dynamix

iTrader: (3)

and no points on my license either ... where's the halo smiley

Off to Germany next week - sure it will hit 160 + again this time

JP4

iTrader: (12)

Try driving a properly mapped 400 bhp car with decent torque - before thinking of 500 bhp. Remember people have different views so best to get atleast 3/4 tuners views and see what the general trend thoughts are in terms of longevity of the engine etc.

Mus

iTrader: (2)

or even get in to a mates car thats running a genuine 400 not one of the ones where my mechanic told me thats it 400 with an induction kit,dump valve and fmic oh and decat you know that myth.lol

JP4

iTrader: (12)

Do you know anyone running a genuine 400 set up Mus?

Mus

iTrader: (2)

yes jp4 maybe a little over .lol hows that beast of yours treating you matey?

i think the majority of my close friends are running over 400 so you end up getting sucked in to it all but boy don't we just love it

its funny how a few years ago people thought that it was hard to achieve such a figures for a road car and now its totally changed where i live 400 is normal in north london there are rx7 close to 900bhp,r34 at 600,550 supercharged m3, porche gt2 at 650 maybe a bit more. 2 evos at 750 and and another 550.apart from the rx7s the rest of them haven't seen any tracks in there life time.

And there i am surounded by monsters with my 20G and 10% meth with not even small chance in hell.lol

what bugs me is every one is always taking the mick out scooby engines and gearboxes for there reliabilty.its only very rare cases like harvey car where its done so many miles and it was running a lot of power for standard internals.

where supra,bmw and skyline engines seem to last a life time ok rx7 aint reliable at all but they dont cost as much as subaru engines to rebuild.

why is it that scooby engines are forever blowing up? is it cause there sensitive to bad fuel, poor quality oil or just poor materials from the factory.
and you really cant say cause there old supra and skyline engines are just as old.

R4LLY

iTrader: (1)

Lol,

Mus your 20G gave some of them guys a fright for sure though..


Even the lil old 18G had some of those Evo's shying away

johnnybon

iTrader: (70)

Mmmm i see i didnt get a mention
when mines done i take you for a rid in a genuine 400

Mus

iTrader: (2)

hey johnny how you doing your a bit diffrent your not one of them , your a genuine guy with a graph . i was talking about some of the guys that are giving me a hard time in up north london with some serious cars that forever terrorising me about how reliabable scooby are

harvey

iTrader: (48)

As regards gearboxes like I already said the TY754 fitted MY99 onwards is stronger than the TY752. Generally when these gearboxes go it is second gear or more likely third gear simply because the torque applied over a period of time is more than the box can handle. I know of TY754 gearboxes running well over 500 bhp and while it is only a matter of time before they break they will operate for some period at this power level. The first thing I have noticed happen is that the centre viscuous diff if that is what is fitted becomes noisy. Changing the centre viscuous is no big deal. Not so many gearboxes, 752 or 754 break first gear despite drag starts. The last 752 that I broke personally had done numerous drag starts but broke third gear and locked up the transmission in spectacular circumstances with a huge cloud of smoke from the locked tyres causing me concern that the following driver would rear end me.
As regards all the engines and gearboxes I am referring to, these cars are tracked at Croft and elsewhere from time to time. In my experience it is brakes that are the Achilles heel for many road cars and after that you need to keep an eye on oil temperature. Unfortunately many cars do not have oil temperature guages but if the engine is in good condition and mapped properly then a track day should be taken in its stride but will show up any deficiencies. Cars running standard maps that are checked and in good condition are almost bomb proof so I think a lot of track failures are down to poor engineering work at the time of modification or bad mapping that is not detected because there are no guages to monitor AFR, EGT or oil temperature and of course if you are really working hard it is advisable to fit a high pressure oil switch working at something in the order of 35 psi so that you can pick up a lack of oil because of surge on cornering and braking but in my experience you will not achieve this without slicks.
As regards cost of build for an engine, the build to get in to the 380-400 bracket is a lot less because OE pistons and rods are used and there is no need to remove the heads if the engine has no pre existing condition.
I would guess the cost of going for 450 bhp is very similar to the cost of going for 500 bhp and these are just figures. The main difference in the power outputs will be the turbo choice where costs are quite similar and the possibility of adding head work.
In standard form, taking a WRX to 385 bhp or thereabouts is fairly straight forward and you can add on another 15 bhp if the starting base is an STi and both these cars in Classic form seem to have adequate engine strength. I cannot speak with authority regards the New Age which I think is less tunable and my concern on the standard engines is bore clearance which is obviously resolved if you are going for 450 bhp where obviously you are using forged pistons and steel rods.
Stevie : If you want a quote, email me per profile. We would need to know your exact specification to date, your aspirations and probably your budget. It is possible to put an engine together on a budget to get to around a target figure but where do you stop. For instance, you can achieve 450 bhp without head porting but head porting is nice to have. For instance, if I build an engine for myself then it gets a new Modine but on a budget someone else might not want a new Modine. Much the same goes for a new oil pump. Possibly not needed but certainly desirable so you have to understand that the cost of building an engine can very tremendously if the 'I's are dotted and the 'T's are crossed but such an engine leaves nothing to chance.

