Booger - Me Big End Has Gone...
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 16,980
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From: From far, far away...
There I was, minding my own business & I heard this horrible rattling sound.
So I slowed right down, indicated, pulled off the road & into a garage. Turned the engine off.
The really big bugger about this was that it happened at the begining of my 2nd of 6 sessions @ Brands Hatch
Not a happy bunny
Big thanks to Richard Askew for the tow, Gossy & others for advice, help &noffers of assistance
PTMW! will be back soon
So I slowed right down, indicated, pulled off the road & into a garage. Turned the engine off.
The really big bugger about this was that it happened at the begining of my 2nd of 6 sessions @ Brands Hatch
Not a happy bunny
Big thanks to Richard Askew for the tow, Gossy & others for advice, help &noffers of assistance
PTMW! will be back soon
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Scooby Regular
Joined: Apr 2003
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Sorry to hear that Puff, me and a mate came to watch and were standing up in the big stand for most of the day. I was watching you close as I have a wagon too and I wondered where you had gone, look on the bright side you could have been Magnum P.I. spreading oil and most of your engine around half the track(bet he was popular). What happend to the wheel on that escort? anyway hope you get it fixed soon. It was a great day even as a spectator, maybe Ill have a go next time.
Cheese....
Cheese....
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 16,980
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From: From far, far away...
PTMW! will be back & yes I did console myself that I wasn't the owner of that Ferrari 
It wasn't the one, however, that went past me like I was sitting still
2.5 would be nice but as the money for repair will be coming out of my garage fund, I want to be able to have a roof over PTMW! when fixed
However, a select few mods may happen during the rebuild - if nothing else a new clutch (if needed) seeing as the engine will be out - 77k miles on OE with trackdays & 1/4s
Otherwise, we'll see...
Dave - YHM
The Escort has (had) Grp A drive shafts, which are hollow. The NSR sheered straight off They are meant to be be stonger/more reliable but this is the 2nd to go for that owner...
AA took 3 hours to get me on the back of a flatbed
Otherwise, PTMW! was driving well & I'd been just begining to concentrate on getting my lines sorted. For some reason, I hadn't been totally relaxed on the start of the 2nd sesh & they were all over the place
I'd been getting a wee bit of u/steer as well, which is unusual. The cage made PTMW! seem well planted and I was very happy with it.
Sorry to POC/Gossy et al who'd wanted pass laps - next time
(& you never know might be a tad faster
)
It wasn't the one, however, that went past me like I was sitting still
2.5 would be nice but as the money for repair will be coming out of my garage fund, I want to be able to have a roof over PTMW! when fixed
However, a select few mods may happen during the rebuild - if nothing else a new clutch (if needed) seeing as the engine will be out - 77k miles on OE with trackdays & 1/4s
Otherwise, we'll see...
Dave - YHM
The Escort has (had) Grp A drive shafts, which are hollow. The NSR sheered straight off
They are meant to be be stonger/more reliable but this is the 2nd to go for that owner...AA took 3 hours to get me on the back of a flatbed
Otherwise, PTMW! was driving well & I'd been just begining to concentrate on getting my lines sorted. For some reason, I hadn't been totally relaxed on the start of the 2nd sesh & they were all over the place
I'd been getting a wee bit of u/steer as well, which is unusual. The cage made PTMW! seem well planted and I was very happy with it.Sorry to POC/Gossy et al who'd wanted pass laps - next time
(& you never know might be a tad faster
)
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 38,078
Likes: 310
From: The hell where youth and laughter go
Bad news puff
Anyone know what is causing UK turbos to end up like this? I heard all the speculation...just never had anyone to make a statement with a definite fact (that is plausible).
Still, it does me a favour...stops me from spending money on mods in paranoia that said engine will go boom (even if the bottom end has only done 12k)
Anyone know what is causing UK turbos to end up like this? I heard all the speculation...just never had anyone to make a statement with a definite fact (that is plausible).
Still, it does me a favour...stops me from spending money on mods in paranoia that said engine will go boom (even if the bottom end has only done 12k
)
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 16,980
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From: From far, far away...
Whats that then Mart?
