dnc

I think this is the key point, though I would hesitate with the word status. These people are more interested in having a dog of certain breed/status than the safety of any offspring. Their inadequacy in actually looking after the dog compounds the problem. Calling the dog KILLER says it all really.

Gives a bad name to responsible owners of what can be lovely dogs. I remember a work placement when I was a student and my landlady had an American pitbull (long time ago ) and I was bloody petrified of it when I first met it. The dog's musculature was incredible. She was actually soft as ****e and was very friendly (well looked after ), but I would never countenance having children around it (and neither did the landlady) as you just knew the damage it was capable of. Although I got to know and like the dog a lot, I was still always a little wary around her.

Mouser

Do the police suspect the mother and boyfriend may have more to do with this tragedy than meets the eye by initially charging the pair with manslaughter or is this normal practice? Not one for conspiracy theories btw.

LVC

I have a 3cm scar under my right eye from "sitting" on a cat when I was a baby (I was lucky it missed the eye) - bad kitty, lol

It's horrific to learn how many babies are suffocated from cats sleeping on their heads/faces. The cat searches the warm and the baby doesn't have the strength to push it off and ends up suffocating - I've 2 cats and we always make sure that they are not in the baby's room before closing the door for the baby to sleep.

It still shocks me the number of people in the UK with "big" dogs that live in flats or small houses. A dog of any size needs space to exercise and not just a 10 minute walk around the local park - no wonder dogs go stir crazy being confined to small spaces. My 2 have the run of 7 hectares (about 17 acres) and this keeps them fit and allows them to let off steam. I wouldn't dream of having a big dog (let alone 2) without adequate space for them.

stipete75

I think that is a big part of the problem with regards to going stir crazy!
Dogs of all breeds need constant stimulation from lots of play,lots of walks,lots of fuss ect.
Mine go out separately daily, and on a Saturday they go out together with family(if not wet) we have a fairly big house with a big garden.
We are very strict with rules regarding them but we all love our dogs, they are family to us and we like to spoil them all.

RA Dunk

Hmm, you sat on a cat and it scratched you, and it's the cats fault?

ok then.

Cats have smothered babies accidentaly, but that's a far cry from mauling them to death on purpose.

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Well they ARE a fighting dog and bread specifically for aggression/ tenacity and independence, but most people see them as a cute little dog but in fact they are very vicious and indeed dangerous if not handled properly.

Even when handled properly they are still very unpredictable, I had two and had one (male) put down after he went for my son (unprovoked) fortunately as I never left him alone with the dogs I was right there.

Nothing happening my son sat on a toy car in the living room and the dog just went for him, must have been 5mm away from tearing a chunk out of his face, so close in fact I thought he'd got him, but the shock of the dog suddenly leaping at him made him fall off the car and the dog missed at which point I already had the still going for it dog by the neck.

The dog was always happy, obedient, stimulated walked twice a day, very well trained through a local well respected school that we'd gone to as a family since he was a very small pup, still have all the certificates from almost 3yrs of weekly sessions, my son would get him to sit and give him treats and always involved in everything, dog was bought when my son was 18 months old because I wanted them to grow up together and be playmates etc and thought a nice Jack Russell wouldn't be too big for him to play with.

Moral of the story, no matter how well trained, socialised well balanced your dog is, DO NOT LEAVE IT ALONE WITH KIDS full stop....

I did everything and more with that dog and it came very close to disfiguring my son for life, but a week after I had him put down, which was a difficult decision to make and part of me still regrets it, but I wasn't going to pass on a dog that may attack another child without warning and I certainly wasn't going to let him have the opportunity to do it again to my son.

And yes I cried like a baby at the vets, and still feel bad about to this day.

Martin2005

I’m sure that in most instances of dog attack it is the owners that are to blame.What I still can’t reconcile is; with so many breeds of dog available, why do people choose to get breeds with aggressive images, muscular physiques and powerful jaws?

hodgy0_2

they are actually bred to take on rats (ratters)

and anyone who has seen rat cornered will know that you have to be pretty fvcking hard and aggressive to take it on

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Foxes is what they were actually bred to take on, the clue is in the name Parsons Jack Russell, they just happen to be good at killing full stop, what led us to get one was my wife was heavily involved with horses as a girl/young woman and they were always popular around the Hunt stables she learned her trade at, but they could also hold their own with a pack of hounds.

Edit to add; read up on it, it's quite interesting.

