Massive dissapointment
27 June 2008, 01:52 PM
#31
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so if you get 250 quid of freebies , can i book in next week ...lol
i think in all a very good reply
as said always 2 sides to the story ...
and as david said should off been sorted out man to man
i think in all a very good reply
as said always 2 sides to the story ...
and as david said should off been sorted out man to man
27 June 2008, 02:04 PM
#32
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It would seem that these freebies were given without the customer concerned even having to seriously complain/ask, which surely speaks volumes about APi??
I wonder to what extent the OP reflects the views of the actual car owner??
This is why I like to see complaints from the source: too much room for distortions/embelishments to creep in otherwise!
Ns04
27 June 2008, 03:26 PM
#33
So basically, the only real culpable mistakes APi have made was David mis-remembering the type of ECU being mapped in the first instance, and a subsequent staff shortage (which can happen to any company, but call it a mistake if you will) for which he apologized and the owner has got a free fuel pressure regulator and a free 02 sensor for his troubles??
Not too shabby if you ask me!!
Ns04
PS 350bhp on 380 injectors: pull the other one, it plays Jingle Bells!
Not too shabby if you ask me!!
Ns04
PS 350bhp on 380 injectors: pull the other one, it plays Jingle Bells!
the moral of the story is GO TO ZEN
27 June 2008, 03:36 PM
#34
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When you want to map our classic? needs a new lambda sensor and feul reg. 
Joking of course as i changed the lambda a month or so ago.
coulda had a freebie.
Joking of course as i changed the lambda a month or so ago.
coulda had a freebie.
27 June 2008, 04:02 PM
#35
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That's really useful.
I hope you speak from experience after having used both API and Zen. I have spent £000's with David and crew without any problems. But I have never dealt with Zen so wouldn't feel able to comment on them. I also believe Pat the map who has been somewhat unfairly (IMHO) castigated by the OP also does work for Zen. So following that logic, the moral of the story is DON'T GO TO ZEN.
Which I wouldn't say because as far as I know they are well thought of and professional.
I hope you speak from experience after having used both API and Zen. I have spent £000's with David and crew without any problems. But I have never dealt with Zen so wouldn't feel able to comment on them. I also believe Pat the map who has been somewhat unfairly (IMHO) castigated by the OP also does work for Zen. So following that logic, the moral of the story is DON'T GO TO ZEN. Which I wouldn't say because as far as I know they are well thought of and professional.
27 June 2008, 04:03 PM
#36
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on another note my crap fuel economy could be down not just to the type of car it is but the o2 sensor needing changed cheers david ill give that a try
cheers david ill give that a try
27 June 2008, 04:07 PM
#37
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I feel I need to clear that up, if you want a Zen Performance map, you'll only get it from Zen Performance, done by Paul, no exceptions. Pat doesn't do any work for Zen, although he is a friend of ours going back years.
Paul
Paul
That's really useful. I hope you speak from experience after having used both API and Zen. I have spent £000's with David and crew without any problems. But I have never dealt with Zen so wouldn't feel able to comment on them. I also believe Pat the map who has been somewhat unfairly (IMHO) castigated by the OP also does work for Zen. So following that logic, the moral of the story is DON'T GO TO ZEN.
Which I wouldn't say because as far as I know they are well thought of and professional.
I hope you speak from experience after having used both API and Zen. I have spent £000's with David and crew without any problems. But I have never dealt with Zen so wouldn't feel able to comment on them. I also believe Pat the map who has been somewhat unfairly (IMHO) castigated by the OP also does work for Zen. So following that logic, the moral of the story is DON'T GO TO ZEN. Which I wouldn't say because as far as I know they are well thought of and professional.
27 June 2008, 04:07 PM
#38
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Ref # 36 above. the thread moved on before I got my act together.
Or a Bailey dump valve , they tend to make Subaru's uneconomical in my experience.
David APi
Or a Bailey dump valve , they tend to make Subaru's uneconomical in my experience.
David APi
Last edited by APIDavid; 27 June 2008 at 04:33 PM. Reason: Clarific Clar calir - Oh b*gger explanation LOL
27 June 2008, 04:50 PM
#42
I have alway found David to be a helpful guy who does his best to point customers in the right direction.
I like his no bulls**t approach he just Say's it has he See's it.
It is NOT in David's interest for customer's to walk away unsatisfied as he wants them to go back and spend more of your hard earned again and again.
So if mistakes have been made then they are not deliberate, we are all human. Go and see him and sort it out then everyone's happy.
