ScoobyWon't

£650 and I'd have to build it myself? I think I'd prefer to save the ~£200, plus the build time and just plug a console in to the tv and start playing.

Beef

That's just it - you won't save the £200. If you said £40 for online fees for one year only, the other £160 is wiped out in less than a dozen purchases. Faster if you take advantage of the many steam sales or humble bundle, etc etc

Building it yourself isn't especially demanding, not if you know how to use a screwdriver, and there are many guides that will help.

Once you have it built, you then have 20+ years of backwards compatibility and thousands of titles from day one, and all of them will look better than their console counterpart.

Brun

How many people play old games though?

chrisowe

Plus there's games you can't get on the PC. GTA V for one.

Beef

Depends what you call old - titles like Skyrim, or TF2, or Civ V are a couple of years old, yet you would be able to play them on a PC the day you got it. With a console you're restricted to waiting for them to release it on the new console - if they ever do...

Beef

All the previous GTA's were released on PC after 6 months or so. No reason to expect different this time round.

I'm not sure what your point is. It's a bit like pointing out Mass Effect 1 wasn't initially released on PS3.

Geezer

Hang on, are you saying that the install of a PC game is less than a Console game? That simply is not true! The update process is a no brainer, it tells you it needs it, it does it, you play. The same be true for PC games now, but please explain how it is better? Games 'just work' on a console.....

Look better? Yes, play better? No. Plenty of gorgeous looking games that are rubbish. GFX ain't everything. I accept it's better to have a great games that looks good too, but at what price?

£700 Will decimate next gen consoles. OK, let's look at that statement for a minute. Will they play the game? Yes. Will it look better? Yes. Will it play Battle death x in 6 years time? No. Will a console still be playing the latest games, unchanged in 6 years? Yes.

The current gen came out in 2006, and 7 years later, you can still play the latest games on them. They look good enough too. If you wanted to play the latest games on a PC, you'd have to upgrade at least twice in that time period, so any benefit in games prices is soon negated. You only pay top dollar for new games on console, older titles or second hand is cheap.

I have been there, it make no financial sense at all. Like I say, if you prefer PC gaming, that is justification enough, but not much else is.

Hell, even my die hard PC gamer friend at work who has seemingly bottomless pockets admits as much now and is getting sick of justifying the upgrades.

Do you really need BF4 at 120fps in stupid high resolution when you can get it in perfectly good resolution and a useable frame rate on a box costing a third of the price?

I know which one makes more sense.

The only thing still in PC favour is online, and that is dwindling.

Geezer

Actually that is not true, lots of games designed for earlier version of Windows will not play on Win 7 or 8, or it's an absolute ballache to do.

I had some which my son wanted to try on the PC, but I lost the will to live trying to get them to work. I accept that some older titles will and that PS2 games, for example, will not play at all on PS3, but for your average Joe, it makes no difference, they simply won't do it.

But, I can happily play Doom from the PS1 on my PS3!

Beef

To be honest, while it's not quite as slick as that yet, it's far, far closer to that than you're making it out to be. Many drivers will be included in Windows Update these days, and Steam will automatically patch any installed games to the latest version as soon as patches are released.

PC has advantages too; no such thing as 'sold out' on release day, and games can pre-load in the background in advance, meaning you can play a game on release day at 00:01 without even having to leave the house.

But why not both? We've already established that a PC isn't significantly more expensive over time than a console, and any title that has a PC release will look better than it's console counterpart.

As for gameplay, even when you think it should be the same as it's the same actual game, the PC version will usually offer benefits; examples are more players in a single online match (64 players in BF3 PC vs 24 [IIRC] for BF3 console), and the option of a more precise and accurate control system.

Why won't it play games 6 years hence? I have a laptop with integrated Intel HD3000 graphics, which performance wise puts it on a par with an 8600 GTS, which is also a 6-year-old GPU. That same laptop has a dual-core i5-2540M, which is also comparable to 6-year-old CPUs such as the Q6700

8600 GTS: http://goo.gl/oFN6pf
HD 3000: http://goo.gl/85y6EU
Q6700: http://goo.gl/ajCwcm
i5-2540M: http://goo.gl/usWrni

All of the 2007-era components would have been in a mid-range even when new, so probably not far out from that £700 price point.

