Sub-Letting Fee - Pier Management
12 April 2010, 08:46 PM
#31
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do it, keep me updated.
13 April 2010, 07:16 AM
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05 May 2010, 04:41 PM
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Hi, Here's the shortened version of my update.
I am in correspondence with Mr. David Bland LL.B (Hons). Head of Legal Services and Executive Assistant to Mr. G Cooper (Managing Director) no lees. How's that for posh.
I emailed PM to question some of the legal jargon, as well as my refund, on their paperwork and Mr. Bland has informed me that the demand for sub-letting fees are set out in accordance with the Commonhold & Freehold Reform Act 2002 Section 166. On checking this I see it relates to 'rent' & not sub-letting fees so I have asked him to advise me where in this act it mentions 'sub-leeting'fees. I have also asked him to explain why PM sent me a letter in January last telling me 'in accordance with my lease' I needed to pay these fees when clearly I didn't. My argument being if they had done their job in the first place I wouldn't have had to consult my solicitor.
I have also asked the question is it their practice to send out these demands ad hoc and it's up to the landlord to question PM about their liability to pay as Mr Bland has said it was a simple error on their side, but a simple error is a one off not sending me 3 demands along with other landlords who appear to have had the same letters with the same outcome - they are not liable.
By the way I have just received 3 demands for my ground round and this year they have added £4.95 to each one as a charge for: Annual Charge, P&P and Bank Charges!! Another cost I shall be disputing.
Waiting to hear from Mr. Bland - watch this space.
TC
I am in correspondence with Mr. David Bland LL.B (Hons). Head of Legal Services and Executive Assistant to Mr. G Cooper (Managing Director) no lees. How's that for posh.
I emailed PM to question some of the legal jargon, as well as my refund, on their paperwork and Mr. Bland has informed me that the demand for sub-letting fees are set out in accordance with the Commonhold & Freehold Reform Act 2002 Section 166. On checking this I see it relates to 'rent' & not sub-letting fees so I have asked him to advise me where in this act it mentions 'sub-leeting'fees. I have also asked him to explain why PM sent me a letter in January last telling me 'in accordance with my lease' I needed to pay these fees when clearly I didn't. My argument being if they had done their job in the first place I wouldn't have had to consult my solicitor.
I have also asked the question is it their practice to send out these demands ad hoc and it's up to the landlord to question PM about their liability to pay as Mr Bland has said it was a simple error on their side, but a simple error is a one off not sending me 3 demands along with other landlords who appear to have had the same letters with the same outcome - they are not liable.
By the way I have just received 3 demands for my ground round and this year they have added £4.95 to each one as a charge for: Annual Charge, P&P and Bank Charges!! Another cost I shall be disputing.
Waiting to hear from Mr. Bland - watch this space.
TC
05 May 2010, 07:19 PM
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blink eck, it all get worse!
05 May 2010, 08:14 PM
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I have been very polite and told them how it is and explained that I am a little confused with their procedures and thanked Mr Bland for his assistance and patience so we shall see.
TC
TC
13 May 2010, 04:54 PM
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Hello..........new to this forum.
Have been dealing with pier for some years now, and have had similar situations re. fee for sub letting. Again, according to lease there is no requirement on my part to inform them. This they disputed with a quote from a section in the lease which was (to the layman) fairly unintelligible. Luckily, I came across a very helpful solicitor who seemed to relish confronting this organisation, and gave me help free of charge!! Pier immediately backed down.
Have also received request for £4.95 and will tell them there is nowhere in the lease that I am liable to fund their costs of doing business.
Good luck.
Have been dealing with pier for some years now, and have had similar situations re. fee for sub letting. Again, according to lease there is no requirement on my part to inform them. This they disputed with a quote from a section in the lease which was (to the layman) fairly unintelligible. Luckily, I came across a very helpful solicitor who seemed to relish confronting this organisation, and gave me help free of charge!! Pier immediately backed down.
Have also received request for £4.95 and will tell them there is nowhere in the lease that I am liable to fund their costs of doing business.
Good luck.
13 May 2010, 05:27 PM
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Pier
Hi,
Thanks for that I had intended to hold back the £4.95's and ask them to provide evidence that I am liable for them. It will be interesting to see if they say that it was 'a simple error' again.