PS
If you go and see him on a Sat you even get a bacon roll
PPS He should also move to Wales its to far away bishops ichington or what ever it is.
I like his no bulls**t approach he just Say's it has he See's it.
It is NOT in David's interest for customer's to walk away unsatisfied as he wants them to go back and spend more of your hard earned again and again.
So if mistakes have been made then they are not deliberate, we are all human. Go and see him and sort it out then everyone's happy.
PS
If you go and see him on a Sat you even get a bacon roll
PPS He should also move to Wales its to far away bishops ichington or what ever it is.
Last edited by KJD Mk1; 27 June 2008 at 04:53 PM.
27 June 2008, 05:03 PM
#43
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http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...utility_01.jpg
The moral of this story is that everyone makes mistakes, and if David at APi makes a mistake (very rare), he more than makes up for it!
So: go to Api
Ns04
27 June 2008, 05:57 PM
#45
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This is a big mistake if the examiner is female!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...523th5vze4.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...523th5vze4.jpg
27 June 2008, 07:33 PM
#46
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So basically, the only real culpable mistakes APi have made was David mis-remembering the type of ECU being mapped in the first instance, and a subsequent staff shortage (which can happen to any company, but call it a mistake if you will) for which he apologized and the owner has got a free fuel pressure regulator and a free 02 sensor for his troubles??
Not too shabby if you ask me!!
Ns04
PS 350bhp on 380 injectors: pull the other one, it plays Jingle Bells!
Not too shabby if you ask me!!
Ns04
PS 350bhp on 380 injectors: pull the other one, it plays Jingle Bells!
27 June 2008, 07:36 PM
#47
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I don't understand people who walk away from a company who have subjected them to service that has resolved them never to use the place again without saying a word, or at least telling them that!?!?! I'm a mild person, but I know I damn well would let someone know if I felt I'd been mistreated as a customer!
It would seem that these freebies were given without the customer concerned even having to seriously complain/ask, which surely speaks volumes about APi??
I wonder to what extent the OP reflects the views of the actual car owner??
This is why I like to see complaints from the source: too much room for distortions/embelishments to creep in otherwise!
Ns04
It would seem that these freebies were given without the customer concerned even having to seriously complain/ask, which surely speaks volumes about APi??
I wonder to what extent the OP reflects the views of the actual car owner??
This is why I like to see complaints from the source: too much room for distortions/embelishments to creep in otherwise!
Ns04
There is no distorsion from me as i have nothing to gain
And as previously said twice in the posts on this forum im sure he does good work but not in this case
27 June 2008, 07:38 PM
#48
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I have alway found David to be a helpful guy who does his best to point customers in the right direction.
I like his no bulls**t approach he just Say's it has he See's it.
It is NOT in David's interest for customer's to walk away unsatisfied as he wants them to go back and spend more of your hard earned again and again.
So if mistakes have been made then they are not deliberate, we are all human. Go and see him and sort it out then everyone's happy.
PS
If you go and see him on a Sat you even get a bacon roll
PPS He should also move to Wales its to far away bishops ichington or what ever it is.
I like his no bulls**t approach he just Say's it has he See's it.
It is NOT in David's interest for customer's to walk away unsatisfied as he wants them to go back and spend more of your hard earned again and again.
So if mistakes have been made then they are not deliberate, we are all human. Go and see him and sort it out then everyone's happy.
PS
If you go and see him on a Sat you even get a bacon roll
PPS He should also move to Wales its to far away bishops ichington or what ever it is.
Then why when the car came back after the last run did he walk past us all at least 3 times and not say a word???
Not even a "how is it now?"
Nothing
27 June 2008, 07:41 PM
#49
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http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...utility_01.jpg
The moral of this story is that everyone makes mistakes, and if David at APi makes a mistake (very rare), he more than makes up for it!
So: go to Api
Ns04
Personally as i said he seems like a nice guy ive said that before but as for customer/service satisfaction??????
Well im not impressed
I've only ever been to Bob Rawle and Powerstation and they were more than spot on
27 June 2008, 07:43 PM
#50
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Just to clarify the situation :
On the first visit I was told I was mapping a PowerFC not a Scooby ECU. I had the kit to do the PowerFC, but since I no longer offer Scooby ECU mapping for new customers, I don't carry that kit any more. Had I been told that it was a Scooby ECU, I would have had the kit with me.
