500bhp - Newage? How drivable? + Possible from an MD321T or only a V?
14 October 2010, 04:20 PM
#61
Eggy....Just out of interest did you notice a difference when you first used meth,i'm wanting more torque and is it easy to use?
Gonna have a meth map done by Duncan soon i think
Gonna have a meth map done by Duncan soon i think
14 October 2010, 04:25 PM
#62
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It does appear to spool slightly faster and the larger valves are the most likely cause.
14 October 2010, 04:33 PM
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when you go methanol you dont go back!
i bought a 25 litre drum and its easy to pour in. get a tap for the drum and u'll minimise spillages.
the only problem i had was every stupid petrol can leaking at the spout when pouring it into the car, still havnt found one that doesnt leak! so ive given in and got a funnel and a measuring jug.
shell is 1 mile from my house, i fill up with 20 litres of shell v power, drive home slow (under 2krpm) , stick the tap on my drum and the measuring jug under the tap..bang in 2 litres of methanol down the funnel into the car. then go fro a cruise
Last edited by eggy790; 14 October 2010 at 04:35 PM.
14 October 2010, 04:41 PM
#64
Sweet thanks
Duncans gonna do the same and map it at Zen i think.Might have to wait though and get a twin plate first.I'm basically doing the same and taking it up towards the 480 mark.I'm at 430 now and it needs leaning off slightly so with meth as well it should take it above 450
But i'm still on the OEM clutch 
Duncans gonna do the same and map it at Zen i think.Might have to wait though and get a twin plate first.I'm basically doing the same and taking it up towards the 480 mark.I'm at 430 now and it needs leaning off slightly so with meth as well it should take it above 450
But i'm still on the OEM clutch
14 October 2010, 04:53 PM
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Sweet thanks
Duncans gonna do the same and map it at Zen i think.Might have to wait though and get a twin plate first.I'm basically doing the same and taking it up towards the 480 mark.I'm at 430 now and it needs leaning off slightly so with meth as well it should take it above 450 But i'm still on the OEM clutch
Duncans gonna do the same and map it at Zen i think.Might have to wait though and get a twin plate first.I'm basically doing the same and taking it up towards the 480 mark.I'm at 430 now and it needs leaning off slightly so with meth as well it should take it above 450
But i'm still on the OEM clutch i'm confident it'll be fine for everyday 400 l/bs , feels so much more solid than my previous standard 2.0 clutch. only costs £260 too
14 October 2010, 06:18 PM
#67
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The biggest problem with PF discs and pads is that most people don't use them enough and they become a little wooden. In back to back tests performed by the MLR using a racing driver to test the PF pad and disc swap against AP and Alcon 6 pot kits, the PF discs and pads outperformed both the aftermarket kits for stopping distance.
Of course if you only drive it hard once and a while, by the time the brakes are back to there best (carbon friction material deposited on the disc) you've backed off and left thinking the brakes aren't as good as they might be. Put an AP 6 pot kit on with DS2500s and the bite is better a lot of the time if you don't use the brakes hard most of the time. Take the 2500s on track HARD and you may run into problems with uneven pad deposits.
Of course if you only drive it hard once and a while, by the time the brakes are back to there best (carbon friction material deposited on the disc) you've backed off and left thinking the brakes aren't as good as they might be. Put an AP 6 pot kit on with DS2500s and the bite is better a lot of the time if you don't use the brakes hard most of the time. Take the 2500s on track HARD and you may run into problems with uneven pad deposits.
PF felt a bit "wooden", AP seemed much nicer...
And as regards road manners, there are very few coppers who'd "nick" you for excessive use of the brakes...
But vice-versa is another story !
dunx
P.S. Oil cooler works fine and saves you buying an expensive reverse scoop...
14 October 2010, 07:08 PM
#68
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I would totally agree with what has been said by Paul about the PF floating disc, bell and pad upgrade... based on my road use so far.
I had AP 6pots with 355mm rotors on the Spec C. The Hawkeye I have now has the PF conversion and whilst it was all part of the car when I purchased it, it was one area I thought "oh well, they will do for the moment I suspect". IMO even coming from AP's, I think the PF are a very good set-up. I don't get any wooden feel. I do tend to have fairly spirited drives though and even had the discs blue the other day.
Certainly no complaints of the PF's so far but I will wait until I get the car on track to see how they hold up to a bit of real punishment, as brake fade may be an issue. If that happens it will be straight on with a set of AP's or ALCON's I suspect.
I had AP 6pots with 355mm rotors on the Spec C. The Hawkeye I have now has the PF conversion and whilst it was all part of the car when I purchased it, it was one area I thought "oh well, they will do for the moment I suspect". IMO even coming from AP's, I think the PF are a very good set-up. I don't get any wooden feel. I do tend to have fairly spirited drives though and even had the discs blue the other day.
