Felix.

A nice holiday camp on Anthrax Island

Felix.

A 14 year old stole a car and knocked over a 4 year old boy recently. The boy died a short time after. The driver constantly denied the offence and was not remorseful at any point despite overwhelming evidence.

He was sentenced to 4 years in youth custody and served just two years.

The place he stayed at is classed as a youth prison. In reality it is a very high tech school/college. What ever he wanted to do, they did it for him. If he wanted to be a welder, they would get a load of welders in and taught him one-to-one. When he got sick and decided he fancied brick-laying; they would get rid of the welders and get some brickies in.

He came out last year – looking a lot healthy, weighing a lot more, still unremorseful and back into his old ways.

They must be something better than this.

mart360

Sorry Pete, I fail to see your argument.


.

Yet the state can fail to protect us from these thugs, and thats acceptable?

based on facts found, last year in Scotland alone (only data i could find at short notice) there were 1000 knife related incidents, and 13 people died due to stabbing incidents.

what were they? 13 mistakes.

thats 13 killers who will eventually be released from prison. because the state was frightened of making a mistake.

Look at Gary Newloves widow, for the rest of her life, she will wake up with the thought that her husband will never come home.

Yet the killer will walk from prison in 17 years, (or less) with his debt paid, and a free man. Will Mrs Newlove ever be free?

All the time her husbands killer is in prison, he will have 48 services looking after him, 365 days of the year. He will be able to exploit the HR sytem to the full, safe in the knowledge that in 6205 days, he will walk out of the door.

What does Mrs Newlove, have to look forward to? She will have had one "service" to offer support briefly , and then thats it . she will be on her own.


I,m sorry but we really need to review how we deal with murder in this country.


Mart

mart360

Just give them a gun, one bullet and lock them in a cell,

the door will be opened when you do the right thing.

then dont open the door again.

mart360

how many dead convicts have carried on raping and murdering?


Mart

Lisawrx

iTrader: (1)

However, although they will not be able to kill or rape again, it didn't stop them from committing the original crime. Someone/people were already killed or raped before said person got caught and executed, so in essence it doesn't act as a deterent.

hotsam

The problem is, a lot of those convicts are innocent.

freedomfighter

i wish these scumbag wannabe gansgta;s would be killed in the prison, scumbags


sharia law is they would face the death for killing an innocent man but the life is in the hands of the next of kin of the victims family, either they can demand blood money and forgive them and still stay in the prison or some sort of lighter punishment or 2nd choice is death for the scumbags


cheers

stringostar

a woman wrtoe into the star today (thurs) and said altho what happened to mr newlove was hporrible, imagine the pain the families of the lads who killed him are going thru..... the embarrassment and grief they will be getting... she said the lads are just that...lads... and are victims of society...

WTF is she on??

its the parents fault these lads roamed the streets.... not societies....

and it certainly isnt societies fault that the lads decided to kill someone... they say we should lower the voting age, drinking age, and give them shorter sentances.. they say kids now are more grown up, and can make decisions adults make.... obviously thats true.. but thw WRONG decisions.. its time to teach them that if you make your bed, you lay in it..... and i hope the parents are kicking them selves, in not bringing the kids up properly.... next they will blame broken home... sorry, but i know many people from broken homes, who turned out right as rein. bring back the death penalty... cos i tell you something, i'm fed up of being taunted by groups of thugs who think they can get away with things like murder... the problem doesnt need to be fixed at home... the legal system needs fixing first... show the kids and adults, if they do anything wrong, THEY will be punished, not given a slap on the wrist.

PeteBrant

Mart, the state cannot afford to have a "break a few eggs to make an omlette" stance when it comes to legalised Murder - Which what the death penalty is.

If you are going to have the death penalty, you need to be absolutly sure that you have the right person, and even then, the circumstances surrounding the crime may not warrant the punishment.

As horrible a crime as these children committed (and lets face it, at 17 you are still a kid) I do think you deserve a second chance in life - Of course his widow won;t think the same, but as has already been said, you cannot be emotive when talking about crime and punishment. You have to be objective.

These kids may turn out to be valuable memebers of society in 20 years or so, we don't know. They may end up being criminal scum, in which case they will get locked up again.