On the second visit I did have the kit with me, and we proceeded to ADJUST THE EXISTING MAP for the larger injectors. The only change was from 380cc to 440cc injectors. This does not require a new ignition map. It does not require a new boost control map. It does not require a new fuel correction map.
What it does do, however, is alter the perceived engine load, so whereas previously atmospheric pressure might read 38 load, after the change, it would read 33, and hence run too much ignition. It was necessary to import the existing map data, scaled accordingly to fit the new load function.The maps that the OWNER of the car were shown illustrated that AT THE SAME OPERATING POINT, the fuelling, ignition and boost control were THE SAME, but the maps themselves were NOT.
I therefore concluded that since the engine control HAS NOT CHANGED, it is not a mapping issue, but that it is most likely a mechanical problem. That lies beyond my remit, I adjust ECUs, I don't build engines, fit clutches etc, I MAP ECUs... mechanical issues are the responsibility of the Specialist I am subcontracted to, in this case API Engines. I do, however, provide an opinion on where I believe any problems to lie, so that such Specialists may more quickly resolve the problem.
Regards,
Pat.
On the first visit I was told I was mapping a PowerFC not a Scooby ECU. I had the kit to do the PowerFC, but since I no longer offer Scooby ECU mapping for new customers, I don't carry that kit any more. Had I been told that it was a Scooby ECU, I would have had the kit with me.
On the second visit I did have the kit with me, and we proceeded to ADJUST THE EXISTING MAP for the larger injectors. The only change was from 380cc to 440cc injectors. This does not require a new ignition map. It does not require a new boost control map. It does not require a new fuel correction map.
What it does do, however, is alter the perceived engine load, so whereas previously atmospheric pressure might read 38 load, after the change, it would read 33, and hence run too much ignition. It was necessary to import the existing map data, scaled accordingly to fit the new load function.The maps that the OWNER of the car were shown illustrated that AT THE SAME OPERATING POINT, the fuelling, ignition and boost control were THE SAME, but the maps themselves were NOT.
I therefore concluded that since the engine control HAS NOT CHANGED, it is not a mapping issue, but that it is most likely a mechanical problem. That lies beyond my remit, I adjust ECUs, I don't build engines, fit clutches etc, I MAP ECUs... mechanical issues are the responsibility of the Specialist I am subcontracted to, in this case API Engines. I do, however, provide an opinion on where I believe any problems to lie, so that such Specialists may more quickly resolve the problem.
Regards,
Pat.
27 June 2008, 07:52 PM
#51
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So what exactly are you going to do for my mate and his car to make good the £550 for a remap that made the car worse???
Or are the £250 worth of bits be they second hand ones and not new from what i've seen .... all he is getting?
Have you phoned your unhappy customer???
Have you apologised for anything?
You've stood up and said i got things wrong ...fair play
Personally i'd move heaven and earth to sort this out..... as i've said before and can see from this thread you have many happy customers, so why not add another one and sort this out and ring him
100%
28 June 2008, 02:51 PM
#53
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iv had a map with pat through street performace in feb on a simtek.
had a great day watching, but i had problems with my boost.
pat and damian took pipes off here and there, and found something blocking one of the pipes. in the end they got me sorted.
now im sure mappers wouldnt get there hands dirty doing this stuff.
i sure wouldnt.
and im sure il be getting another map off pat. without a douth.
as for api, iv had a few packages from them through the door from other tuners.
and i plauged him the last 2 months for a driveshaft and was sure by the end of it hed tell me to **** off...but he didnt
cheers david and pat for looking after me
had a great day watching, but i had problems with my boost.
pat and damian took pipes off here and there, and found something blocking one of the pipes. in the end they got me sorted.
now im sure mappers wouldnt get there hands dirty doing this stuff.
i sure wouldnt.
and im sure il be getting another map off pat. without a douth.
as for api, iv had a few packages from them through the door from other tuners.
and i plauged him the last 2 months for a driveshaft and was sure by the end of it hed tell me to **** off...but he didnt
cheers david and pat for looking after me
29 June 2008, 08:50 AM
#54
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i havent had my car mapped yet !! but i will do and i can pretty much tell you that if i wasnt happy with the results 1.i wouldnt pay 2. i would sort it out there and then . i understand your mate is annoyed but he should have stated it there and then not so many days after and on the net its a very backwards way of doing things . every one has there opinion api.zen. etc etc just do your self a faviour get your mate to either go down there to sort it out or ring him , if not call it a mistake and move on .
Last edited by M535I; 29 June 2008 at 08:53 AM.
