Ghetto Dude3

My thoughts

"breather filters"

in the past i have fitted them to cars breather systems and they have filled up inside with oily crap, you can not see from the outside as the oil can not get outside the filter.

so they look fine, but inside they are a mess, eventually blocking up and causing massive amounts of pressure for the system. i remember one engine having the oil spewing out all over the place, where ever has not got a decent seal (oil sensor?) could not work out why until i relised the breather filter was all clagged up on the inside with crap (and the outside had just been lovingly polished to make it shiney lol)

i have a breather filter on mine, AFTER a catch can, with clear pipes to see if any oily crap is getting past the can and to the filter (its not but it is getting caught by the can)

i would like to see pictures of inside that crank breather filter!!

djmisio85

Thats quite an awesome idea if I must say myself, clear pipes.
Any particular brand/material of pipe which you use?

andy97

iTrader: (1)

A knock to a companies reputation is far more costly than a free rebuild, especially with a small community as subaru ownership is.

Customer relations, customer relations, customer relations.

Andy

dynamix

iTrader: (3)

Why should they do a free rebuild if the only evidence of failure is on the part of the customer. It would be like asking Subaru to give you a new engine because you put diesel in.

jd5217

andy97

iTrader: (1)

It was using **** loads of oil from day one

jd5217

it was using a litre a week and this was considered normal by the engine builders.

jd5217

but what mileage was done in the week?

andy97

iTrader: (1)

drive home from tuner approx 130 miles, filled up, 1 litre.. If that is not alot then ok

jd5217

hang on, couple of facts requires.

1. was the oil at the correct level when left the tuners
2. was the oil checked and topped up after arrival at home (leaving car to cool)
3. how often was the level checked.

it does not say that oil level was checked after leaving tuner, says 1 week.

andy97

iTrader: (1)

read post7

catons scooby

morning ppl,

to answer the questions,
when i turned upo to collect the car, i wasn't shown around the engine, both the tuners stayed inside the office, his son (19yr old) started the car up and took me for a drive, no the oil wasn't checked by me, not sure if the tuner did check it, i drove home, getting in at 9pm, put car in garage, woke up in the morning to check the oil level for a reference and there wasn't one, so as i wasn't told exactly how much it was going to use i topped it up, it used a litre, then a week later (i done another 100miles) i checked again, used about 1/2 to 1 litre more, then fitted sensor few days after and see oil breather was blocked, i then noticed within a 2 mile drive the sensor was leaking, not alot but could see oil there, i then applied what i thought was a better seal to stop the leak, checked oil and it lost so little it was still within the lines on dipstick, then another few days later another 1/2 ltr then a 40mile trip and it went bang, they said fill car up with oil back to level and see if it still makes a noise, so 4ltres later did so and still a noise,

catons scooby

i dont have pictures of the blocked breather as i threw it away weeks ago, i replaced it with another one, different make and you can take the sponge thing out,
like said before as soon as i get the pic's i'll post them

catons scooby

i answered the first two above but no 3. was every other day i drove it, which was about 10 times in the 3-4weeks i had it

dynamix

iTrader: (3)

Ok, so..

We dont know for definite that it lost 1 litre on that first day.
We know it lost 1/2 litre in a week
you then fitted the sensor which leaked then applied the tape and checked the oil level but because it was still within the marks you didnt top it up.
You put another 1/2 litre in after this and then it went bang.

The 4 litres afterwards is kind of after the horse has bolted.

What kind of driving was done in this period?

Tidgy

the oil could have gone when it went bang, not caused it to go bang.

tbh i don't think your gonna get anywhere as far as a full rebuild at no cost, cos theres no gaurenty with race engines, and also sounds like it may have been the tape that caused the problem, rather than the oil loss

however if you were to rebuild it then i should think they'd see to it that you got it pretty dam cheap

Area 52 Autosport

BINGO!, Step up, we have a winner.

catons scooby

correct, i wan't shown the oil level, and there wasn't one when i checked, so it could be when they had the car they were using it with low oil,

yes lost between 1/2 and a litre in the next week, (so nearly 2 litres together)

when i say between the marks, i mean i couldn't tell if it were any different, so no i never see the need to top up,

then i checked again a few miles after changing senor, which was then next weekend, and it used 1/2 to a litre,

then a week later it went bang and used 4 litres,

i park it only in a garage and never see any drips of oil on the floor,

catons scooby

i was alone in the car, driving at 60 -65 it was late at night on the a13, which is police camera town, came off the a13, 2miles to my house so begin the warm down, steady driving all the way home then oil pressure went crazy down the raod from my house,

banny sti

iTrader: (68)

Something a little more constructive, would be more appropriate given the nature of the thread

Banny

djmisio85

So in reference to this comment by the tuners, how would you compare this engine build to other 2.5 forged builds, where no oil is used???

bad build maybe?

