polarbearit

Ok on the depreciation, what killed Scoobs values was IM and the UK price. There is no reason why a MY00 would cost list of £21k in the UK and this car COULD be picked up for £14.5K import (at full spec), I know people who did this! The UK car will always be worth more, but not £6500 more, maybe £500 -£1000 dependant on remaining warranty! Most people who own scooby have lost more money than they expected (me included ).

The whole industry has suffered with car prices, but scoobys have been particularly badly affected because they used to be commonly available in only limited numbers, which meant they (IM) were charging a particularly large premium compared to many other manufacturers.

spudgun

polarbearit sounds about right on this. i for one am delighted with my car, its just been a suprise as to the depreciation. princess has only lost 1k in a year, but then her car is much older than mine.
what would people suggest as the ideal length of time to keep a car realisticly? is there advantages to leasing? i have never leased before and dont know much about it.
pete lewis...there was an interesting article in auto express recently saying something along the lines of the recent fashion of silver cars was on the wane, and it could go against future values/desirability of current silver cars.
pete, i won't deny that blue or silver will probably always be the most sought after colour for scoobys. i personally think the green ones look fine, but they seem harder to sell on. i bougt red mica because i loved the colour, simple as that. i didnt buy blue mica because i didnt like it. sonic blue yes, but not dull blue. i aint a saddo, i come on here because i enjoy speaking to like minded people, i find people here friendly and entertaining. i dont waste my time baiting people or ridiculing them, whats the point? one day i might need their help and they'll tell me to p1ss off

Mark_S

IM Pete,

Well mate I guess you've read the replies. Were none of us taken in by your propoganda, and why should we the facts say otherwise.
Since nobody else could answer my question, and you knowing so much an 'all, perhaps you can. Where is the happiness in losing 10-11K in 6 months???

And IM Pete, what should you be very happy about??

"I have a MY00 and reckon that about £16K P/EX is about right."

From your other quotes I'm guessing you have a 5 door, they cost about 21.5K GBP one year ago. Thats a depreciation of 5.5K GBP in one year based on your own figures I dont take particular pleasure in pointing this out, but in your case I think you need it.

Fact is I bought a brand new Scoob at the price you THINK yours is worth now in p/ex. When I finally come to sell it maybe 4-5 years on it will be out of warranty and I will have lost money, but then so will yours and so will you. I just wonder what differential there will be then?, will it really be the 5-6 grand difference that would have to exist for your math to make any sense.

So IM Pete, thanks for all the advice mate (not forgetting the stuff on wheels, body styles and paint colour etc..) but no thanks.

Mark (a Saddo who is well and truly hooked - on his Impreza that is)

pslewis

Mark_S - you poor poor sad soul

I wouldnt buy an import if it was offered at half the price of a UK car (and to most people it would need to be that kind of difference to jusify having that on your V5) everyone knows that you bought them for next to nothing so they will only pay you next to nothing when you want to sell - you cannot expect to buy a second rate vehicle at a second rate price and then moan that it has not held its value like a proper UK car. You went to the EU to import because you couldnt afford the UK car, thats fine, but it is not, and never will, be worth anywhere near the genuine article! WOW now I've REALLY lit the blue touch paper - I will now retire to a safe distance!! (is Mars far enough??) ha ha

Pete

PS. Yes, on my own figures, I am looking at a paper loss on my car of around £5k in 10 months - you think that is bad then??? I think you might find that it is perfectly normal - the point is I will still have my Scooby in 10 years time (I have read that they last that long if treated properly) So, in 10 years the car will have cost me £21.5K - I can handle that thanks for worrying anyway

Pete

[This message has been edited by pslewis (edited 01 April 2001).]

spudgun

pete...whats the point in the insults? where did he say he couldnt afford a uk car????
he just chose a different route to you and i.
if my car is worth 15k now, are u sure his is only worth around 9K??? if this is the case, i will happily buy a used euro import from now on! and if his IS worth 9k, what chance in hell do uk model owners have of selling their uk cars? if i were a private buyer, i would choose the import...same car, less money. this is based on your theory, not mine. in reality, i would imagine his car is a couple of grand less, therby he still wins in the end. maybe i'm wrong( probably) but his argument makes sense, yours doesnt.
i aint trading insults with u pete, i dont know u. i enjoy an intelligent debate, but why slag off fellow scooby owners? i just don't see the point. if its a big laugh your having, please share the joke

Chins

Spudgun

Just think your lucky its taken him this long to have a proper go at Imports. Just type P1 in any reply and Pete sense it before youve even posted it

As a vetran of the P1 posts I can honestly say that Pete is totally irrational when it comes to debates. He has still to find me my £22k P1 (Pete it is April ).

