Bought a clocked Impreza
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 11,778
Likes: 4
From: Newcastle. 330bhp-289lb/ft @ 1bar boost - 12.4s @ 105mph
Stick a new engine in it , take it back to him , and sell it to him as a Subaru with just delivery mileage . Wonder what he'd say to that ?
Sounds like its a trading standards job , judging by his replies.
Sounds like its a trading standards job , judging by his replies.
Thing is though it seems it was clocked well before the garage sold it so he could also have bought it like this so he is not to blame regarding the mileage discrepancy in my opinion.
Either way I hope you get it sorted. Car is 15 years old so even 180k is average mileage realistically. Dont be fooled by some 'fresh imports' showing the magical 60k on the clocks :-) I'd buy on condition and the way it drives rather than what the clocks show on any car of that age..!
Raf
Either way I hope you get it sorted. Car is 15 years old so even 180k is average mileage realistically. Dont be fooled by some 'fresh imports' showing the magical 60k on the clocks :-) I'd buy on condition and the way it drives rather than what the clocks show on any car of that age..!
Raf
swaynie
i bought a red audi a3 from this adam guy.normally i buy from enthusiasts but,could not find a wine red with grey leather until i spied the one i have now from eyuk motors
on the 1st visit i pointed out quite a few paint issues that did get done even though i did pay a little extra for it to be done.
cambelt showed a recent change which was a false stamp
a wheel bearing was noisy and adam said they had changed the rear pair.a service later showed that they had not been done and it was a front bearing that was at fault.he did give me 100 pounds back as the noise was still there.mind it took a few calls to get it back in my account
was promised 12months mot and a full interior valet.didnt do the mot saying it had several months left and didnt have time for the valet
i took the car as i live 4hrs away was late at night so couldnt get a train back .to get the car up to my expected level has cost me a further 1k to put right.as you he says i sold the car in good faith and was sorry that i was unhappy with the service provided.on a final note i did look at several cars and all needed some work as im a faddy t*at.not really sure if im just moaning to moan though
i bought a red audi a3 from this adam guy.normally i buy from enthusiasts but,could not find a wine red with grey leather until i spied the one i have now from eyuk motors
on the 1st visit i pointed out quite a few paint issues that did get done even though i did pay a little extra for it to be done.
cambelt showed a recent change which was a false stamp
a wheel bearing was noisy and adam said they had changed the rear pair.a service later showed that they had not been done and it was a front bearing that was at fault.he did give me 100 pounds back as the noise was still there.mind it took a few calls to get it back in my account
was promised 12months mot and a full interior valet.didnt do the mot saying it had several months left and didnt have time for the valet
i took the car as i live 4hrs away was late at night so couldnt get a train back .to get the car up to my expected level has cost me a further 1k to put right.as you he says i sold the car in good faith and was sorry that i was unhappy with the service provided.on a final note i did look at several cars and all needed some work as im a faddy t*at.not really sure if im just moaning to moan though
Last edited by rsdub; Dec 28, 2013 at 11:42 PM.
There's a right way of doing it if you want your money back.
I'm in the same sort of position with a evo 9 I bought 3 weeks or so ago.
Stop the contact with the trader if he's being a d1ck.
Send a recorded letter (track and trace) to him refusing the car on whatever grounds...not fit for purpose blah blah blah...loads you can print off on trading standards/cab.....give him 7 days for a full refund.
Go to county court grab 3x claim forms and fill them in 100% honest incase he fobs you off (the trader I'm after has tried saying he will take 20% off purchase price to refund me....bell end)
You are on a time limit to reject the car so sitting around doing f all will go against you
Not sure what it will cost you to stick him in court it's £245 for me but you claim it back at the same time.
Threatening to ram it through his windows/googling his home address will only result in the old bill knocking on your door
I'm in the same sort of position with a evo 9 I bought 3 weeks or so ago.
Stop the contact with the trader if he's being a d1ck.
Send a recorded letter (track and trace) to him refusing the car on whatever grounds...not fit for purpose blah blah blah...loads you can print off on trading standards/cab.....give him 7 days for a full refund.
Go to county court grab 3x claim forms and fill them in 100% honest incase he fobs you off (the trader I'm after has tried saying he will take 20% off purchase price to refund me....bell end)
You are on a time limit to reject the car so sitting around doing f all will go against you
Not sure what it will cost you to stick him in court it's £245 for me but you claim it back at the same time.
Threatening to ram it through his windows/googling his home address will only result in the old bill knocking on your door
Scooby Regular
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 1,014
Likes: 0
From: Where It Rains A Lot.
You should be able to start this process online. Do it as soon as you get stonewalled by the seller. It's up to you whether you bother to tell him or not.
He'll find out soon enough!
He'll find out soon enough!
Last edited by Twin Fields; Dec 29, 2013 at 09:55 AM.
Speaking as a motor trader myself there are some good points in here and the trader in question is a fool for not refunding such a small amount of money!!