Certainly no complaints of the PF's so far but I will wait until I get the car on track to see how they hold up to a bit of real punishment, as brake fade may be an issue. If that happens it will be straight on with a set of AP's or ALCON's I suspect.
14 October 2010, 11:29 PM
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14 October 2010, 11:59 PM
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even though on the zen dyno paper it doesnt seem like a huge increase using methanol, the drive is a lot better , smoother throughout rev range! and the mid range is spot on! good for the country roads!
when you go methanol you dont go back!
i bought a 25 litre drum and its easy to pour in. get a tap for the drum and u'll minimise spillages.
the only problem i had was every stupid petrol can leaking at the spout when pouring it into the car, still havnt found one that doesnt leak! so ive given in and got a funnel and a measuring jug.
shell is 1 mile from my house, i fill up with 20 litres of shell v power, drive home slow (under 2krpm) , stick the tap on my drum and the measuring jug under the tap..bang in 2 litres of methanol down the funnel into the car. then go fro a cruise
when you go methanol you dont go back!
i bought a 25 litre drum and its easy to pour in. get a tap for the drum and u'll minimise spillages.
the only problem i had was every stupid petrol can leaking at the spout when pouring it into the car, still havnt found one that doesnt leak! so ive given in and got a funnel and a measuring jug.
shell is 1 mile from my house, i fill up with 20 litres of shell v power, drive home slow (under 2krpm) , stick the tap on my drum and the measuring jug under the tap..bang in 2 litres of methanol down the funnel into the car. then go fro a cruise
to my understanding meth should go in first then vpower that way it gets mixed better
15 October 2010, 09:48 AM
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Eddy mate,
T - 450 Bhp
T+ - 470 Bhp
V - 500 Bhp
Did I read that right. Your now using meth? I'll find out the name of my can I use. Not leaked once yet.
I'm running 453bhp on my 2.0 EJ207 STi engine. I use trhe car everyday so you tell me when am I going to use the full 453 bhp? You won't. So unless you drive like a complete tool then the engine won't go bang.
Steve
T - 450 Bhp
T+ - 470 Bhp
V - 500 Bhp
Did I read that right. Your now using meth? I'll find out the name of my can I use. Not leaked once yet.
I'm running 453bhp on my 2.0 EJ207 STi engine. I use trhe car everyday so you tell me when am I going to use the full 453 bhp? You won't. So unless you drive like a complete tool then the engine won't go bang.
Steve
15 October 2010, 11:18 AM
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The point is to test the brakes, not the driver, it makes perfect sense.
15 October 2010, 11:52 AM
#74
The biggest problem with PF discs and pads is that most people don't use them enough and they become a little wooden. In back to back tests performed by the MLR using a racing driver to test the PF pad and disc swap against AP and Alcon 6 pot kits, the PF discs and pads outperformed both the aftermarket kits for stopping distance.
Of course if you only drive it hard once and a while, by the time the brakes are back to there best (carbon friction material deposited on the disc) you've backed off and left thinking the brakes aren't as good as they might be. Put an AP 6 pot kit on with DS2500s and the bite is better a lot of the time if you don't use the brakes hard most of the time. Take the 2500s on track HARD and you may run into problems with uneven pad deposits.
Of course if you only drive it hard once and a while, by the time the brakes are back to there best (carbon friction material deposited on the disc) you've backed off and left thinking the brakes aren't as good as they might be. Put an AP 6 pot kit on with DS2500s and the bite is better a lot of the time if you don't use the brakes hard most of the time. Take the 2500s on track HARD and you may run into problems with uneven pad deposits.
The new EBC Bluestuff (NDX) compound is better all around imho and is what we are using here and recommending over the PF.11 pads. Work very well with PF discs.
15 October 2010, 11:54 AM
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Eddy mate,
T - 450 Bhp
T+ - 470 Bhp
V - 500 Bhp
Did I read that right. Your now using meth? I'll find out the name of my can I use. Not leaked once yet.
I'm running 453bhp on my 2.0 EJ207 STi engine. I use trhe car everyday so you tell me when am I going to use the full 453 bhp? You won't. So unless you drive like a complete tool then the engine won't go bang.
Steve
T - 450 Bhp
T+ - 470 Bhp
V - 500 Bhp
Did I read that right. Your now using meth? I'll find out the name of my can I use. Not leaked once yet.
I'm running 453bhp on my 2.0 EJ207 STi engine. I use trhe car everyday so you tell me when am I going to use the full 453 bhp? You won't. So unless you drive like a complete tool then the engine won't go bang.
Steve
if you can find out what can you have that would be great! ive tried those 20litre green military drums and they leak out the spout, doesnt seem to seal properly. when spout is in the petrol cap, anything more than 45 degreees and the car is covered in methanol.bought a stihl see through one and that spout doesnt seem to go on properly so leaks aswell. then bought a 5litre explosafe can which is like a rectangle and such a silly shape, its upside down when pouring into the car and that starts dripping too.
best way i found was measuring jug and funnel, no drips whatsoeevr.
as for putting in the methanol first and it mixing.. your probably right but take 10misn for my car to warm up or thereabouts so that is normally enough time to get it mixed. also duncan put the meth in on the dyno after mapping for straight v power, so he was done after too?
but if i can find a petrol can that doesnt leak, i'd defo change and put it in first.