As expected I have not heard from Mr. Bland. Like you they tried to throw the legal jargon at me re the Commonhold & Freehold Reform Act but as I have gone back questioning them I think they will ignore me.
I will keep you in the loop.
Cheers.
TC
Thanks for that I had intended to hold back the £4.95's and ask them to provide evidence that I am liable for them. It will be interesting to see if they say that it was 'a simple error' again.
As expected I have not heard from Mr. Bland. Like you they tried to throw the legal jargon at me re the Commonhold & Freehold Reform Act but as I have gone back questioning them I think they will ignore me.
I will keep you in the loop.
Cheers.
TC
13 May 2010, 07:42 PM
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whats the £4.95 for?
14 May 2010, 10:45 AM
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Has appeared on my Half yearly ground rent demand as "Annual Fee P&P Bank Chrgs"
Back in December 2008 they added an "Admin Fee" of £6.33 to the demand, and then had the gall to add that "as a seasonal gesture of goodwill" they would waive it if payment was received on time!!!!
Back in December 2008 they added an "Admin Fee" of £6.33 to the demand, and then had the gall to add that "as a seasonal gesture of goodwill" they would waive it if payment was received on time!!!!
14 May 2010, 12:45 PM
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14 May 2010, 01:16 PM
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Thanks for that I have checked this site out recently and there are posts regarding my sub-letting fee probs. Looks like they are at it again.
From what I understand the freeholders of my property are Regis plc who also own Pier Management. I see they are quoting the old chestnut 'in accordance with the Commonhold & Freehold Reform Act again. If you google it you can get a copy to print off which is useful for reference for any further queries. That's how I found out that sub-letting fees are not mentioned specifically in it.
TC
From what I understand the freeholders of my property are Regis plc who also own Pier Management. I see they are quoting the old chestnut 'in accordance with the Commonhold & Freehold Reform Act again. If you google it you can get a copy to print off which is useful for reference for any further queries. That's how I found out that sub-letting fees are not mentioned specifically in it.
TC
21 May 2010, 04:25 PM
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Hi all, new to this forum!
I recently joined UK Leashold Forum, due to all the problems with Pier Management Ltd - and all the linked companies.
Question for thenailqueen, re: your post from the 5th May. Who is David Bland and G. Cooper, are they directors of Pier.M?
I recently joined UK Leashold Forum, due to all the problems with Pier Management Ltd - and all the linked companies.
Question for thenailqueen, re: your post from the 5th May. Who is David Bland and G. Cooper, are they directors of Pier.M?
21 May 2010, 06:40 PM
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Pier Management
Hi,
David Bland is 'Head of Legal Dept & Executive Assistant to George Cooper Managing Director'.
It appears that he is ignoring me know which is what I have been told to expect.
Another management company who I questioned are also ignoring me so far.
What's your problem with P.M?
TC
David Bland is 'Head of Legal Dept & Executive Assistant to George Cooper Managing Director'.
It appears that he is ignoring me know which is what I have been told to expect.
Another management company who I questioned are also ignoring me so far.
What's your problem with P.M?
TC
21 May 2010, 07:50 PM
#48
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I'm finding it interesting new members finding the Pier thread through internet search, how good is SN?
26 May 2010, 04:46 PM
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Pier Management
Hi TNQ,
My/our problems started when our freehold was sold in 2002 to Long Term Reversions LTD and DGA took over as their managing agents - although from info at Companies House they both had the same directors, so were obviously all part of the same company.
Most recently, I'm challenging Pier.M new annual admin charge for P&P/bank charges, etc; and a neighbour of mine had had the demands over the last 2yrs for the subletting fee, which he's refused to pay. There is no provision in our leases for them to levy either of these charges. I just written to Pier for a third time stating the legal advice I received from solicitors and the Leasehold Advisory Service - so, I'm waiting to see what their reply is this time. As you say, they have been quoting 'the old chestnut' again; and from this forum/site, and many others I found by Googling Pier Management, 'the old chestnut' has had some extreme outings. There are many, many, very unhappy leaseholders with Pier.M and all the associated companies and freholders.
Bye for now.
My/our problems started when our freehold was sold in 2002 to Long Term Reversions LTD and DGA took over as their managing agents - although from info at Companies House they both had the same directors, so were obviously all part of the same company.