On this laptop I still play modern games when overnight on business; Civ V, Skyrim, Deus Ex: HR, Bioshock, etc. Sure, I have to turn the detail settings to low and resolution down, but guess what - so does the current gen of consoles; very few console games are rendered above 720p, and detail settings are cut down considerably for the latest titles.

A list of rendering resolutions is here: http://goo.gl/6sD3Gj

"Good enough" is only true because you've lost sight of just how far behind the state of the art consoles have fallen; it's like saying that DVD quality is good enough because you've never experienced Full HD.

I've also just proven above how you don't have to keep upgrading simply to play the latest titles - upgrades are if you want to play at a higher level of quality, but like everything else with PC gaming, it's a choice, you don't have to do it.

But even if you say that you will spend the money you saved on games on hardware upgrades, what's not to like? For the same amount of total expenditure over time, you have is the same number of games but on a much, much more powerful system that can play at a true 1080p/60FPS with all the detail settings cranked up high - and that £400 budget for joining the 'Next Gen' can then take that upgraded system and enhance it to performance beyond what the XB1/PS4 will deliver even on day one.

In which case I would question either the wisdom of his upgrade choices, or the metric by which he is judging his performance. I built a system in mid-2011 which has only had a single game that I had to reduce the detail settings from 'Ultra' to 'Very High' (Bioshock Infinite), but that's because my performance target is 1080p @ 60fps. Less than £200 would pump me back up to 'Ultra' land with plenty of headroom to spare.

If he's playing at 1600p @ 120fps then yes, of course he's going to spend more - but then he's moving 4 times the pixels per frame even before the high framerate and enhanced graphical effects are applied. 1080p @ 60fps gaming is achievable on a very moderate budget, as I have repeatedly shown.

This is what it comes down to; if you think that 720p and 30fps is acceptable then keep your PS3/X360 and/or buy a Wii U. Either you are satisfied with low resolutions and framerate and feel no need to upgrade, or you're not - in which case, for only a little extra expenditure over a 'next gen' console (not 3x as you claim) you could have proper 1080p and 60fps and enhanced details.

I agree, and it's not the one with a Sony/Microsoft badge on the front.

PC gaming isn't in danger. PC gaming is the danger.

Beef

Most games bought through Steam will work without further intervention; I played through Dark Forces the other month on my laptop having done nothing more than 'download and run'.

You also have GOG.com, which takes even troublesome older games and packages them in such a way that they 'Just work' on Windows 7/Windows 8. DRM-free and very cheap prices:

http://www.gog.com/

So again, you have 20+ years of backwards compatibility available to you.

Fancy a game of Wing Commander 2 because it has good memories for you? Download and fire it up on that PC you just built. No need to go and drag a console out the loft, assuming you still have it, or wait and hope that it's released in the store on your console of choice - just get in and start playing.

Shaun

I don't agree that PC environments are and will be any form of replacement to a "locked down" model that is console gaming.

A locked down environment provides immense benefit to the end-user from a practicality perspective and this is one of the main operational benefits of such a model.

I have adopted both models. A fully gooned up PC and the major consoles. Which one do I predominantly use? Consoles as they are without doubt the "easy option" from start to finish.

The sheer fact that a system is not locked down, makes any such other model cumbersome by comparison. A gamer wants to game.... plain and simple. Sure there are benefits to a PC type model, where lock down is not adopted, but from a simple gaming perspective the user will tend to go down the simple stupid use model. Delivering 90% of what the user wants with minimal effort.

The Steam Box would really rattle the market if it gave an element of a semi lock-down model. If it's just a re-badged PC..... it will have a limited life and appeal in my opinion.

This is all about what the user wants..... and the majority of gamers will want something that "just works" without any brain power, even if it doesn't provide the advantages to the nth degree that a PC type (read: GFX!) platform can provide.

tony de wonderful

I cancelled. Too hectic with work to be able to pimp the ordered PS4 out over Xmas. I'll probably buy one when the price drops a little and any issues are ironed out.

With GTAV on PS3 I have tons of gaming to get through anyway.