Personally I refund around 2 or 3 cars a year if something starts going completely wrong as it avoids serious problems that would probably result in a refund anyway.
As the law stands you have more rights buying a used car than a house, ridiculous but true!
Firstly don't go down the 'I'll give you a slap route'........this only makes you look like an idiot and could possibly result in a return of gesture if some other unhappy customer sent someone around there
The facts (please correct me if I'm wrong) the car was advertised with 118k yet you accepted it with 128k. The car has run at least 180k, as long as you have proof of the accumulation of mileages (just one discrepancy could be regarded as a typo) then you are home and dry.
Motor traders can get slammed for selling a clocked car as they are deemed to be 'professionals' and in the eyes of the law should know better after all if you've discovered this fraud then the motor trader would also have easy access to this information. I sell mine not only with HPI mileage checks but also with MoT history printouts so I can then say well I've done all I can. I've been caught with clocked cars on several occasions but as a previous poster has mentioned you can sell these cars as long as you tell the purchaser and also indicate this clearly on the receipt.
Personally I'd send proof of the discrepancy plus a letter of your intentions to the dealer via Recorded Delivery.
Give him say 7 days to respond or you'll go to Trading Standards with your proof ie. Original ad and your proof of the mileage alteration along with copies of any correspondence between yourself and the seller.
If there is enough evidence there he would not only have to refund in full but would then possibly end up in court with a fine higher than the price of the car...........to me that'd be a no brainer!!
As I said I'm a dealer who's been around for the last 14 years or so and this is just my personal opinion, I'm not a lawyer but nor have I ever had a vist from trading standards or been taken to court so we are not all rogues
Personally I refund around 2 or 3 cars a year if something starts going completely wrong as it avoids serious problems that would probably result in a refund anyway.
As the law stands you have more rights buying a used car than a house, ridiculous but true!
Firstly don't go down the 'I'll give you a slap route'........this only makes you look like an idiot and could possibly result in a return of gesture if some other unhappy customer sent someone around there
The facts (please correct me if I'm wrong) the car was advertised with 118k yet you accepted it with 128k. The car has run at least 180k, as long as you have proof of the accumulation of mileages (just one discrepancy could be regarded as a typo) then you are home and dry.
Motor traders can get slammed for selling a clocked car as they are deemed to be 'professionals' and in the eyes of the law should know better after all if you've discovered this fraud then the motor trader would also have easy access to this information. I sell mine not only with HPI mileage checks but also with MoT history printouts so I can then say well I've done all I can. I've been caught with clocked cars on several occasions but as a previous poster has mentioned you can sell these cars as long as you tell the purchaser and also indicate this clearly on the receipt.
Personally I'd send proof of the discrepancy plus a letter of your intentions to the dealer via Recorded Delivery.
Give him say 7 days to respond or you'll go to Trading Standards with your proof ie. Original ad and your proof of the mileage alteration along with copies of any correspondence between yourself and the seller.
If there is enough evidence there he would not only have to refund in full but would then possibly end up in court with a fine higher than the price of the car...........to me that'd be a no brainer!!
As I said I'm a dealer who's been around for the last 14 years or so and this is just my personal opinion, I'm not a lawyer but nor have I ever had a vist from trading standards or been taken to court so we are not all rogues
In my opinion I would definitely go for a 100% refund... The dealer sounds like a complete tool and if he has lied about the mileage then what else has he bodged up and not told you about etc...
New mots come with the last 4 years of milages.to help confirm history etc hopefully there s
not a typo from the mot tester.iv done it before!!
But sounds like a cowboy!
Hope it gets sorted
Esp ltd nice to hear there are some decent traders out there!!
Hope it gets sorted!!
not a typo from the mot tester.iv done it before!!
But sounds like a cowboy!
Hope it gets sorted
Esp ltd nice to hear there are some decent traders out there!!
Hope it gets sorted!!
There's a right way of doing it if you want your money back.
I'm in the same sort of position with a evo 9 I bought 3 weeks or so ago.
Stop the contact with the trader if he's being a d1ck.
Send a recorded letter (track and trace) to him refusing the car on whatever grounds...not fit for purpose blah blah blah...loads you can print off on trading standards/cab.....give him 7 days for a full refund.
Go to county court grab 3x claim forms and fill them in 100% honest incase he fobs you off (the trader I'm after has tried saying he will take 20% off purchase price to refund me....bell end)
You are on a time limit to reject the car so sitting around doing f all will go against you
Not sure what it will cost you to stick him in court it's £245 for me but you claim it back at the same time.
Threatening to ram it through his windows/googling his home address will only result in the old bill knocking on your door
I'm in the same sort of position with a evo 9 I bought 3 weeks or so ago.
Stop the contact with the trader if he's being a d1ck.
Send a recorded letter (track and trace) to him refusing the car on whatever grounds...not fit for purpose blah blah blah...loads you can print off on trading standards/cab.....give him 7 days for a full refund.