Most recently, I'm challenging Pier.M new annual admin charge for P&P/bank charges, etc; and a neighbour of mine had had the demands over the last 2yrs for the subletting fee, which he's refused to pay. There is no provision in our leases for them to levy either of these charges. I just written to Pier for a third time stating the legal advice I received from solicitors and the Leasehold Advisory Service - so, I'm waiting to see what their reply is this time. As you say, they have been quoting 'the old chestnut' again; and from this forum/site, and many others I found by Googling Pier Management, 'the old chestnut' has had some extreme outings. There are many, many, very unhappy leaseholders with Pier.M and all the associated companies and freholders.
Bye for now.
01 June 2010, 11:58 AM
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Pier Management - ground rents
Hi
Very interesting reading about the sub letting fees they are extortionate and came out of the blue i have ignored them .My lease says nothing about paying extra fees for a sub let . It was good to see a copy of the letter withdrawing their request when they were challenged about the fees . It comes as a great relief.
But this year they have asked for the ground rents and have tried to sneak in a £4.95 admin fees per flat ( i have Two) actually states on the invoice it is an Annual Fee P&P Bank Chrgs. i have rung up and asked for an explantion as to why there is a charge when there never has been a charge before . They have asked me to put my complaint in writing which i have today. I refuse to pay them a procesisng bank fees , they are appointed to collect the ground rent of £ 250 and not to add on charges for doing so . Has anyone experienced the same? Oh I can see that Anne has challenged it also.
Very interesting reading about the sub letting fees they are extortionate and came out of the blue i have ignored them .My lease says nothing about paying extra fees for a sub let . It was good to see a copy of the letter withdrawing their request when they were challenged about the fees . It comes as a great relief.
But this year they have asked for the ground rents and have tried to sneak in a £4.95 admin fees per flat ( i have Two) actually states on the invoice it is an Annual Fee P&P Bank Chrgs. i have rung up and asked for an explantion as to why there is a charge when there never has been a charge before . They have asked me to put my complaint in writing which i have today. I refuse to pay them a procesisng bank fees , they are appointed to collect the ground rent of £ 250 and not to add on charges for doing so . Has anyone experienced the same? Oh I can see that Anne has challenged it also.
Last edited by madoona; 01 June 2010 at 12:03 PM.
01 June 2010, 05:44 PM
#51
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keep us updated on what responce you get from your letter regarding the P&P Bank charge,
as said earlier your lease no doubt doesn't say you have to pay the fees to a ground rent bill.
as said earlier your lease no doubt doesn't say you have to pay the fees to a ground rent bill.
01 June 2010, 06:06 PM
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Hi salsa king they have responded and its the stock answer I was expecting- see below:
Please be advised, the annual administration fee is levied in accordance with the commonhold & leasehold reform act. Your Freeholder can charge a small, reasonable administration fee, for the provision of documentation and collection of charges.
My answer is going to be that the provision of documentation relates to duplicates and collection of charges relates to if you are late paying. I paid today bang on the button due 1st June. So I will go back to Marc Cutler who is head of Credit Control and tell him that . I saw this information on another website UK Leasehold Forum. Check it out !!!
Please be advised, the annual administration fee is levied in accordance with the commonhold & leasehold reform act. Your Freeholder can charge a small, reasonable administration fee, for the provision of documentation and collection of charges.
My answer is going to be that the provision of documentation relates to duplicates and collection of charges relates to if you are late paying. I paid today bang on the button due 1st June. So I will go back to Marc Cutler who is head of Credit Control and tell him that . I saw this information on another website UK Leasehold Forum. Check it out !!!
01 June 2010, 06:30 PM
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any links you can post up for ppl?
01 June 2010, 06:52 PM
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Pier Management LTD
Hello madoona!
I was just going to direct you to the UK Leasehold Forum but I see you've found it, I joined a couple of weeks ago and have found it heplful and a relief to know others have challenged Pier.M and their other linked companies.
I followed the advice of a previous solicitor; the Leasehold Advisory Service and arisaig - who is also on the UK Leasehold Forum.
The Leasehold Advisory Service advised that Pier are interpreting and applying the Act they're quoting entirely incorrectly; also the Act does not take precedence over your lease. Pier have sent the same reply to many people when they challenge their fees. They don't answer my questions re: where in my lease does it state they can charge the fees; nor respond to the legal advice I quoted i.e. they are interpreting/applying the Act incorrectly. I hope you have found the answers you were looking for.