The engine had covered 77K miles & 1st reg July 99 with 1 owner/driver. The car has been religeously serviced according to schedule, all bar 2 @ main dealers (60K which included Cambelt & 75K)
The only engine mods were a PPP (zhorst, piping, ecu), so hardly stressed like some other engines with 340+ on standard UK internals. SECS recorded 6900 max RPM (so before limiter) during the sessions & max boost of 1.27 bar. No ECU warnings came up.
It would also be fair to say that I am recognised/known as a smooth and mechanically sympathetic driver, so it would be hard to consider that the big end had gone through abuse and over modification from design specifications and expectations.
The engine had covered 77K miles & 1st reg July 99 with 1 owner/driver. The car has been religeously serviced according to schedule, all bar 2 @ main dealers (60K which included Cambelt & 75K)
The only engine mods were a PPP (zhorst, piping, ecu), so hardly stressed like some other engines with 340+ on standard UK internals. SECS recorded 6900 max RPM (so before limiter) during the sessions & max boost of 1.27 bar. No ECU warnings came up.
It would also be fair to say that I am recognised/known as a smooth and mechanically sympathetic driver, so it would be hard to consider that the big end had gone through abuse and over modification from design specifications and expectations.
Scooby Regular
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Weird stuff Puff ...
I was there & saw it happen, you were doing very smooth laps, certainly not stressing or ragging the engine, it was damp/slippery, all went well, then suddenly "rattle of death".
So illogical. So weird.
I'm thinking about a good way to start a new thread about this, calling all people to arms that should know (and they are out there) what is happening with these engines. Let's forget "N°3" (it's not), in fact, we should forget all previous speculation full stop. Oil, high speed cooling probs, fuel pressure, let's throw that away and start from scratch.
It won't help you, but DJ was just pointing out to me that you are indeed a very smooth driver when suddenly you came past the paddock and the car sounded like a bag of nails...
We should finally, after so many years, get to the bottom of this.
Theo
PS: nice seeing you in the flesh, you are as ugly as I imagined, but I guess that goes both ways
I was there & saw it happen, you were doing very smooth laps, certainly not stressing or ragging the engine, it was damp/slippery, all went well, then suddenly "rattle of death".
So illogical. So weird.
I'm thinking about a good way to start a new thread about this, calling all people to arms that should know (and they are out there) what is happening with these engines. Let's forget "N°3" (it's not), in fact, we should forget all previous speculation full stop. Oil, high speed cooling probs, fuel pressure, let's throw that away and start from scratch.
It won't help you, but DJ was just pointing out to me that you are indeed a very smooth driver when suddenly you came past the paddock and the car sounded like a bag of nails...
We should finally, after so many years, get to the bottom of this.
Theo
PS: nice seeing you in the flesh, you are as ugly as I imagined, but I guess that goes both ways
Scooby Regular
Joined: Nov 2000
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From: 32 cylinders and many cats
SECS would show 1.27 bar even if the real boost is far higher - it clips at 1.27 bar and this is overboost really for a PPP. With the ignition timing used on the PPP map this could easily cause detonation. This means you were at least 0.19 bar over PPP's boost target. On a hot track when the EGTs get high the turbo can get very frisky and cause overboost. When running boost controllers at over 1.2 bar with (decat) PPP at Knockhill on plain Optimax, it started detting. The decat may help or hinder the det through various mechanisms.
Det avoidance is the one big reason the big power tuned engines tend to stay together. However, I am not saying the only cause of failure is detonation by no means.
[Edited by john banks - 11/11/2003 4:02:48 PM]
Det avoidance is the one big reason the big power tuned engines tend to stay together. However, I am not saying the only cause of failure is detonation by no means.
[Edited by john banks - 11/11/2003 4:02:48 PM]
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 38,078
Likes: 310
From: The hell where youth and laughter go
Good Idea Theo.
Personally, my 2p is it's either: poor bearing material quality, Oil surge, pressure leakage, or some sort of flow problem.
[Edited by ALi-B - 11/11/2003 4:03:21 PM]
Personally, my 2p is it's either: poor bearing material quality, Oil surge, pressure leakage, or some sort of flow problem.
[Edited by ALi-B - 11/11/2003 4:03:21 PM]