Gav

Funkii Munkii

I'll take the 3 pts

pauld37

Hmmm, you might have beaten the first team by more

Funkii Munkii

Another inept display, midfield seems devoid of any idea's or creation...

Moley

iTrader: (9)

Good to hear Hargreaves played 90 mins in a reserve game, could really do with him right now

STi wanna Subaru

iTrader: (1)

United need a leader on the pitch and they currently don't have one. Rio is the best man for the job so it's imperative he's back fit sooner rather than later.

Funkii Munkii

Not the answer imo, even if he is back it wont change a thing, United have had one decent performance all season, away to Spurs.

F*ck knows how we are 2nd

STi wanna Subaru

iTrader: (1)

I'm not saying it's the answer just vital there is somebody on the pitch when not going well to sort things and give players a kick up the ****. Last years success was built on the defence.

urban

iTrader: (1)

I know - all logic says we shouldn't be 2nd, but we are.

But unless we get out act together we won't be for much longer.

FlightMan

Chelsea will walk away with the league this season, imho.

United just arent the team they were, Arsenal still look lightweight to me and the rest are just playing for 4th, and have been since October.

From the press reports it seems like the peasants are revolting over the Glazers. I wonder what the next turn in this saga will be?

Rooney to Spain for £60,000,000?

Aaron1978

iTrader: (12)

You'll find Torres wil go play club football in spain before Rooney, if you believe what the media say then without the £80m from Ronaldo United would have made a £40m(or there abouts) loss! So without the loan interest repayments they're breaking even

If that is the case then the Glazers will be selling soon as they won't want to lose the amount of money they have in the club, and as i've said before there will be no lack of iterested partys to buy a club that makes money with ease.

At least Uniteds owners and manager know what their doing

chris1scouser

Stop your crying, you's are second and not playing well. Look where we are and we're playing pure sh!te.
Zonal marking is our gift to all other teams!
Having RB as the manager is just charity.

Aaron1978

iTrader: (12)

Who's whining

Tbh i've been saying that we're in second playing sh*te, but we have been very fortunate up until now and this is the point in the season where you need to start playing well.

Chris just a question and i'm not baiting you mate but what did you think to RB interview straight after the stoke game, that was verging on 'lost the plot' IMHO.

i agree with the zonal marking, the stats with set piece goals is quite amazing for a top 4 team (well i say top 4). Although we're not much better and we're man to man

Aaron

chris1scouser

He's deluded, he is terrified to play football.
Square pass philosophy.
In the last few games we've needed an attacking player to come on and change the game he brings Aurelio on.
He dwells in a parallel dimension he's that out of touch. Whatever happened to pass and move?
I fear if he stays he could set us back many many years. ala Souness.

belliott69

iTrader: (3)

i don't know of any other club who could stick with a manger like benitez for as long as liverpool have, started promising with alot of players bought by houllier then sold loads and bought too many unknowns. when its reported gerrard wants to go shows there is something very wrong there.

Gav

The Glazers won't loose money, thats the point. The debt is against ManU and not the Glazers personally

Won't be long until we have an Arab owning us too!

Aaron1978

iTrader: (12)

No, only part of the debt was taken out against manu, so in effect if they can't keep the repayments up then the banks or whoever will take the club. In order for the Glazers to take over manu they had to buy alot of shares to force the takeover through so have invested alot of money. Like if you get your house repo'd, you'll lose what money you've invested ie deposit etc. I would be very surprised if this bond scheme what has been mentioned doesn't go ahead that United is not sold for a £1bn, thats probably going to make them more profit than owning it for the next 10-15 years.

Aaron

FlightMan

The Glazer family, the owners of Manchester United, are struggling to refinance their enormous debts amid concerns about the impact they are having on the club.

The Times understands that the Americans have been trying unsuccessfully to secure a refinancing package for part of the club’s £699 million debt for months, having failed in 2007 and last year, because of the bleak global economic climate.

Fans’ groups have cast doubt over whether they will ever see the £80 million raised from the sale of Cristiano Ronaldo, the Portugal forward, to Real Madrid last summer reinvested in the squad.

Dragan Djuric, the Partizan Belgrade president, meanwhile claimed this week that United pulled the plug on a deal to sign Adem Ljajic, the Serbia Under-21 midfield player, because “maybe they are in financial crisis”.

It is these so-called Payment In Kind (PIK) notes, money borrowed from US hedge funds that “rolls up” at an annual interest rate of 14.25 per cent, that the Americans are believed to have been trying to refinance.