Just look at his profile for a true indication of his nature. I think he has to change his email account weekly to ensure the hate mail doesnt get through

One day he'll be banged to rights when exposed as a driver of an Imported Impreza, with a Gold wheel equiped P1 at home for his weekend runaround

Jonathan

Pete a picture of my S3 at the link below

pslewis

Spudgun - I said that NOT to have a 'go' at another scoobie owner - I reckon they are the salt of the earth witness thier generous giving on red nose day - just to try and shut me up!! I said it because I KNEW someone would take it wrong and do just what you have done and think me truly evil

I cant have a legitimate go at Gold Wheels until 15th June so, what better target than a grey import????

Jonathon - I love P1's - I just reckon they are so over-priced that its embarassing that anyone ever fell for the hype - but I suppose there are still simpletons around?

See Spudgun?? thats what I do - just wait and see who has a pop at me!! its now getting to be a hard job as most can now give as good back (like chins there) - by the way that link took ages so I stopped it - did you make it slow like your S3 to give the visitor an appropriate ambience??

Pete

[This message has been edited by pslewis (edited 02 April 2001).]

Chins

Pete

Being a simpleton it took me a while to figure how to post it. By the way it took a click on the mouse to see it last time. Made it easier for you. You can always set the photo as your wallpaper.

Jonathan

pslewis

Posted it as my wallpaper - its brilliant - the colours have gone a bit wrong on the wheels but I am sure that I can edit those back to how they should be

Pete

Rajd

This thing about Euro imports being worth less than UK cars sounds like sour grapes by the people who paid £7,000 too much for their 'UK' cars. I say this having actually sold a Euro import last year. Car (Alfa 156) was bought for £14,500 in March 99 and sold for £12750 in September 00. The £1750 depreciation was partly due to the fact that Alfa Romeo dropped the list price by £3K in the interim. The buyer didn't give a monkeys about it being an import.

Dream on.

Raj

GaryC

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Mark_S:
<B>
Incidentally I dont agree with Pete that it'll be worth diddly come resale time. The PPP comes with the knowledge that its a well tested and respected piece of kit that so far has had nothing but good press from owners alike [/quote]


Don't be so sure

I sold an MY99 PPP+a/c+17"+PIAA++++ and lost £12k in 16 months. I was told the premium I could expect from ALL the mods was c£1k, and that the Aircon and wheels improved the value more than the PPP A number of Subaru dealers quoted less because it had a PPP

The PPP is worth the money for the performance gain (tarmac ripping torque ) but don't expect it to add a penny to the resale value

robman

The logic behind Dutch imports costing us less is that in Holland they pay a huge luxury tax on top of the base price. In order to keep the selling price at a certain position in the market Subaru have to set the base price lower for them than they do for the UK.

I'm not justifying their (and just about every other car manufacturer's) policy, but explaining the difference in base price.

UK customers could import the car without paying the local tax and then import it into the UK and pay the much lower VAT figure.

It's nothing to do with spec of vehicle being lower or anything likte that. Just world economics - we pay what we are forced to pay for a product that has a certain market position. A car that costs 10 times as much at retail price is very very very unlikely to have cost 10 times as much to manufacture. But if a 50k BMW had always been sold at 20k it would be perceived as being in the same league as other cars at that price point, rather than being a "status symbol" that you hope gives people a certain impression about "who" you are.

r

Dave P

Eurozone.... that's the primary reason you can get cars so much cheaper in Europe. We pay in Sterling which has to be effectively converted to Euros.

Since 1999 the Euro has devalued 30% Strangely 30% of £21,000 is £14,700 roughly the discount people are getting on a new Imported Euro Scoob.

Now the French, the Dutch and the Belgiums are not going to adjust their car prices to their domestic market to even out the odds, and if you are a resident of these countries the cost of the car relatively is the same as it has been since 1999. They are just cheaper to us in the UK due to the exchange rate.

Of course when it comes to sell, you may struggle to sell an import for more than you actually paid, and some people do still worry about imported cars that is a fact. This in turn has to drag down the price of a used UK Scoob.