MartynJ

From experience the stock Newage WRX motor should be good for 400hp on the right turbo.
The stock Newage STI motor has proven itself to be capable of 450+ reliably, again on the right turbo.
I have been running 3 customer cars at this level for 18 months and climbing, 2 of them have done numerous RWYB events but no track time.
It is essential though as Harvey says to have a watchful eye on everything you can, oil temp, oil pressure, boost and EGT at bare minimum on anything you intend to track day regularly.

harvey

iTrader: (48)

Cheers Martyn. My concern on the New Age is a couple of instances of pistons being nipped in the bores and there is very little clearance on the factory engine. One owner in particular was very heavy footed right from first thing in the morning on a cold engine and inadequate fuelling may have played its part but I am cautious to take these New Age beyond 400. This is not the experience I have had with 2 litres in similar circumstances.
Perhaps the owners of the New Age above were unfortunate but in the meantime I will exercise caution.

MartynJ

And nobody will knock you for that m8, caution above all else.

stevie1982

iTrader: (16)

sorry guys i have - oil temp, oil pressure, boost but can you please tell me what EGT stands for?

banny sti

iTrader: (68)

Exhaust gas temp, would also be worth getting a fuel pressure gauge.

Banny

stevie1982

iTrader: (16)

great thanks mate

dont suppose you know how many gauges you can run from the defi controller as i have 3 already coul di run two more form it

banny sti

iTrader: (68)

Should be able to run a total of 6 gauges from the controller, as they are wired in a daisy chain.

Banny

stevie1982

iTrader: (16)

CHEER BANNY

hookie

iTrader: (17)

Thanks guys for the info,I didnt quite expect that sort of response...Just one other question and that is Turbo choice? ....But then again we can come back to that another day lol ps HAPPY NEW YEAR TO YOU ALL Hookie

MartynJ

MD555, MD321H, SC40, RCM400 and the list goes on. All will produce similar figures with little between them in terms of spool .

Mus

iTrader: (2)

which one would you have on your car martyn?lol

MartynJ

IF I was in search of a nice early spooling 400hp turbo, my own personal choice would be the MD555. This can be tailor made to your requirements with a choice of intake hose sizes, a choice of exhaust housings, many different wheel choices and the exhaust housing ceramic coated FOC for the best possible response.

I have of course gone for something completely different again though, as I wanted 450-500hp from my 2.1 at the loss of some low end response.
I am currently trying a Turbo Technics T38/Subaru hybrid, I have only covered a few miles so far so am not ready to release finished figures to the public. That said initial testing is proving fruitful with 385bhp and 350lbft @ 1.2 bar (On 97 ron fuel, no booster) full boost being achieved @ 3500rpm on the road.
This will eventually be tested and ran @ 2 bar, after which it will be going back to TT to try a roller bearing conversion on the same unit. This could reduce the full boost rpm even lower and enhance throttle repsonse during shifts.

Prices to be confirmed upon completion of testing.

hookie

iTrader: (17)

Again I cant beleve the response on such a obvious question 80 replys and nealy 1,500 readers in less than a month ....Gob smacked.......Nice one guys...and thanks for your time and knowledge Andy

Shaun

I would *genuinely* like to compare my set-up against a 400bhp rated turbo, to see how much better a much smaller turbo produces power lowdown.

Anybody got any bhp / torque figures at say 3k, 3.5k & 4k on a 2.5l with a GOOD 400bhp turbo on (using VPower of course)?

MartynJ

Post your DD figures Shaun and I will see what I can find.

Shaun

Martyn,
Unfortunately I do not have any DD figures based on the current set-up / mapping. I have a Dastek one though.

Area 52 Autosport

I use a 2L CDB as back in 2001 this was considered an essential item

Would my engine have suffered if I hadn't used a CDB? Hard to say, possibly not (we have run 650hp on a open deck block before).

I would say anything upto 500hp - use whatever block you have.


Jase.

MartynJ

Then it is of no use to me, lol.

stevie1982

iTrader: (16)

so i can get away with up to 500bhp in a built p1 block? thats good news to me as i do not want to go any further than this

regards

banny sti

iTrader: (68)

I am upto 450bhp on a semi closed beck, which will be pushed to 500bhp in the new year and prior to this I ran a P1 open deck block at 390bhp with no problems.

Banny

MartynJ

Isn't yours reinforced even further with steel liners Jase, and this 650bhp open deck, did that have steel liners too.