Jza

For online Gaming - for the PC - whats the minimum package i can get away with before it really sucks? 512k / 1mb / 2mb ???

Jza

RB5-Black

I run 512 and get ping's of 23-30 on my favourite ADSL guide servers running counterstrike.

I use BT Broaband but I would imagine any ISP's 512 wil be good for games.

Craig

Mr.Cookie

Jza

I think it's got more to do with out going bandwidth than incoming, my ntl is a 600k down but 128k up, think adsl fairs better on uploadafter that prolly comes down to how good your isp is.

Si

Daz34

The size of your pipe doesn't affect your ping.
Cable broadband gives lower pings than ADSL though.

Darren

ChrisB

Ping tells you latency, so it's pretty much the same thing (IMO).

Latency measures the delay between data leaving your PC and arriving at the server. A normal Ping tests that connection and returns a time in milliseconds to show the latency.

Chris_

Cant comment on any other game than Counterstrike but I used to have a 512 service from NTL and would get pings of about 25ms on a UK server. Updated to their 1meg service and still get pings of about the same.

Jye

Hmm in a gaming context I would have said latency is like flux, the average difference between pings to a particular server.

ASE reports this flux value and I always assumed this was the difference between having a low latency and a simple ping request.

spoiling corrected to sound as if I know what I'm talking about

[Edited by Jye - 11/13/2003 11:01:08 AM]

Jye

Founds this.

Ping v Latency

So you want to know what the difference is then eh - well, OK... but get ready to switch your brain into overdrive.

Many times people have referred Ping and Latency as being one and the same thing but in actual fact they are not. Many games refer to a "Ping" value when they are really talking about "Latency". I suspect that this is not because manufacturers don't know the difference but more that they are using terms which most gamers understand the general meaning of.

Background

Networks funtion because the manufacturers and all people involved in producing the bits for them agree to work to a common set of standards. These standards, referred to as the OSI Model (or OSI Stack) define what different components do what with the network - the model is split into Layers and each Layer is related to a different network function. As a result, the PING utility works at a different part of the OSI Model (in the lower levels) than the game running on your PC (which incidentally runs at the top of it). So, now that we are all well and truly confused....

Ping

Ping is a part of the TCP/IP suite and is used to test connectivity between devices running the IP protocol. It does this by sending ICMP packets to the destination machine and proves that the communications between the host and destination machines are working. The program sends 4 32byte data packets to the destination and measures the time taken for the destination machine to respond to each packet.

Latency

Latency is the term used to refer to the time a host application can commmunicate with a destination application. As the application in question sits at the top of the OSI stack and is the entity that responds to the communication between the two machines there is a delay in the response given compared to PING. PING works at the lower levels of the OSI model and therefore reponds sooner.

How it all fits together

You're playing a good old game of CounterStrike and your PC is talking to a server on the internet somewhere.

The CounterStrike game running on your machine is what is talking to the copy of CounterStrike running on the server - the two swap data backwards and forwards (in reality the data passes up and down the OSI Stack as it goes from your PC to the Server but you don't ever "see" this as such). As it has to undergo all these processes there is inevitably a small delay, though non that you would notice as such.

Assuming it was possible, if you PING that same server at the SAME TIME as you are measuring the CounterStrike "Ping", the response will be quicker as it's the Network layer of the OSI stack that responds - your machine doesn't even bother CounterStrike (which is sitting way up at the top of the OSI Stack).

This explains why a PING time will be lower than a Latency time.

Jye

I hate being right

Jye

Pity I cant spell latency though

ChrisB

Fair enough

I would say Ping is going to be a better measure of network / ISP performance though, as it doesn't go so far up the OSI model.

Jye

Ah, but the subject states 'online gaming' is the prime concern, and latency is still of more overall importance in gaming than just ping IMO.

The ISP Eclipse (a good gaming ISP IMO) states:

pc gaming

PC gaming has been around for a while, and so has Eclipse. We have been providing services to the gaming community for many years so we know that what we are offering is exactly what you need.

why choose Eclipse for your broadband service?

low, low latency

excellent ping rates

no port blocking or bandwidth limits

So this ISP 'does' feel low low latency is the way to go.

I will rest my case now for low low latency







[Edited by Jye - 11/13/2003 1:29:09 PM]

ChrisB

Agreed low everything is good, but an ISP can't control the latency added to the ping by the game server if they don't run it

Jye

Vote low everything then

ChrisB

I'd also agree that Eclipse are a good choice in terms of uptime and stablity of service.

Jye

Latancy is more important than ping and the quality of your ISP might reflect this.

All ADSL lines are asynchronious, i.e. more down than up, all ADSL lines are 256k up even if they are 1 or 2MB down.

SDSL costs mega bucks.

Contention ratios are another issue.

[Edited by Jye - 11/12/2003 4:30:55 PM]