Add to the fact the relaxing of Euro import controls, the new model etc and all this adds to weakening residuals.

That said I will not be selling my MY99 UK standard spec as it continues to give me huge amounts of joy, even in the standard form. I am sure if I look after it it will soon become a classic.

Dave

BarryK

To quote from Inspector Morse "Lewis, Lewis, Lewis".

You're a genius. Keep it up.

pslewis

Mark_S - you find my comments 'only' MILDLY offensive - I am failing then by the way they ARE funny ( I laugh while I type them - so they MUST be funny )

Tractor - you are in dire need of a sense of humour implant my man

Pete

Tractor

Pete, do not try and say that you are merely 'avin a larf with your comments in order to get a reaction - cr@p defence and you are fooling nobody.

Mark_S

Spudgun, I couldnt have put it better myself, I'm quite happy to accept that the equivalent Euro import is worth around 2 grand less. If I was buying second hand I think I would be looking for a saving in that region before going the Euro route. Otherwise you might just as well cough up a bit extra for the added peace of mind of the additional warranty and English service book offered by the UK car. After 5-6 years though I would suggest its not that simple and that general condition, service history and number of miles covered might be more important. As it was I fancied a new car and the challenge of importing it myself was more than I could resist.

I'm glad you like the PPP though, seriously considering one myself, when do I get a ride in yours?. Incidentally I dont agree with Pete that it'll be worth diddly come resale time. The PPP comes with the knowledge that its a well tested and respected piece of kit that so far has had nothing but good press from owners alike (97 owners apart). The fact that its not re-mappable for me is a plus point too, means it cant be tinkered with by unscrupulous owners. I would not touch a Scoob with any other replacement ECU, I just dont know enough about 'em to risk my pride and joy.

Pete, I find your comments mildly offensive, they are just not funny. You know as well as I do that UK cars and UK spec Euro imports come off the same production line, so if my car is second rate then so is yours. I dont remember moaning about the 2nd hand value of my car, to be honest I dont much think about it as I'm not about to sell. I dont remember saying I couldnt afford a UK sourced car either, I just dont see the point in throwing away good money.

Now lets nail this myth about V5's once and for all. I have heard of some people who had problems with the V5 saying stuff like "Declared new by Independant Importer"
The one person I know who experienced this problem returned his V5 to DVLA and had it put right. The majority of people should have avoided such problems by filling in the V267 (Declaration of Newness). But then if you had imported your own car you would know this and wouldnt be shooting off about matters you know nought. My V5?, it says:-

The previous recorded keeper is: NONE
1. New at first registration

No hint at being an import, still I wouldnt care if it did, its just I felt that this information would be beneficial to your general education. Is your V5 really much different?

I thinks its time you stood back from making these type of posts unless you really believe in your own hype. Your manner is unfriendly and opinionated, maybe thats what you get off on. If thats the case then I have nothing further to say to you.

GCollier

I agree with Mark, Pete's comments just aren't funny.

I don't know about a sense of humour implant Pete, but you badly need a change of record, because you've been stuck in this sad "imports/P1" groove for too long. If you think of yourself as such a "wit", then surely you'd be able to think up something new by now?

And for what it's worth, I'd be more than happy to buy a euro import 2nd hand. Sure, I'd expect to pay a little less for it than a UK sourced car, but probably £1-2K and nothing more, so I'd suggest that depreciation on a euro import is actually less than on a UK car.

Gary.

Geezer

The best reply so far is "it's worth what you can get for it". Not many people care whether they are imports or not, as long as they have a verifiable history.

My V5 says new at first registration, and you even get to name the type of car! Unless the person who purchases my car next actually bothers to contact IM or Subaru UK, they won't actually be aware that it is an import unless I tell them.

Once the values of the Scoobs start to get within reach of the pencil moustached 19 year olds, do you really think they will give two hoots as to the origin of the car? All they will see is "2.0 Turbo"!

For those of you who are trying to sell virtually new cars, that's just the way it goes. As sson as you drive it off the forecourt you've lost thousands, so deal with it.

If you want a UK spec car, buy one but don't whinge about residuals, otherwise save your money and import. The cars are exactly the same (apart from warranty and alarm, obviously) because they have to be by law.