They will be punished


Policitans know its the worng thing, the lords know its the wrong thing, which why I doubt we will ever see the death penalty again in this country.

richie001

iTrader: (3)

i also think that the court of european court of human rights bans the death penalty in the member states

girl-in-a-scoob

Really... now theres a sweeping statement... so its all down to the parents....

Lisawrx

iTrader: (1)

I don't think it's necessarily all down to parenting alone, but certainly some responsibility has to be taken by parents whose children turn out this way. They are often so quick to turn around and blame everyone else (society/friends the list goes on) rather than accepting they may in part be to blame.

I was brought up on a council estate, where there were many 'rough' people, we didn't have loads of money, so in many ways my upbringing in that sense is not worlds apart from that of these people, yet I was brought up to have respect for others, to know right from wrong, and to this day I have never caused trouble for anyone, or been in trouble with the law. Many people from the same area are a whole different story, including one that I know of who is currently in prison for committing murder.

So I'm sorry, but although there are many reasons why people turn out the way they do, and act in the ways they do, at least some of the responsibility lies at the feet of the parent(s).

girl-in-a-scoob

I agree Lisa... some of the responsibility does lie with the parents... I just felt it was a sweeping statement

It doesnt matter whether you are brought up on a council estate or not... I know people from both sides who I wouldnt class as well behaved

Dream Weaver

Being a new parent I am dreading that my lad will turn out to be some sort of chav muppet, but I doubt he will as he will be brought up as properly as he can be, but parents aren't always to blame.

I have friends that haev turned out very well, but their siblings who were brought up in the same house have ended up in prison or living a life of crime - that can't be the parents fault?

It's easy to blame parents, but its not always the case and anyone that is a parent will understand that.

The statement by the Star woman above is silly though, the families of the newlove killers will be just as rough as the killers themselves, and are probably too busy drinking down the local WMC to give a ****.

girl-in-a-scoob

I agree.... I know people who have had public schooling and who now dont work... living a life of no good ... and I know people from council estates who have turned themselves around and run their own business, people from some of the roughest council estates in leeds who are now bad boy made good

PeteBrant

Here's the thing - By the time your child is 5, your influence lessens dramatically - You cease to be the most influential figure, and the teacher takes over.

By the time they are 10, it's even less - as friends and relationships are formed.

By the time they are 15, you don't get a look in

It's easy to blame the parents, but thier influence over thier kids lessnes as they get older.

girl-in-a-scoob

peer pressure ... I agree... you can try and do the best you can... but sometimes it just doesnt work

brihoppy

no death penalty, fair enough...second chance for 'kicking his head like it was a football...' you have GOT to be kidding...?!?

Brendan Hughes

I think I'm right in saying that more and more states in the US are shelving the DP, temporarily or permanently. I think that speaks volumes. They are not under financial pressure like third world countries who do it to continue receiving international aid, and they are not under federal pressure from a right-wing president who was governor of Texas and signed a few warrants in his time I assume.

What the answer is, I have absolutely no idea.

stringostar

my boy who is only 4 months old, will be brought up to respect people, and know the differance between right and wrong... I will discipline him if he does something wrong..


the lads who killed gary newlove, obv dont know the differance between right n wrong... and dont blame the beer... i've been drunk loads of times, but still know what i can and cant do... one thing i do know is... YOU certainly cant kill someone.

Leslie

Pete,

Who do you think is more important in one of these cases of sheer vandalism or serious injury, the thug who did it or the innocent victim. Who do you consider requires more protection out of the two sides?

Les

Leslie

Glad to hear of your attitude towards bringing your boy up.

I must say however that these young thugs are certain to know the difference between right and wrong however and deliberately choose which way they want to go for their own vicious pleasure!

Les

stringostar

les, all they will do once released is commit more crime... its a proven fact that offenders re-offend. they will be sat in prison now, playing of their wii, eating 3 hot meals a day, having the life of riley... and at our expense.. no wonder mrs newlove is pissed off.. they are probably gettin a better way of life in prison, than they would out.. my heart really does go out to the newlove family, but what are we to do to prevent it happening again?

i have no answers, does anyone?

Leslie

Yes I agree with what you say. Maybe some real hard labour every day instead of the featherbedding would make them think differently.

Les