Twin scroll turbo upgrade MD321 billet or SC42 billet or LM420 billet?
04 February 2012, 08:35 PM
#31
Looks great but I'm only running a standard jdm sti 2.0lt block so dont think it'll make that power on mine but still good.
The fmic is looking like a good idea but I'll also have to buy an induction kit which is another £150 or £200 and maybe get bigger injectors to like 800cc so £480 +vat fmic £400 still about £1k so not sure how far I should go?
What an uprated tmic (like hyperflow tmic) or do they get alot of heat soak or are they not as good as std sti tmic? any info?
The fmic is looking like a good idea but I'll also have to buy an induction kit which is another £150 or £200 and maybe get bigger injectors to like 800cc so £480 +vat fmic £400 still about £1k so not sure how far I should go?
What an uprated tmic (like hyperflow tmic) or do they get alot of heat soak or are they not as good as std sti tmic? any info?
And still think you could make decent power on yours with MDX321T with supported mods.
Induction kit,you should go with RCM kit or something similar,FMIC i would go with Hybrid(HDi) or Japspeed FMIC which are OK,HDi is amazing FMIC(Shaun running HDi) and they're proven,injectors you should be OK at 450bhp+ with 650cc,if you are looking run methanol i would suggest bigger.
Uprated TMIC such as Hyperflow not sure,of you are looking for OEM,this can be answer,but still with FMIC you should make more power
Jura
04 February 2012, 09:03 PM
#32
What supporting mods, Injectors, FMIC, Induction kit?
Ive been thinking of getting one for a while but dont want to go down the FMIC, CAIK route, I want to keep it looking as standard as possible but also get the best result from the turbo, Which is why i still havn`t bought one yet
Already have 358/357 so its a lot to cough up for another 40-60 bhp. Decisions decisions.....
Ive been thinking of getting one for a while but dont want to go down the FMIC, CAIK route, I want to keep it looking as standard as possible but also get the best result from the turbo, Which is why i still havn`t bought one yet
Already have 358/357 so its a lot to cough up for another 40-60 bhp. Decisions decisions.....
Shaun the reason for the low boost is Kev @Scoobyclinic was not willing to run more boost on the standard ECU. Aftermarket management and maybe going mafless is next. Then possibly run 1.6/1.7 bar and see how the standard engine fares
I would always go for meth, it's cheap and easy power and not that much of a hassle once you get in to the routine.
04 February 2012, 10:25 PM
#35
FMIC, 800cc injectors, uprated fuel pump, FPR, RCM KN induction kit and clutch.
Shaun the reason for the low boost is Kev @Scoobyclinic was not willing to run more boost on the standard ECU. Aftermarket management and maybe going mafless is next. Then possibly run 1.6/1.7 bar and see how the standard engine fares
I would always go for meth, it's cheap and easy power and not that much of a hassle once you get in to the routine.
Shaun the reason for the low boost is Kev @Scoobyclinic was not willing to run more boost on the standard ECU. Aftermarket management and maybe going mafless is next. Then possibly run 1.6/1.7 bar and see how the standard engine fares
I would always go for meth, it's cheap and easy power and not that much of a hassle once you get in to the routine.
05 February 2012, 09:18 AM
#36
Scooby Regular
Tazz,
I bought my FMIC from Harvey Smith (look at his trade posts in the Traders section).
My car is currently producing 440+/440+ on VPower with the LM450 Billet. Standard OEM 2ltr JDM engine.
Read my project thread for all the gory details (link in signature).
Latest graph from Surrey Rolling Road:
Einstein RA,
You don't need a new ECU to run more boost safely. At least a held figure of 1.6bar is possible without issues on your set-up - if mapped correctly. Speak to the likes of Richard Bulmer, Andy F, Zen and Bob Rawle.
You certainly don't need to move away from the OE MAF at your level either.
There is a very interesting thread on 22b ( http://bbs.22b.com/cgi-bin/ultimateb...1;t=000866;p=4 ) about this and the standard ECU. Whilst the thread was about something else, it actually ended up discussing this specific issue of usable and safe boost limits on the OEM ECU.
I was running more than your boost levels on my old Spec C ECU (same code as what yours can run) nearly 7yrs ago, without any issues whatsoever (1.60bar iirc). My current ECU (JDM again) for the Hawkeye has an even better MAP sensor that lets me see a gauge pressure of 2bar!
I bought my FMIC from Harvey Smith (look at his trade posts in the Traders section).
My car is currently producing 440+/440+ on VPower with the LM450 Billet. Standard OEM 2ltr JDM engine.
