mutant_matt

Luke,

I have read the recommendations and have measured the resistance from various parts of the engine back to the Negative terminal on the battery:

Battery side of the bay e.g Manifold, Alternator, A/C Condenser, near side Inntercooler bracket = 0.3 ohms

Off side e.g. ABS unit, Master Cylinder, Manifold, Turbo etc 0.4-0.5 ohms.

Are you saying that this is enough resistance to make a difference to the sensors that the ECU relies on?

Matt.

obi

[QUOTE]Originally posted by legacyb4:
[B]Luke,

My friend Paul started with 70 amp wire, but I'd have to say stick with 80 amp or larger for the wiring job.

I'm having the 7 point earthing put on my 97' RS saloon tomorrow so I'll post some opinions on the result. I agree that you should use 80+ amp wire for lower resistance.

obi

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by obi:
<B>

obi

Interesting..my added quotes didn't appear to get included in the last post, so I'll repeat them.

The 7 point additional earthing is excellent and you should do it tomorrow.

I used 100 amp wire for the short runs and 220 double insulation for the longer runs. Made up a simple bracket to support the attachments to the negative terminal.

As a result:
The engine picks up earlier
The lag has almost disappeared
Music has improved

Why wait, do it now..now..now

Obi

Ed Hodgson

I did the earthing job last weekend on my B4 We got to 6 points (wasn't sure about exactly where to do the alternator so left it out)

I've done about 1000 miles this week, mainly motorway, & first impressions are:

no improvement in fuel economy - still varies wildly from 19-20 up to 28/29 mpg depending how you drive it.

idle when warm improved - but still sometimes a bit hesitant. i have noticed that when you start the car whan warm, it can die in the first 10 seconds.

pick up improved at low revs, & transition between 2 turbos at small/medium throttle openings improved. This is the major difference

I think it's hard to remain objective about these things.I only had the car for a couple of weeks before I did this, so I reckon I need to disconnect the extra wiring in a couple of weeks to really be sure. (yes Jeff I think you should do it first )

I've got to go to Norwich & back on Monday (from Derby), so the cross-country trip gives me a chance to do some more "testing"

Ed

legacyb4

Well, we finally managed to get another B4 owner out here wired up; in the process, we realized that the lead to the strut tower bar closest to the battery may not be necessary as it looks like the wire that is currently hooked up actually leads to the rear of the engine block.

However, there is another wired spot (12 cm bolt) that sits between the front and back bolts of the intake manifold which has a hefty bunch of wires disappearing into the bowels of the car... maybe that's worth investigating?

Cheers.

mcrae hater

HARDY - hope you're reading this. You can do this earthing job to our Legacys this weekend (mine 1st)

MCRAE HATER 2

HARPS, I HAVE GOT A SET OF GOOD JUMP LEADS,I RECON THEYL DO THE JOB NICELY, JUST NEED TO GET SOME DIFFERENT TERMINALS FOR THE ENDS. THEN WEEL BE WHARP SPEED.

mcrae hater

HARDY you do the work - i'll get the cups of tea (& keep sarah busy while you're in the garage ho ho)ps you going to motor club thurs?

MCRAE HATER 2

HARPS, MUST KEEP UP WITH THE TWIN TURBO GUYS UP YONDA SO IM TRYING ANOTHER BOOST MOD ON MY LEGACY THIS WEEKEND, THE GOOD OLD WASTEGATE SOLENOID ONLY GIVES ME 15PSI BOOST FOR A COUPLE OF SECONDS THEN CUTS BACK TO 10PSI. I RECON DITCH THE SOLENOID AND REPLACE WITH A BLEED VALVE, SO TO KEEP MAX BOOST. HOPEFULLY OUR SINGLE WHISTLERS WILL KEEP UP. ANY ONE ELSE TRIED THIS?. PS WHEN DO I BECOME A SCOOBY REGULAR. + (SARAHS EXPENSIVE). THURSDAY MAYBE.

Legacy GTB

As a matter of interest, when I got my GTB back from it's MAJOR motor rebuild, it felt mighty odd.

I admit that the car felt odd after not driving it for nearly 3 months. There was also a large degree of paranoia that the same thing could happen again, as nobody really knows what caused the meltdown, but it just felt strange. The auto was shifting in different places and the engine felt peculiar, with a distinct lack of boost.

The Subaru dealer said that they had reset the computers to factory standard and that as they were an 'adaptive' or 'learning' computer, that the car needed to learn how I drive all over again! By any chance was he feeding me a fib of epic proportions, or does the current model B4 & GTB really have such software????

I don't know whether I can really believe him or not, but the car is beginning to feel a little more normal. Perhaps the learning computer is really the driver getting used to the car again?

Richard

Stupot

Rich, do a search on ECU reset on this site and that should make u feel better
Cheers
Stu

Grant.revan

Hi Jeff,

I have been a long time visitor to your web site and have enjoyed your photo gallery. Now you turn up on the UK boards. I have been looking at the Earthing solution and would make the following comments.

Running 4 lines to different points on the inlet manifold is exactly the same as running one wire of 4 times the thickness to a single point on the manifold. Personally I do not believe that there is any percievable benefit in using wire rated above 50 amps.