29 June 2008, 10:37 PM
#55
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Tell your mate to get on the blower to David and then post a response on there personally.
Ns04
30 June 2008, 10:27 AM
#56
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cani have some of those 380 injectors please for my car, although can i have some 440's supplied by same people, must easily be good for 450bhp
sounds like another case of keyboard warrior to me
sounds like another case of keyboard warrior to me
30 June 2008, 12:48 PM
#57
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Ok thats the other side then David. Clearly we are all in the wrong here and i'm not getting into a he said i said argument either.
So what exactly are you going to do for my mate and his car to make good the £550 for a remap that made the car worse???
Or are the £250 worth of bits be they second hand ones and not new from what i've seen .... all he is getting?
Have you phoned your unhappy customer???
Have you apologised for anything?
You've stood up and said i got things wrong ...fair play
Personally i'd move heaven and earth to sort this out..... as i've said before and can see from this thread you have many happy customers, so why not add another one and sort this out and ring him
So what exactly are you going to do for my mate and his car to make good the £550 for a remap that made the car worse???
Or are the £250 worth of bits be they second hand ones and not new from what i've seen .... all he is getting?
Have you phoned your unhappy customer???
Have you apologised for anything?
You've stood up and said i got things wrong ...fair play
Personally i'd move heaven and earth to sort this out..... as i've said before and can see from this thread you have many happy customers, so why not add another one and sort this out and ring him
I have not been pressurised by you or your comments on here. I have taken a long view over what may or not be viable on this car.
Someone else has suggested that the first thing to do is put it back on 380's and restore the original map. Then it is as it was when it arrived. Does it go the same as before? If it does then we have a start point. If it doesn't, then there is something mechanical wrong with the car that APi is not responsible for. Then we start again. That is certainly A solution not necessarily the correct one, but definitely a way of proving various things.
It is somewhat churlish to even mention that the parts we fitted free may not be new. They are or were new, so that we know that we are not going down a blind alley.
It is along the same lines of suggesting that we were fudging the map data. That may be the case in certain places where you have taken your car. that is not or never would be the case here. You clearly have your own agenda here and I for one will not rise to it.
l'll talk to Phil and see where we go.
David APi
30 June 2008, 06:15 PM
#59
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Right, I think I have a solution to the problem. I will explain it to Phil the car owner and if he wishes to take me up on it, I will be happy to move on.
I have not been pressurised by you or your comments on here. I have taken a long view over what may or not be viable on this car.
Someone else has suggested that the first thing to do is put it back on 380's and restore the original map. Then it is as it was when it arrived. Does it go the same as before? If it does then we have a start point. If it doesn't, then there is something mechanical wrong with the car that APi is not responsible for. Then we start again. That is certainly A solution not necessarily the correct one, but definitely a way of proving various things.
It is somewhat churlish to even mention that the parts we fitted free may not be new. They are or were new, so that we know that we are not going down a blind alley.
It is along the same lines of suggesting that we were fudging the map data. That may be the case in certain places where you have taken your car. that is not or never would be the case here. You clearly have your own agenda here and I for one will not rise to it.
l'll talk to Phil and see where we go.
David APi
I have not been pressurised by you or your comments on here. I have taken a long view over what may or not be viable on this car.
Someone else has suggested that the first thing to do is put it back on 380's and restore the original map. Then it is as it was when it arrived. Does it go the same as before? If it does then we have a start point. If it doesn't, then there is something mechanical wrong with the car that APi is not responsible for. Then we start again. That is certainly A solution not necessarily the correct one, but definitely a way of proving various things.
It is somewhat churlish to even mention that the parts we fitted free may not be new. They are or were new, so that we know that we are not going down a blind alley.
It is along the same lines of suggesting that we were fudging the map data. That may be the case in certain places where you have taken your car. that is not or never would be the case here. You clearly have your own agenda here and I for one will not rise to it.
l'll talk to Phil and see where we go.
David APi
The poll on API speaks for it's self.
Bob Rawle maps my car...... If youre suggesting he fudges stuff speak to him. He is very very well regarded as a great mapper...... simple as.....
Last edited by Wmscooby; 30 June 2008 at 06:30 PM.
30 June 2008, 06:17 PM
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Has your friend phoned David to complain? If you're not happy with your car the onus is ON YOU to tell people and give them a fair crack of the whip at sorting it out! Not to get your mate to post on the internet.
Tell your mate to get on the blower to David and then post a response on there personally.
Ns04
Tell your mate to get on the blower to David and then post a response on there personally.
Ns04
.........