As for the md321t+ never heard of this. can this be bought from Mark at Lateral?
will look into it.
cheers
15 October 2010, 12:14 PM
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How accurate do you have to be with the Meth?
Say you are mapped for a 20% mix, how do you know you've got exactly 20% in? As if you've got half a tank of V-Power in there, I'm sure everyone's gauges are slightly different in terms of capacity left in the tank. I suppose maybe putting 1 litre more in is better than on litre less?
Say you are mapped for a 20% mix, how do you know you've got exactly 20% in? As if you've got half a tank of V-Power in there, I'm sure everyone's gauges are slightly different in terms of capacity left in the tank. I suppose maybe putting 1 litre more in is better than on litre less?
15 October 2010, 12:18 PM
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15 October 2010, 12:22 PM
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How accurate do you have to be with the Meth?
Say you are mapped for a 20% mix, how do you know you've got exactly 20% in? As if you've got half a tank of V-Power in there, I'm sure everyone's gauges are slightly different in terms of capacity left in the tank. I suppose maybe putting 1 litre more in is better than on litre less?
Say you are mapped for a 20% mix, how do you know you've got exactly 20% in? As if you've got half a tank of V-Power in there, I'm sure everyone's gauges are slightly different in terms of capacity left in the tank. I suppose maybe putting 1 litre more in is better than on litre less?
I just stick to 20vpower 3 meth.
he also said not to worry too much, just make sure the mix of the fuel i stick in at the time is correct i.e. if i fill up at quarter tank.. then make sure i the fuel i put in is mixed right. i tend to run it to the petrol light every now and again just to get the mix more accurate but he's never told me to do that.
the one time i stuck in too much meth.. i got a nice blue fireball on the motorway which was a few inches long.. got my mate off my bumper
(this was i think- 2 litres too much)
15 October 2010, 12:34 PM
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lol i need to test this jerrycan out, the reason i never bought one oft hose green ones is because i couldnt see the meth inside it, so bought a see thru can so i could mark up how much goes in, i'll just use the jug i guess
15 October 2010, 08:07 PM
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Eddy,
I used mine today and the one I use is a Stihl see through can too. Never had any problems with the spout.
Screw it on, twist the spout then do the screw end up again. Job done.
I don't worry too much if I am a little bit out on of my petrol/meth mix. If I am on the Petrol mix only I wait for the petrol light to come on and give it another 10miles or so. Being on the switchable maps on the Simtek I have the choice if to fill up with a little bit of fuel to get me by if I haven't got my can of meth in the boot or I simply go to a Shell Garage put the meth in.....fill it with V Power and away I go. I tend to leave it on the lower boost map to make sure I flush out the system a little before I switch it onto the high boost map.
I have in the past also added a futher 3 ltrs of meth to my tank once at just under half a tank as I wanted to make sure I flush the 95ron out. No det lights or anything.
The mapper will allow that odd % outside of the map and I have faith in JGM so not to fussed.
In terms of what difference a meth map makes.
402bhp / 359 lbft (V Power)
411bhp / 375 lbft (V Power + 5 ltrs of Meth)
Hope that helps someone who is thinking of this too.
Steve
I used mine today and the one I use is a Stihl see through can too. Never had any problems with the spout.
Screw it on, twist the spout then do the screw end up again. Job done.
I don't worry too much if I am a little bit out on of my petrol/meth mix. If I am on the Petrol mix only I wait for the petrol light to come on and give it another 10miles or so. Being on the switchable maps on the Simtek I have the choice if to fill up with a little bit of fuel to get me by if I haven't got my can of meth in the boot or I simply go to a Shell Garage put the meth in.....fill it with V Power and away I go. I tend to leave it on the lower boost map to make sure I flush out the system a little before I switch it onto the high boost map.
I have in the past also added a futher 3 ltrs of meth to my tank once at just under half a tank as I wanted to make sure I flush the 95ron out. No det lights or anything.
The mapper will allow that odd % outside of the map and I have faith in JGM so not to fussed.
In terms of what difference a meth map makes.
402bhp / 359 lbft (V Power)
411bhp / 375 lbft (V Power + 5 ltrs of Meth)
Hope that helps someone who is thinking of this too.
Steve
Last edited by Stevesbluewrx; 15 October 2010 at 08:26 PM.
15 October 2010, 08:33 PM
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I have a 321t on a forged 2.0 and it made 453/425 on v power and with 10 lit of meth added to a full tank it made 481/450.Well worth it considering it is less than half the price of v power. With Harveys uppipe on gt spec headers it sees full boost of 2bar at about 3500 so still quite lively low down for a 2.0