Read my project thread for all the gory details (link in signature).
Latest graph from Surrey Rolling Road:
Einstein RA,
You don't need a new ECU to run more boost safely. At least a held figure of 1.6bar is possible without issues on your set-up - if mapped correctly. Speak to the likes of Richard Bulmer, Andy F, Zen and Bob Rawle.
You certainly don't need to move away from the OE MAF at your level either.
There is a very interesting thread on 22b ( http://bbs.22b.com/cgi-bin/ultimateb...1;t=000866;p=4 ) about this and the standard ECU. Whilst the thread was about something else, it actually ended up discussing this specific issue of usable and safe boost limits on the OEM ECU.
I was running more than your boost levels on my old Spec C ECU (same code as what yours can run) nearly 7yrs ago, without any issues whatsoever (1.60bar iirc). My current ECU (JDM again) for the Hawkeye has an even better MAP sensor that lets me see a gauge pressure of 2bar!
05 February 2012, 09:51 AM
#37
Kev did say that it is possible to run more boost, but given the problems that someone else had running more boost without accurate ECU monitoring (thread on 22b also) I fully understood his reservation. To be honest Shaun I'm now in two or three minds lol. Option one run more boost on standard ECU and get mapped again to see if 500bhp can be cracked on standard engine (I know it has been done). Option two go for Syvecs and have much better engine protection to achieve the same. Option three uprate the bottom end and see how far the engine will go with th SC42 either with standard ECU or Syvecs.
I want reliable power and will always use methanol as it's as much a safety cushion as a power gainer. The problem with power (as you know) is it's never enough!
Maz
I want reliable power and will always use methanol as it's as much a safety cushion as a power gainer. The problem with power (as you know) is it's never enough!
Maz
05 February 2012, 10:30 AM
#38
Scooby Regular
Maz,
If it's mapped correctly you can still retain safety measures like boost cut, whilst running more boost than you are. I know from first hand experience on your model of ECU and MAP sensor.
The key part of the jigsaw is the mapper imo.
Personally I wouldn't be replacing your ECU at your level of tune for your concerns.
If you start pushing much more above 450 on a standard 2ltr engine, I can't help but feel you need to accept that it could fail....... obviously dependant as well on use.
I personally think 450bhp is a happy medium and was another reason why I decided against Meth. Another 50bhp is potentially more strain and additional risk. I can't be arsed with that side of things now.... it must be old age! lol
IMO you have to draw a line somewhere, else you never end up stopping and you can end up with a car that is off the road more than on it. This can end up being something that pisses you off.
Been there and will never go there again!
If it's mapped correctly you can still retain safety measures like boost cut, whilst running more boost than you are. I know from first hand experience on your model of ECU and MAP sensor.
The key part of the jigsaw is the mapper imo.
Personally I wouldn't be replacing your ECU at your level of tune for your concerns.
If you start pushing much more above 450 on a standard 2ltr engine, I can't help but feel you need to accept that it could fail....... obviously dependant as well on use.
I personally think 450bhp is a happy medium and was another reason why I decided against Meth. Another 50bhp is potentially more strain and additional risk. I can't be arsed with that side of things now.... it must be old age! lol
IMO you have to draw a line somewhere, else you never end up stopping and you can end up with a car that is off the road more than on it. This can end up being something that pisses you off.
Been there and will never go there again!
05 February 2012, 10:58 AM
#39
A 400-420 bhp car is achievable with the standard set up but could be bettered. It's always possible to do your turbo change see what results you get and if your not happy then change to FMIC and Induction kit, I know it will cost a bit more in the long run but it's an option.
Gaz.
05 February 2012, 11:06 AM
#40
Scooby Regular
Personally I think 400bhp is great for a road car.... even a lardy Newage. You simply do not need anymore..... you really don't!
Go for a LM400 Billet (or equivalent if you really must
). You can stick with everything OEM apart from the injectors and turbo. Nothing else needed for 400bhp.
Cost effective and goes like stink!
The more you want, the more you will spend and in reality the less you keep getting for the cash you have spent.
I would perhaps go the LM400 Billet route and if you wanted more power in the future, go for a Meth map. I suspect that would see you in the region of 430-440bhp (on Meth).
Go for a LM400 Billet (or equivalent if you really must
). You can stick with everything OEM apart from the injectors and turbo. Nothing else needed for 400bhp.Cost effective and goes like stink!
The more you want, the more you will spend and in reality the less you keep getting for the cash you have spent.