Geezer

Tractor

Er, Pete, am I wrong in saying that the little winking smilie icon = "nudge, nudge, wink, wink".......? I am winding you up mate, but alas you missed it. Shop down my way are doing a fine discount on humour implants if you are interested.... or maybe you would rather pay full price elsewhere.......

Mr Footlong

iTrader: (7)

Simple answer. It's weight in gold.

spudgun

can a euro import be serviced at a uk main dealer? will a uk main dealer take , for example, a dutch scooby in as part exchange?
if the answer is yes...then why the HELL did i shell out 6k more than some of these guys!?
my gripe has never been with my car, i love it to bits, and i have learnt to ignore the nova boys till i'm in the mood. my gripe is with subaru who sell overpriced cars and after market mods, threatening u with losing your warranty if u so much as think about putting a non prodrive bit on your car, then offering u jack **** for them when trading in, yet THEY will fleece the next poor sod who comes to buy it.
jap imports get slagged off, yet i never really read anything bad on here about them. i have learnt in the last 6 months that there are PLENTY of places that will service an import. and i think the guys who imported euro cars did it the right way.
if uk subaru wish to maintain a fair and realistic system of residual values, and stop p1ssing people off, then stop offering people insulting trade in values.
i know business is business, im self employed myself, but the difference is i go out of my way with customer service,and i don't take the p1ss financially, thats one of the reasons why i can afford to run this car.
is anyone here gonna buy a new uk scoob again? seriously? and how much do u think you'll lose on it?wrx..sti... IF i ever buy subaru again, i think a trip to the continent will be the way to go.
or, maybe a jap import or p1, maybe a nice set of gold wheels too! oh, and some furry dice.....PETE?

spudgun

forgot to say... PPP is worth it! its the only after market mod well worth the money, even though its a LOT of money. i would definately do PPP again on a newish car!

pslewis

[QUOTE]Originally posted by GCollier:
[B]I agree with Mark, Pete's comments just aren't funny.
---------------------------------------------
1st point 1st - YOU think they are not funny because you have not got my sense of humour (and I couldnt give a monkeys ****!)
---------------------------------------------

Pete

edited cos it was a bit rude to poor gayr Collier!




[This message has been edited by pslewis (edited 03 April 2001).]

GCollier

Pete,

Your "sense of humour" seems to involve, at best, running down other peoples cars, and at worst being downright rude and obnoxious, and then having a chuckle (to yourself I might add, I haven't seen anyone else laughing). You are correct though, I don't share it. Maybe this sort of internet baiting is your outlet, and you get off on it, who knows.

Gary.

Mark_S

Spudgun, yes my local Subaru dealership has been very happy to service my Dutch import and sort out extras such as a/c, its good money for them. As to p/ex I wouldnt think they would be very interested. In any case the only reason to p/ex at a Subaru dealer would be because you are buying another (New?) car from them. No need, if you want another Scoob then order it from your friendly Dutch dealer and sell privately at a little below UK car prices, no problem

GaryC, maybe I'm wrong about the PPP (I never suggested it was exactly an investment after all). All I can say is that if I was after a 2nd hand Scoob and there was one with a PPP with FSSH I would definitely consider paying a bit more (ok, maybe not 2k more). As long as it didnt have gold wheels....., oh God I didnt mean that, GWO's please forgive me - I love gold wheels especially on the Catalunya!.

chiark

My local dealership takes my money for servicing quite happily. They even gave me an English handbook *free*. (gasp)

They say that they will take the car in part-ex, though have already warned me that they'll give less as its an EU import and so they'll probably stand for any extra warranty themselves. Fine, says I. I can live with that. The reality is that it's very likely I'll buy another import from the same dealer in Holland and sell the car privately.

The only real difference is warranty in years 2 and 3. And, being honest, the warranty in year 1 - it's easier with a UK sourced car.

Am I happy? Yes. Would I recommend an EU parallel import? Yes. Do I believe that I saved a huge wedge of money? Yes. Was that around 7 grand? Yes. Can I make the same saving now? No.

You pays yer money and takes yer choice. At the end of the day, it's your choice.

Back to the original point - god knows how much the car is worth, but I don't care as it isn't being sold any time soon.

Mark_S

Chiark,

Just realised youve registered over a 1000 postings in less than a year!!!! More rabbit than Sainsbury's

chiark

I can muppet with the best of 'em. Well, with a few exceptions. There is occasionally a point to my posts, too, but I have to be concentrating

spudgun

out of interest i had a look at