Chip

Yes it's the same with guns isn't it. They're fine til some idiot decides to kill with one.

hodgy0_2

i stand corrected - my sister had one for about 15 years, it was like a daughter to her

but can be a bit yappy - but deffo tough little things

my Wife is getting a little "doggy" at the moment - looking at Sprolly's

ReallyReallyGoodMeat

+1

ReallyReallyGoodMeat

A simple 'yes' would have done

stipete75

Didn't think a "simple yes" would merit your concerns over my potential body art on a topic over dog breeds

LVC

No, never said it was the cat's fault, entirely mine - merely highlighting that even little kitties can cause serious wounds and leaving pets and young children together unattended can possibly be fatal

We had a Cocker Spaniel as a family dog and wouldn't have chosen anything else. Read up on all sorts of dogs but the Cocker came highly recommended and in the 12 years we had him he never once showed any signs of being anything other than loving towards kids (mine and other peoples) - hopeless guard dog though. I don't understand why someone would buy a family pet that is breed for killing/fighting: Jack Russells, Rotis, Staffs, etc. - timebomb IMHO.

GSDs can be aggressive yes 100% but they were bred for herd protection and their instinct for protecting their "pack" is very, very strong - this is extremely evident when a stranger approaches one of my sons. Had my 2 before the new baby arrived but would certainly not have got them if the baby had been around first, even as herding dogs the risk is too high.

There's no rules on what type of dog people are drawn towards but it's a bit like buying a motorbike as family transport, need to be a bit practical about things. Too many dogs are status symbols nowadays which is a real shame and those that buy them for this reason rarely have the 1st idea of how to train them properly and thus their reputations continue to go down the pan

urban

iTrader: (1)

Isn't it just.

You wouldn't allow any dog to be alone with a baby.

stipete75

There are nearly 9million dogs in the uk,resulting in 17 very unfortunate mauling deaths since 2005! Every death still appalling and not excusable.
On a different note this is just a tiny drop in the ocean compared to the millions of innocent women and children maimed and killed in the illegal wars on terror prompted by ours and the US governments. Yet no one bats an eyelid.
The media circus machine has brainwashed everyone lol

Martin2005

Millions?
Illegal?
No one bats an eyelid?
Brainwashed?

This is all just deflective nonsense.

stipete75

Yes!
Yes!
Yes!
As just proved yes!

This is all reality

Martin2005

You do realise that just because you say 'yes' and give me the that doesn't actually make it true?

Oh and how has 'nobody bats an eyelid' 'just been proven'?

ReallyReallyGoodMeat

I think stipete is using the Chewbacca defense here.

stipete75

If you believe that men/women in high positions of power are not capable of criminal activity and telling lies to the general public, Then obviously I'm talking sh&te.
Brainwashed= proved.

stipete75

I don't watch south park.

ReallyReallyGoodMeat

In a nutshell, bringing the Iraq/Afghan war into a dangerous-dogs debate makes no sense.

BTW the figures you quote are at odds with here: http://blogs.channel4.com/factcheck/...-attacks/17727 ... which states that according to the ONS there's been 27 deaths since 2006. Between 2-4 a year.

And I notice you have chosen to ignore Martin's question about breed choice.

stipete75

So does bringing tattoos in to a dog debate.

stipete75

Sorry didn't realise martins question about breed choice was directed at me, I didn't see my name anywhere.

ReallyReallyGoodMeat

Perhaps not, though given you are an owner of such a dog(s) and are obviously active on this thread you are well placed to comment?

As for the tattoo question, yes it was irrelevant to the discussion, hence I didn't use it to defend any argument, unlike your Iraq war diversion.

LVC

Personally, I live in rural France on a 7 hectare farm and used to breed thoroughbred Arabian Horses - the GSD when well trained provides an excellent deterrent against undesirables entering the property as well as a very useful training aid for the horses (acclimatisation to startling and fearful situations).

I recall the question being asked in a documentary of an IC3 living on an UK estate with a staffie, his reply was along the lines of that the dog is a replacement for a gun and people know "not to mess with him" as he has a "well ard dog". Definitely an ego massager and compensator for "something" having a strong, aggressive looking dog in his case.

Other than that I would assume that it boils down to choice and preference. We see a lot of "toy dogs" in the cities and plenty of Jacks and Fox terriers along with the standard hunt dog in the rural areas. The French seem to chose their dogs for purpose and not just "image".

urban

iTrader: (1)

Why is it that its usually a "thug type" looking person on the end of a pleb dog's lead?

Martin2005

I absolutely do believe they are capable of all sorts of things, but that's not really the point.

I just take issue with your bold, baseless proclomations.

To say 'nobody' is exercised by recent wars just make you whole argument look ridiculous.

If you asked a 100 people how they felt about these issues, I bet that there would be far more people agree with your position than mine...far more in fact. So how is it possoble for you to say 'NOBODY bats and eyelid'? Do you not remember 2 million people marching through the centre of London?

Back to dogs - I love dogs and have no real issues here, I'm just curious of the decision making process people go through when deciding what dog to get, how do you end up with a Rottie instead of a Spaniel, or Lab?