Bye for now!
I was just going to direct you to the UK Leasehold Forum but I see you've found it, I joined a couple of weeks ago and have found it heplful and a relief to know others have challenged Pier.M and their other linked companies.
I followed the advice of a previous solicitor; the Leasehold Advisory Service and arisaig - who is also on the UK Leasehold Forum.
The Leasehold Advisory Service advised that Pier are interpreting and applying the Act they're quoting entirely incorrectly; also the Act does not take precedence over your lease. Pier have sent the same reply to many people when they challenge their fees. They don't answer my questions re: where in my lease does it state they can charge the fees; nor respond to the legal advice I quoted i.e. they are interpreting/applying the Act incorrectly. I hope you have found the answers you were looking for.
Bye for now!
01 June 2010, 11:53 PM
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Dear Anne thanks for your message . You will not believe how grateful I am to have found out that other people are fighting Pier Management. They are rip off merchants and the others linked to them are the same ie CPM who collect my management fees. Since my purchase of my flats in 2005 my life has been pergatory because of these two companies not to mention Regis Sport. The solictor that got me into this portfolio deal has been shut down by the SRA.( another crook) I can't wait until i get rid of the last two flats that I own just so that i never have to speak or deal with Pier management or CPM ever again in my life. I feel sorry for anyone who has to deal with them on a long term basis.
09 November 2011, 11:34 PM
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Pier Management
Hello ALL,
I am new to this exciting forum and I am glad that there are other peoplewho suffer under the money making scam by Pier Management.
I have a small flat and two management companies one for ground rent andbuilding insurance and the other for maintenance which literally do not do anywork, repair, service, decoration other than collecting money.
Yesterday O received a surprising letter from PM and asking me to make apayment for £50 and when I enquiry about it I was told this an additionalcharge for late payment.
I did make late payment but the trouble is that on the day that I made thepayment I was told about the additional charge for late payment but the personon the phone agreed to waive the charge and this is was in June and now we arein November and they are saying that i have not paid this charge and I can notprove it because I do not know the name of the person.
I am now writing a letter to PM but not sure who I should write and what todo here..
thanks
I am new to this exciting forum and I am glad that there are other peoplewho suffer under the money making scam by Pier Management.
I have a small flat and two management companies one for ground rent andbuilding insurance and the other for maintenance which literally do not do anywork, repair, service, decoration other than collecting money.
Yesterday O received a surprising letter from PM and asking me to make apayment for £50 and when I enquiry about it I was told this an additionalcharge for late payment.
I did make late payment but the trouble is that on the day that I made thepayment I was told about the additional charge for late payment but the personon the phone agreed to waive the charge and this is was in June and now we arein November and they are saying that i have not paid this charge and I can notprove it because I do not know the name of the person.
I am now writing a letter to PM but not sure who I should write and what todo here..
thanks
10 November 2011, 07:08 AM
#59
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scoobedo,
where is your flat?
speak to the acounts dept... ask for Mr Cutler.
If you were late paying.. and have no proof/name of the person who waive the extra fee you're a bit over a barrel.
Always get the name of the person you speak to, write down dates and time too.
where is your flat?
speak to the acounts dept... ask for Mr Cutler.
If you were late paying.. and have no proof/name of the person who waive the extra fee you're a bit over a barrel.
Always get the name of the person you speak to, write down dates and time too.
10 November 2011, 03:06 PM
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Sounds like typical Pier behaviour. But, as salsa-king says they do appear to have you on this one. You could appeal to their better nature (ho ho) but in my experience they wouldn't know what one is let alone possess one.
You really have to keep on top of them, know when any payments are due and make sure they get there on time. If any demands for unexpected payments turn up in future do what you are doing this time and search the web. It has saved me from their clutches a few times.
As for your problems re. maintenance, a good place to start might be here: www.lease-advice.org a service funded by us the taxpayer, and free to use.
Good luck, keep us informed.
You really have to keep on top of them, know when any payments are due and make sure they get there on time. If any demands for unexpected payments turn up in future do what you are doing this time and search the web. It has saved me from their clutches a few times.
As for your problems re. maintenance, a good place to start might be here: www.lease-advice.org a service funded by us the taxpayer, and free to use.
Good luck, keep us informed.