Geezer

Great if you want to use Steam. Not everyone does.

You can buy games from MS Live or PSN, not all games have to be bought on disc. Also, if you have a crappy BB, buying the disc is your only alternative. Not to mention, plenty of people simply want the disc.



I don't know why you think the price is close. My current PC was bought at the same time Win 7 came out. It would play the games of the day at a decent res/fps. It won't play them now unless they are 640*480! (ok, exaggeration, but you know what I mean), and the fps is terrible.

I paid about £500 for that, it's out of date a few years later. A console is about £300. I need ot update this thing if I want to play on it, so either get a whole new PC at another £500 or at least a few hundred to upgrade GFX, CPU etc. That's a lot of games at £10 a pop cheaper to make up the difference.

At the moment. I bemoaned the lack of players in a game, but it is increasing. I expect the next gen to close the gap even further. As for the control system, yeah, I preferred a mouse keyboard for accuracy, and it took a while to get used to pad, but I have to say, movement is a lot easier on a pad. Everyone else is in the same boat, so it's not bad.



You have to have the settings down, your own words. So to avoid spending the money, you are getting a lesser experience. I really don't see the difference. To maintain the performance advantage, you will have to spend the money.


No, I know what they are ike, that's why I said "good enough". It's good enough for me, it may not be for you. This discussion is about financial issues and convenience. Like I said earlier, if you prefer PCs and don't mind it all, go for it.

You have proven quite the opposite really

Convenience, a console doesn't have to be built. If you buy something you don't need to build, it's expensive.



We'll just have to agree to disagree there

Littleted

Build ya PC with good bits and they will last you 3 years easily
I built a core i7 3 years ago with a Radeon 5870 and it's still fast as and plays everything.

I've just upgraded to a over locked Haskell i5 32 gig ram and gtx770 and it's not that much different

As or the console question PS4 then XBOX next year.

Bit pissed that Gran Turismo 6 is ps3 only bah

Neanderthal

iTrader: (6)

About a month till launch of the One. All I can think about is how can I transfer my gta 5 profile to it....

Shaun

I'm already rubbing my sausage thinking about it!

Brun

95turbowagon

iTrader: (17)

Getting a PS4 with Assasins Creed 4, COD Ghosts and Fifa 14, that should last me a little while till Watchdogs and Tom Clancy's comes out.

stedee

iTrader: (4)

ps4 with killzone, just hope i can get used to the controller, never had a ps before

that tom clancy game looks the business and driveclub is what sold it to me

95turbowagon

iTrader: (17)

I originally ordered ps4 with watchdogs and fifa 14, now with watchdogs being delayed the only offers shopto are giving include killzone, which isn't my sort of game. Hopefully they'll offer something else.

I missed out by 2 days on a bundle they're doing for customers who ordered before a certain date, which includes a console, game extra controller and the camera for £450, which i think is a £50 saving.

tony de wonderful

I may well do that now actually. Games are cheap, steam etc.

Brun

Has anyone actually seen any videos of the two consoles?

Shaun

Yes.. why?

Brun

Last time I looked on YouTube there was none!

Shaun

Loads of them now...... even comparisons now between PS4 vs XBO multi platform games.

Let the fanboy bull**** begin!!!!!

It's getting close now..... I can almost feel the controller(s) in my hands!!!

Brun

Had a quick look but nothing blows me away. In Majorca so viewing on an IP5 possibly not ideal.

Shaun

I'm not surprised you have that impression.

Cannon Fodder

iTrader: (100)

A local specialist to me is still accepting pre orders for the day of release for the PS4, he's also willing to take used PS3 games in PX against the PS4.

So I'm off down there tomorrow with a bag full of old games I've not played for ages to trade in against the PS4, an extra controller plus 2/3 games.

Before anyone says it I'm still going to have to pay a big lump of money when I collect the PS4, but better to get rid of the games I haven't played for ages rather than have them continue to gather dust.

95turbowagon

iTrader: (17)

I'm keeping my ps3 for the time being as gran turismo 6 comes out at the start of december.

poolio74

Ps4 pre ordered.

Had enuff of the robbin **** called bill!