When you spend 20grand on a car, you should be shown everything that was done to your car, and things which cannot be seen should also be verified.
The way your meant to drive the car, things to look out for etc etc
The owner should not be expected to check the oil level before it leaves the tuners, because if oil wasnt sufficient at time of giving the car back to the owner, its an unfinished job.

And as verified above, a free rebuild, is an easy way out of a sticky situation.
Not every job is about raking the money in. In life businesses often lose money. Its better than losing customers and getting a bad rep.

catons scooby

we seem to think alike,
great minds some would say,
morning scooby mania any repies to my emails?

djmisio85

id say putting wrong sized pistons in, or building the engine in a manner where they know its going to do 40mpg (of oil) is a little worse than accidently putting diesel in your car (which this guys hasnt done)

djmisio85

dynamix

iTrader: (3)

Who says they are wrong sized pistons - I am sure SM would be happy for those to be ruled out.

Area 52 Autosport

OK, I'll add a few bits here just for clarity. We ran the car in, it didn't leak, and did NOT consume anything more than the small amount we'd expect to top up a build like this, certainly nowhere near even the amount in the whoile 1000 miles that has been "suggested" was consumed in the first 130(ish) mile trip after customer collection.

That's what is sometimes referred to as looking for a Zebra, instead of a horse!
We had no 2 litre tins of Motul on the shelf, so out of the goodness of our heart, we gave Mark a 4L bottle (for free). We advised him it would consume more oil than his previous standard engine and to keep an eye on it routinely .

The oil level was low as oil had leaked out of the car, dropping below a level capable of supporting a running engine, additional damage casued by a blocked No.5 main bearing is almost incidental (but still present).

Prior to the failure event, the customer had made ABSOLUTELY NO suggestion at any point that the car was using oil at any rate, never mind an unusual rate? We acted promptly and responsibly thereafter and have been sympathetic to Mrk throughout, hopefully the reason why he said earlier in the thread that he would recommend us to others?

As a result of the analysis of the failure process in this instance, we currently maintain our 100% record of not having had one of our built motors fail (as a result of being built, or specce'd incorrectly) since we started in 1999, SK, maybe your tuner has more experience in dealing with failed engines?

You don't have the foggiest idea how sympathetic we've been to this customer!

Maybe they are good as well?

Yep, same here.


Mike

catons scooby

mike,
The oil level was low as oil had leaked out of the car, dropping below a level capable of supporting a running engine, additional damage casued by a blocked No.5 main bearing is almost incidental (but still present).

how did i lose 4 litres of oil out of the thread with out seeing it?

catons scooby

You don't have the foggiest idea how sympathetic we've been to this customer!

no offence maybe ive been ignorant but i failed to see this, i never even had a phone call from you, or an offer to get the car back to you as i had no money!!!

djmisio85

Why do I have to "quote" myself.

Dont make a big thing that you gave him 4litres of your finest oil from the goodness of your heart. He gave you £20,000 out of the goodness of his heart. The least you should do, is make sure he knows what he's got, not just being taken for a test drive, with the others having a cuppa in the office, if you dont want trouble coming back, then its your responsibilty to eliminate any issue before they happen.

Nothing wrong to admitting to a failure, most people learn through their mistakes.

As above, why can some engine builders build engines that dont use oil? Hes not gona keep an eye on his oil, just going home from the tuners, unless he lives somewhere like germany.

Area 52 Autosport

To correct, the innaccurate answers to some of the replies to the questions.
You were shown around the engine by Mark, (technician) and asked him various questions on top of what you had shown to you.

Yes we did, as we had done throughout our tenure (1000 miles +) with the car, it was at the correct level when you took the car Mark.

The breather was not blocked, and it appears for some odd reason you managed to break it off? <shrug> not particularly relevant but a reasonable aptitude indicator maybe?

And THIS section in bold appears to be the commencement of the actual oil consumption/loss issue, as opposed to the indicated/suggested oil usage commencement.
Remember, Mark has stated himself quite clearly, his friends followed him every time he drove the car and that the car did NOT smoke at all.

This is the problem with "internet engine diagnostics/analysis, it's not so much the things that you get told, its the things that you don't, which then causes the gaps to be filled with understandable (but incorrect) assumptions.

I'm sure Mark will now post the entire failure anaylsis report, just to get all of the people who have been sent down the wrong path, back onto the correct path now?


Mike