Secondly the one earth strap that would make the best impact is the short one from the battery to the wing. This is quite skinny and is probably responsible for the largest voltage drop. Either adding a second or just replacing this one with a thicker one would probably have an immediate impact.

In short a 2 POINT QUICK fix is to add a link to the front wing and to the nearest manifold point and this will probably have the same benefit as the 7 point solution.

I have some knowledge in electronics and the final thing is to ensure all earth points get some WD40 now and then to ensure moisture is kept out. (The tractor story posted by another user probably just dried out the connections.)

PS I drive a silver B4, live in Staines, get the car serviced by an approved Subaru Dealer and got mine from Track Marques for £23,500. Awesome car.

Legacy GTB

Well, my paranoia has won out and the car is back at Subaru. Again. I've owned it for 11 months and it's spent nearly 3 months in the shop being fixed.

Tis time it felt low on power, then began idling poorly, then was only any good at high revs and now scarcely could struggle it's way out of a soggy paper bag under it's own strength. To add insult to injury, there's a very strong smell of sulphur at the exhaust and for a change it's not the driver after a good vindaloo!

I'm picking a naff cat converter. Any ideas or opinions?

Richard

Grant.revan

Jeff,

I put in a 2 point earthing mod over the weekend. I purchased 2 ready made black earthing straps for the huge cost of £4 the pair.(About 8mm diameter) One was 12" the other 18" I connected one in parallel with the existing skinny link from the battery to the nearest wing and the other I took to the nearest manifold point.

The improvement to the stereo output was immediately noticeable. As has been said already the Bass is now really punchy and the highs have taken on a new level of clarity.

The engine feels smoother at low revs but this is very hard to judge. I will know more after I have been able to drive it some more.

I was interested to see that subaru are aware of this problem as my car has earth straps (albeit skinny ones) from both sides of the manifold to the fixings just next to the suspension mounts. This still means that the main route to the battery earth would be via the Starter motor earth and the skinny strap to the wing closest to the battery. I notice that no one else has done the shortest link replacement that I have put in. This is the obvious mod to make as the voltage drop across the car bodywork to other parts of the car should therefore be minimal.(Voltage drop will be largest across thin links such as wires -smallest across thick sections such as chassis or bodywork.)
I my invest in another £2 strap just to link the other wing to the manifold as well, just to make sure. The nice thing about my mods is that the longest wire is 18" and does not require cables running all over the engine. Certainly black wiring is in keeping with the rest of the car and I have used black cable ties to secure everything neatly.

I took a soldering iron to all the crimped joints and allowed the solder a long time to run into the connections to get a perfect joint that is both electrically good and physically very strong.

Next mod is the prova links. They look like you can change them yourself but does the suspension spring open when you remove the existing links? Do you need to strap the suspension in place to prevent this?

Ed Hodgson

Grant - do you know where you can source the Prova links in the UK?

I've noticed a couple of times what might be described as a "wobble" in a corner - almost feels like the tyre wall is flexing. Is this what the links will sort out?


<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Grant.revan:

Next mod is the prova links. They look like you can change them yourself but does the suspension spring open when you remove the existing links? Do you need to strap the suspension in place to prevent this?

[/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

legacyb4

Ed,

The links will help keep your car flatter on all fours as well as reducing the front to rear pitching and rolling that you feel in corners. They will also improve braking as the car sits much more evenly on all fours as well...

Further reducing body flex with various bolt-on parts such as lower arm bars and front/rear tower bars further reduces the effect although you sacrifice some road noise due to more direct contact with the road.

I've got my chassis stiffened up and suspension tightened to the point where it *is* the tyres that are flexing, and short of buying a new set, the best that I can do on my RE010's is to ride inflated at 2.6-2.8 or so.

Cheers.

Grant.revan

You can order them direct from Japan via email using a credit card. I emailed them in English and they responded in kind.

Go to Jeff Tsai's unofficial B4 web site for the full low down including pictures of the Links in situ. (It's a great site) He lists the URL for Prova there.

Ed Hodgson

Grant

I will be very interested to hear how you get on (and how long they take to ship). Let me know when you've done it.

Ed

TURBO7379

Looking at the photos of these Prova links they look like nothing more than 2 rose joints connected by a piece of threaded rod with 2 lock nuts . I would like to get a close look at one of these joints for if they are what they look like I could make and sell them for half of that and still make a good profit . You can buy the rose joints from any good motorsports supplier and the rest from a hardware shop along with some high tensile bolts and spacers for mounting them . Anyone got a spare one they can send me ?

legacyb4

Turbo,

If you feel up to the challenge, you could try doing what this guy did.

Here's a link from someone who cooked up his own links using available...

Grant.revan

Ed,

I have just paid out £900 for my insurance and have to get two new front tyres at £120 each (Bloody good price for SO2's fitted)and so I will leave the links until at least May but I will let you know once I get them

Ed Hodgson

First job for me is front brakes -
Replacing discs & pads with Group N discs & DS3000 pads (I know I need to keep the wheels clean with these pads) Will cost around £400.

Braking feel & power certainly could do with some improvement, so let's hope this does the trick.

next step will be to stick 4 pot calipers on - see how it goes with new discs & pads first.

I found out that although the car has 2 pot calipers, the discs are the same as for 4 pots, so it's an easy upgrade. Perhaps fluid & hoses then as well.

Better go & sell some stuff to pay for all this

Ed