base map to suit different injectors? (mail offline if you like)

ian

David_Wallis

YHM... Reply to home email though..

On hol. til monday now..

David