Go to county court grab 3x claim forms and fill them in 100% honest incase he fobs you off (the trader I'm after has tried saying he will take 20% off purchase price to refund me....bell end)
You are on a time limit to reject the car so sitting around doing f all will go against you
Not sure what it will cost you to stick him in court it's £245 for me but you claim it back at the same time.
Threatening to ram it through his windows/googling his home address will only result in the old bill knocking on your door
I bought a car from Dave @ ESP and he's the only motor trader/retailer I'd ever trust, he's totally honest and very helpful.
He's given good advice and he's got a brilliant reputation for customer service.
He's given good advice and he's got a brilliant reputation for customer service.
I have the past mot's and done a online check through dvla the cars mileage in 2005 was 120k, 2006 130k. Adam has replied saying he cannot help so I'll be contacting the police advice line today.
The car does have a hpi check and the engine numbers from the car match. So I don't know wether it's the original engine or not.
The car does have a hpi check and the engine numbers from the car match. So I don't know wether it's the original engine or not.
Scooby Regular
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,794
Likes: 0
From: Wales
Imo a lot of good advice here, almost 'advice overload'.
I think the op needs to plan things out since embarking on one course of action produces particular consequences,a nd another action goes down a different path.
The dealer is wrong to say it's not a police matter.
He'd be prosecuted under the Sale of Goods Act (and related legislation), which IS criminal, not civil.
And of course Civil Action can be taken in the County ('Small Claims') Court.
However the necessary 'letter before action', explaining why you think the dealer's been deficient, your losses etc. should give 30 days notice ie. sufficient time for the defendent to address the matter. The system is there to prevent actions as far as possible, and avoid clogging up the courts.
As someone said, you can initiate the whole thing online.
Take a look at this, a very helpful guide to the process and requirements.
http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/englan...all_claims.htm
It also has a link to the court system website (which is also very helpful).
As I've said, plan exactly what you are going to do, including the possible consequences.
Eg. if you take it to Trading Standards you'll be at the mercy of their handling of the matter ie. any civil claim you make might be held up by criminal proceedings.
Also, what is the legal status of the dealership eg. is it a Limited Company?
This has a big bearing on how you might want to proceed imo.
Lastly, good luck.
Fwiw I think you've done the right thing showing that you know a little more than he thinks the average mug does (for he seems to take his customers that way).
I think the op needs to plan things out since embarking on one course of action produces particular consequences,a nd another action goes down a different path.
The dealer is wrong to say it's not a police matter.
He'd be prosecuted under the Sale of Goods Act (and related legislation), which IS criminal, not civil.
And of course Civil Action can be taken in the County ('Small Claims') Court.
However the necessary 'letter before action', explaining why you think the dealer's been deficient, your losses etc. should give 30 days notice ie. sufficient time for the defendent to address the matter. The system is there to prevent actions as far as possible, and avoid clogging up the courts.
As someone said, you can initiate the whole thing online.
Take a look at this, a very helpful guide to the process and requirements.
http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/englan...all_claims.htm
It also has a link to the court system website (which is also very helpful).
As I've said, plan exactly what you are going to do, including the possible consequences.
Eg. if you take it to Trading Standards you'll be at the mercy of their handling of the matter ie. any civil claim you make might be held up by criminal proceedings.
Also, what is the legal status of the dealership eg. is it a Limited Company?
This has a big bearing on how you might want to proceed imo.
Lastly, good luck.
Fwiw I think you've done the right thing showing that you know a little more than he thinks the average mug does (for he seems to take his customers that way).
I had a visit from my local force over what I threatened to do....within 2 hours of a phonecall ...I personally have to tread careful due to a mis spent childhood and now have shotgun grant
This is the 1st time I've been in a situation where I have to do things the 'proper' way....and so far all seems to be simple going the legal route
Dealers have to give a 30 day warranty iirc. But I'm not after warranty work. If he acknowledged his error and offered to even put the cost if the car to 1k. Or offer to pay for any work that needs doing in a 12 month period.
I got a foc 6 month independent warranty and was told to make a claim via those when he knows full well the warranty company won't touch it for the first month.
I wouldn't be this calm if I needed the car every day...it was more of a weekend toy so I can stand it going to court
So if I have a full engine build using new parts, I can reset my mileage to 0, drive it to the garage you bought the car from, and ask for £20k+ as my car would be basically a brand new car STi???
I can guess what the garage would say to me!!!
I can guess what the garage would say to me!!!
It has a split steering gaiter new part on order. Central locking didn't work but does now. Speakers didn't work correctly now do. The coolant was grey and full of rad weld to cover up a bad metal pipe now fixed and coolant changed. Leaking bov now removed and have a replacement system. The turbo was only boosting at at wastegate pressure now boosts properly as it should. Sorted out the drivers window as it didn't seal properly. Finally the drivers side caliper pad retainers was loose and could have been fatal now fixed.
