pat

Glad you're still enjoying the 530d Spooky! Mine is still the transport of choice most of the time, but with the present weather and 265 tyres on the back, that's just a recipe for going nowhere (or indeed in directions other than intended) quickly, so there's an Impreza sat on the drive at the mo...

As for Legacy diesel, a great car in its own right, and unlike the 530d it would make it up the snow covered roads, but I'de be more interested in seeing that engine in an Impreza

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

Ahh the tourings, they are a bit porky, still, they don't seem to be any worse for it.

One sad fact of tired beamers is the shocks and suspension bushings get sloppy with age. Bumpy British roads seems to takes its toll on them.

Our e39 530 is starting to get to that stage now (first noted by red tarmac inducing the front wheels to repeatedly bounce during light/moderate braking at low speed), hopefully its just the oil filed bushings on the tie rods starting to go sloppy. No doubt the dreaded 50mph wheel wobble will start sooner or later. Better get the wallet out I suppose

Having driven an older well worn e39 with very tired shocks and bushings I'm all too aware of it: Motorway journeys tended to cause the heads of passengers to nod (especially in the back), the 50mph wobble, the judder under light braking at high speed (stops if you re-apply harder) and the steering going floaty when at three figure speeds. But even with it in such a tired state, it still handled and clung to the road like a limpet.

Spooky Mulder

Compared to Pat's our 530d Sport Touring is a baby with only 70k miles. However it still pulls like a train and the ride is still as magic carpet as ever.

We recently thought there was a bit of wobble coming but it was a bent rim at the front - new wheel and smooth as silk again.

Even with traction control on it is much easier to get it sideways than my old 993 Carrera!!

330dan

crazy stereotype of a bmw driver - funny though

pat

That might have something to do with the fact that there is a) somewhat more torque available and b) somewhat less engine sat over the driven wheels

Peanuts

iTrader: (15)

its not, but then neither is the Impreza.
That is my point, the Impreza used to be the PBotC and many of the owners are still trying to dine out on it and refer to it.
You are also deluded/blinkered if you think that its only now they are keeping up.
Nobody will argue that the impreza is dynamite at the launch but 2.5L repmobile diesels have been keeping up and roaring past on rolling starts since day 2.
There has been a million and one threads about this car or that car is keeping up and over taking me in my impreza etc
Its a fact of life, evolution etc unfortunately the impreza is now just a luke warm hatch/saloon with fantastic grip nothing else

Terminator X

iTrader: (7)

Come on Stu, let's keep it like for like! Standard 2 litre diesel vs standard STi etc OR remapped diesel vs remapped STi ...

As earlier post above, my Spec C was 375/375 & wasn't bothered by any diesel car.

TX.

GREGGYG

iTrader: (2)

If the Impreza is only 'luke warm' today, in your opinion, (which clearly is not evidence based), then what, in your opinion, is 'hot' today? Ideally your comparisons should be in the same price bracket as a Subaru Impreza, or they cannot be valid as comparable.

stara

this diesel vs petrol thing goes on and on. and the surprise usually occurs when the diesel motor is in top gear cruising at about 2500rpm which happens to be where the peak torque is. drives alongside a petrol motor sitting 3000rpm below it's peak torque figure in its top gear and they both floor it, well guess who is going to be quicker. by the time 'petrol' realises, and changes down, it is too late. if the petrol motor is sitting at it's peak torque alongside the diesel motor at it's peak torque then the shoe is completely on the other foot............i.e. bmw in top, scoob in 3rd, same speed, next to each other ......3.2.1...go.........scoob wins, why? the wheel torque is greatly increased for the scoob due to the gearing, scoob gearchanges will allow the diesel to make up ground slightly, but once the advantage is there it is there..........


another scenario is a diesel car approaching rapidly from behind 20-30 mph faster, it will take a hell of a lot of a power advantage to make up for the speed differential if the slower car wants to catch the faster one, a surprisingly huge amount if the faster one is still accelerating.,

stara

oh yeh, almost forgot...... 'lukewarm hatch'

martwrxsl

Diesel brigayed A fabia Vrs can be chipped to 300lbs/ft. A 330d can be tuned to 500lbs/ft. A petrol audi RS6 has 475lbs/ft of torque from 1,000 - 6,500 rpm.But I could still keep up with it in my 320d.

martwrxsl

Forgot to mention that a chipped 300bhp 500lbs/ft 330d also still does 40mpg when there's black smoke coming out of the back of it trying to get away from a scoob.

gallois

well nobody is keeping you here gents, perhaps a bmw forum would be a better place to applaud bmw's.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

Oh god no, have you talked to the average BMW driver?

GlesgaKiss

I blew away a 330d tonight in my Focus. Pulled up beside it at traffic lights and staired the guy out while holding the throttle at 7K rpm, to make sure he knew it was on.

When the lights went to green I dropped the clutch and we were off. My wheels spun and I went nowhere at first, but then finally got going and it was neck and neck until about 20: after that I left him for dust.

I looked in my rear view mirror and saw him laughing. Must have been impressed with my Focus.

RS Grant

Some of the opinions here are hilarious, it is VERY obvious that some people that are commenting on the performance and drive of these BMW models have never actually driven or been in one!!

My old dear has an E46 330d M-Sport Cabrio and last summer I was 4-up and out for a drive with the roof down.. on a straight piece of road, I kept with a friends Bugeye STi with just him in it, trying extremely hard to get away from me. Thats fact.