I would perhaps go the LM400 Billet route and if you wanted more power in the future, go for a Meth map. I suspect that would see you in the region of 430-440bhp (on Meth).
05 February 2012, 12:44 PM
#42
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All very good advice. Cheers
So if i was to run meth is it safe to leave in your tank petrol for a week at a time? Only reason I'm asking is cause I only was my car on the weekends and I've heard on meth messing up and cause corrosion or is that bull****?
So if i was to run meth is it safe to leave in your tank petrol for a week at a time? Only reason I'm asking is cause I only was my car on the weekends and I've heard on meth messing up and cause corrosion or is that bull****?
05 February 2012, 12:50 PM
#43
No b•||$hit, but its more of a long term side effect, as in a few years not months
I looked into having a meth map on my standard VF36 to see how close to 400 it could get on a standard turbo but after speaking to Bob Rawle about it, it seems that the exhaust housing becomes a bit of a restriction at that level, still curious though, £300 to find out(2 seperate maps and in gear boost via Megarom)
I looked into having a meth map on my standard VF36 to see how close to 400 it could get on a standard turbo but after speaking to Bob Rawle about it, it seems that the exhaust housing becomes a bit of a restriction at that level, still curious though, £300 to find out(2 seperate maps and in gear boost via Megarom)
Last edited by The Pink Ninja; 05 February 2012 at 12:59 PM.
05 February 2012, 01:52 PM
#44
I just sold a blob 451bhp-430 ft trq 99 fuel only, and Standard ecu. The car was amazing walbro 740cc front mount lm450 3500rpm boost 4000 full boost 2 bar dropping to 1.75 mapped bye zen car was exlnt, also amazing to drive as a daily driver .
Go for front mount and the 450 and a rcm drop in fuel pump £130 great buy.
Go for front mount and the 450 and a rcm drop in fuel pump £130 great buy.
Last edited by BIG FUD; 05 February 2012 at 01:54 PM.
05 February 2012, 03:32 PM
#47
There are other options to the FMIC route.
Chevron Motorsport in Stafford sell two levels of uprated TMIC, a full race version which is very expensive but incredibly eficient, or a mid range between this and the STi9 TMIC which is more afordable for most. They have run cars with 500BHP on the midrange spec TMIC and run TA cars on the Race spec TMIC.
Benefits of retaining a TMIC are you keep the OEM look, dont have to mess about cutting up your car and ancilaries for the pipework, it's cheaper and quicker to install, if you ever want to revert back to stock it's easier, you also retain the throttle response as the pipe runs are the OEM length.
Chevron Motorsport in Stafford sell two levels of uprated TMIC, a full race version which is very expensive but incredibly eficient, or a mid range between this and the STi9 TMIC which is more afordable for most. They have run cars with 500BHP on the midrange spec TMIC and run TA cars on the Race spec TMIC.
Benefits of retaining a TMIC are you keep the OEM look, dont have to mess about cutting up your car and ancilaries for the pipework, it's cheaper and quicker to install, if you ever want to revert back to stock it's easier, you also retain the throttle response as the pipe runs are the OEM length.
05 March 2012, 07:19 AM
#55
Hi mate
Meth is a great mod , pound for pound.
Really simple way of making your high powered car go even quicker.
It's a good way of getting 20-40 lb more torque by just a adding to your fuel.
I personally went for Sc range, as was first on the Market and was on here for all to see from the start.
So has good and bad results for all to see.... Note when the turbo didn't work it was changed and modified till it worked.
I'd look at all
Three treads on here and make your own mind up.
Good luck
Meth is a great mod , pound for pound.
Really simple way of making your high powered car go even quicker.
It's a good way of getting 20-40 lb more torque by just a adding to your fuel.
I personally went for Sc range, as was first on the Market and was on here for all to see from the start.
So has good and bad results for all to see.... Note when the turbo didn't work it was changed and modified till it worked.
I'd look at all
Three treads on here and make your own mind up.
Good luck
05 March 2012, 06:48 PM
#59
Having just got myself into a 2006 spec c I'm really impressed with the throttle response, the fast spool up and the broad powerband.
How much of these superb qualities do you lose when you step up to a much larger turbo, fmic etc?
I wonder if you might actually be quicker with the standard set up on a tight track or twisting mountain road.
Experiences from those who've been there?
How much of these superb qualities do you lose when you step up to a much larger turbo, fmic etc?
I wonder if you might actually be quicker with the standard set up on a tight track or twisting mountain road.
Experiences from those who've been there?