The intention was always to pay off these loans within a few years of the takeover in May 2005, but while they managed to redeem some of the original PIK debt of £275 million, the credit crunch has made this difficult.

By the time the debt matures in 2017, it will stand at £580 million unless the Glazers can pay part or all of it off before then, or secure a preferential rate of interest. With the club also facing rising capital repayments from 2013, the PIK debt is a concern. It grew from £152 million to £175.5 million in one financial year.

So, it's all looking good then?

Aaron1978

iTrader: (12)

Of course it's not good just remember that its Glazers loans that are costing the club money, not the club itself losing money via its revenue. This bond scheme will raise enough money (£500m) to clear the £202m (i think its that amount now) thats currently repayed at the 14.25%. If the glazers can't refinance which i hope they can't then they will be forced to sell or risk losing their massive investment. United have also just secured a revolving credit facilty(overdraft for you scousers) of £75m which can be used for transfers.

Where as down the M62 there is a club that need a new stadium, with owners with no money that coudn't find a buyer for the club with a manager that has seriously lost it. The problem there is unless he resigns which lets face it he is never going to do because he lives in his own dreamworld, you can't afford to sack him.

So in answer to your question, it could be a hell of a lot worse.

Aaron

FlightMan

If you want to throw mud at LFC, there's a thread for that.

I think we're seeing the start of a decline in Man Utd's reign. Money is the key nowadays, and Utd patently aren't the financial powerhouse they were 3/4 years ago.

The Glazer's have sowed the seeds of ruination I'm afraid.

Aaron1978

iTrader: (12)

Seriously, it's really boring doing that now. It's like groundhog day in there now with whats posted and that's from LFC fans, I get depressed even going in there with the doom and gloom

Man Utd will come out of this simply because of how much money they make, they are a huge brand wordwide worth £1bn regardless of how much debt the Glazers are in. Its like groundhog day saying this in here sometimes Obviously i want them gone because what they are doing to United is not good as there taking alot of money out of it that could be used on the club and signing new players. Man Utd as a debt free club or with the Glazers can't compete against Chelsea or Man City in the transfer market, or even Real anyway so nothing has changed there.

Maybe your right and we're doomed

FlightMan

Glad to see you've seen sense.

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

And they use to say Ronaldo could dive..... (and it was outside the box)

Tony

STi wanna Subaru

iTrader: (1)

Fair play to Tevez but I cant help feeling he wont have much to complain about if he gets knobbled in the 2nd leg. Uniteds lack of creativity in central mid worries me but so does Fergie liking Rooney at the top of a 4-5-1. Oh well the poor form continues.... which I think it will all season.

Funkii Munkii

I'll just save an use this quote as required

Gav

I agree, we were very poor in the centre and Rooney on his own is not the way forward. Owen didn't do much when he came on either, Diouf looks good though and created himself a couple of chances in the limited time he was on

Can't help but feel we need a Keane type player to drive the midfield on...

STi wanna Subaru

iTrader: (1)

a fit Hargreaves would bring that much needed energy with ability to midfield. We still need that little spark of creativity in the centre. 'We need Casc Fabregas.... We need Cesc Fabregas..... '

Gav

Haha Cesc would be perfect, can't see him leaving sadly and we have'nt got the till to put a huge offer in for him

I agree on Hargreaves, he's exactly what we need in the centre. I rate Carrick highly but he doesnt have the drive we need. Anderson is full of energy and put's himself about well but he just needs to refine his skills a bit. I think in a couple of seasons Anderson will be awesome

FlightMan

Anyway, back on topic.

Debts at the parent company of Manchester United have increased to £716.5m ($1.17bn), according to its latest accounts.
The company, called Red Football Joint Venture, is owned by the Glazer family and secures its debts against the football club.
The accounts, for the year to June 2009, show United's debts passing £700m for the first time.
More than £68m was paid in interest alone, the accounts show.

So, the club worth £1 billion, has a net value of less than £300.

Shocking.

Aaron1978

iTrader: (12)

Read what you wrote and then think about what you wrote in your closing statement

If someone bought the club tomorrow they wouldn't buy the debt you as in your own words it is the parent companys debt using United as collateral. Just like if you owe finance on your car say a £25k one that you owe £20k on, if you come to sell it your not going to sell it for the £5k its worth to you but how much it is actually worth and then pay off the remaining debt secured against it.

Just like most scousers you should really have listened at school more, or has all that altitude affected your brain