Our car isn't tuned, was rolling roaded at 233bhp and 322lb/ft though, so as you can see its making decent figures... his car was rolling roaded at a shade under 280bhp @ the same event as the BMW made the above figures.

A standard Bugeye WRX would be easy prey for our 330d and from the reading and research I've done on the net, if we were to get it re-mapped/optomised then it would turn into quite a potent performance car that would pull comfortably on the Bugeye STi that my friend owns.

To compare it to a Classic, I also have a friend with a P1 that got a shock at the pull of the 330d when we were pulling onto a dual carriageway together. After we stopped, he said he was trying 100% and he only pulled past me slowly, certainly never blasted past as he (and I) both expected.


Cheers,
Grant

Jimpreza

I'd go for the 335 petrol over the diesel or the scoob.

kingofturds

iTrader: (1)

My subaru is still the fastest thing on the roads, and if you dare say otherwise I will come around and slap you in the face with a big wet haddock

Peanuts

iTrader: (15)

Based on fact? Well its based on my own ownership experience so yes, you could say it is based on fact. I have an stiRA with over 400 brake, but I'm not blinkered to other marques and their collective benefits.
As for cost, well 03 bimmer 330 diesels are down to £6k, about the same as 03 stis so how is that not a cost comparison?
Back in the day when Imprezas used to look good and had an iconic following, hot hatches used to trundle about with 130 or so brake, nowadays with cars like the 197 trophy clearly other marques have moved on, the Impreza still has the same power but about half a ton extra mass to carry around, therefore its diluted and hence it is no longer hot it must be by definition warm.
Pay attention 007

jonny_693

iTrader: (5)

Bump for 330d on 5th gear NOW!

gallois

what a load of bollox, a impreza is 'warm' and a clio 197 is 'hot' ******* brilliant.

Peanuts

iTrader: (15)

I would suggest, with respect, that it would go round the outside of a 2007 wrx for fun.
Please don't think Im down on Imprezas, like I said I own one myself but the bar has been raised considerably and Subarus have got heavier and heavier with no power hike.
Have you driven a trophy?

gallois

oh ffs, get a grip, and stop adapting your criteria to suit your argument. when you said imprezas are 'warm' you didn't mean Sti?

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

Remember, these are six cylinder 3 litre cars, they aren't that remarkable as they have a big engine with a turbocharger and are quite expensive, they are good but you do pay for it.

zip929

I swapped my 350bhp STI last year for an E61 530D which now has a dpt tuning box added, giving aprrox 260 bhp and 500lbs torque.

The BM is a lovely comfortable car to drive, and I am well happy with it.
At the same time though it does not light my fire like the scooby did.
When I drove the scooby it felt special, whereas with the BM you just get on with it.

I must be getting old as I now prefer the relaxed easy power of the 530d over the scobby with it's top rpm rush.

Peanuts

iTrader: (15)

I used the comparison as it would be real world to you

scoobysmiff

iTrader: (2)

from Wikipedia:

Torque is the tendency of a force to rotate an object about an axis (or fulcrum or pivot). Just as a force is a push or a pull, a torque can be thought of as a twist. The symbol for torque is τ, the Greek letter tau.

Torque is also called moment or moment of force. This should neither be confused with the various other definitions of "moment" in physics nor with "momentum". In the context of mechanical engineering, the terms "moment" and "torque" are not necessarily interchangeable; rather, one or the other may be preferred in a specific context. For example, "torque" is usually used to describe a rotational force down a shaft, for example a turning screw-driver, whereas "moment" is more often used to describe a bending force on a beam.[citation needed]

The magnitude of torque depends on three quantities: First, the force applied; second, the length of the lever arm connecting the axis to the point of force application; and third, the angle between the two


as you can see if you have a huge rotational force turning your shaft - say 500lbf and high gearing you will be able to utilise that high gearing by still maintaining a good rate of acceleration but holding the gear longer at the good rate of acceleration, hense it will be as quick as something shorter geared but has a gear change or 2 in the same acceleration process.
If you add the BMW's clever gearbox stuff, then it's not hard to see why they can maintain good acceleration all of the time they are asked too by the driver

gallois

your almost there with that analogy, but missing some huge facts, like RPM. it's all well and good quoting torque figures but without context it is meaningless, torque and work done (bhp) are 2 variations of the same thing when it comes to an engine, this is the most simplest way of describing it, and it clearly explains why F1 cars are so quick with so little torque.

one man shovelling sand into a wheelbarrow with a spade 1ft long lifts 20lb/s of sand per spade and 1 spade full every 10seconds goes into the wheelbarrow, he cannot shovel any faster than this (diesel). 120ft/lbs at his peak spade per minute (rpm).

another man doing a similar job is with the same spade is fitting 10lb/s of sand per spade but every 5seconds, also 120ft/lbs (petrol).

so although the heavier spade appears to be doing the most work, the end result is the spade which is half as full accomplishes the task in the same time.

so, put simply, your 400ft/lbs at 2000rpm is 200ft/lbs at 4000rpm or 100ft/lbs at 8000rpm or 50ft/lbs at 16000 rpm. get it now?

gallois

oh and geaboxes, diffs and wheels convert this engine power to wheel force, which is where acceleration lives. low gears multiply engine torque massively and by staying in a low gear longer in a high revving car takes advantage of this over a low revving car.

Evolution Stu

iTrader: (2)

Why not just get 2 cars together and race guys. LOL