Matteeboy

Many years of battering a makiwara have left me with quite freaky knuckles - almost like bioloical knuckle dusters!
The crackiness started quite young (did karate from 11) and has stayed with me ever since.

Hips not been a problem - really hope it stays that way!

Aaquil

krav maga defo...check out KMNW website (Krav Maga Northwest) it is well eorth doing. I showed a friend a technique for defence against a baseball bat ONCE. He got carjacked and the technique saved his skull!!!

Spoon

Took up Wing Wah some months ago. Hard on the **** the following morning.

SN's well ard innit.

DS. Buy a gun and be equal and save yourself the hassle of dressing like a ponce and rolling around on a sponge making strange noises in preparation for that 14 year old that might shoot you when you least expect it.

warrenm2

krav maga is a quick and dirty version of wing chun really - if you only want something quick, then krav is for you. If you plan to get more into it - wing chun has subtlety that you will appreciate as you get more experienced

Slowboy Racing

Take all the best bits form the above and more and you have MMA its the way forword

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

I don't wish to be disrespectful to anyone who does martial arts, but in my experience, if you're looking at purely self-defence and you're not a man mountain, nor do you wish to devote sufficient time to it to become a master, the I'd stick with something with an emphasis on striking.

The arts involving grappling are spectacularly efficient when performed by someone very proficient, or with the strength to manhandle to compensate for less than ideal technique, but for your average joe who's got caught up with a confrontation in the street wants to disable the lead agressor and get the **** outta there. Lets face it, how many fair 1 on 1s do you see these days? You do not want to be on the ground even if you're good enough to choke someone out or apply a submission hold.

I spoke to a mate not so long back who is proficient in a number of martial arts and he said that, as far as a street fight, as opposed to a competition goes, the best advice he could give was: make sure you get the first strike in, and make sure it's aimed somewhere that will neutralise the threat immediately. I asked him to elaborate and he reasoned:

A well aimed palm strike to the nose or a strike to the throat will stop anyone, regardless of how big they are!

I was inclined to agree

Poor Guy

or the good old knee to the bollocks

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Yep, that'll do it. Playing dirty sure, but as my mate was saying: if you think fights are honourable as they are in competition, you're deluded. Most are dirty and often completely unfair. No one is giving you points for style and the crowd is invariably hostle. The key is getting a decisive blow in early that diabales the lead attacker before they can hurt you and disuades others from having a go.

Being on the ground makes you a tempting target for any onlooking coward who wants to put in a kick. Putting someone in a hold (if you can do it reliably) leaves you open to one of the mates coming in behind you and smashing a bottle over your head to release their mate who will either be in great pain (in the case of a joint lock) or being rendered unconscious in a choke. Worse still, if you have the sustained upper hand a member of the public/police might think you're the aggressor and set about you, inadvertantly helping the real aggressor/criminal.

If you're in a situation where you can neither talk your way out of it nor run, strike first, do it to disable, then get the hell out of their or worry about explaining yourself after.

Ns04

Poor Guy

im looking forward to BJJ tonight!

my only problem is I always let them attack 1st. I mustattack 1st!!!
Im stupid like that

Matteeboy

New Scooby - I do partially agree with you. Martial arts has a very different "dynamic" to street fighting but I do think it helps.
I've certainly had my fair share of "real" situations (I have some rather lairy mates who then run off!) that I have been very glad of my training.

Even aggressively blocking a punch/kick makes most people think twice.
I have also been in hospital and CAT scanned after it went a bit wrong with five against one - Me being the one!

NeilT

Deep Singh - I'd say why not test out a few martial arts and see what suits you best.

I've tried quite a few now - Bujunkhan, Lau Gar Kung Fu, Muay Thai, Wado Karate and finally settled on traditional Shotokan (note Traditional as opposed to sport Karate).

The katas are there as training aids, helping in getting some of the stances correct and training focus, power and speed. I too used to find them completely irrelevant and boring, but over the past year began to see the point of them, and now almost prefer the kata side to the free fighting.

I'd say whatever you do, its not going to be much use (for many reasons) until you've been training hard for some years.

Just finished a good book "Moving Zen - by CW Nicol" - Welsh chap who went to study traditional Karate in Japan with the masters - great read if you're interested.

Neil

Matteeboy

Neil - I also did Shotokan to brown belt -then moved and couldn't find a decent club!

Speech

I'm going to stick another one up in favour of Taekwon-Do, ITF style. Remember there are 2 styles of TKD - ITF is the more "traditional" style in that it concentrates more on self defence, and WTF - this is the one seen in the Olympics and is more competition sparring based.

But, it can all be down to your instructor. I'm lucky in that our instructor is really good, he just promoted at the weekend to VI Dan and has competed round the world in all manner of tournaments in his younger days as well as attending seminars and training events held by General Choi, founder of ITF TKD. He is also keen to put a fair bit of emphasis into learning "real world" self defence terchniques, as well as grappling and ground work since he is learning BJJ himself now and is passing on his knowledge to us.

Best advice is to see what's available in your area and go along to watch, if it looks like it could be your thing have a chat with instructor, see if you can attend a beginners class as a trial (some places might even offer you a free trial class) and see if it's for you, if not move on.

I'm currently a red tag, so next grading I'll be going for my BB and whilst I will continue on with my TKD I think I might also take up something else, Aikido quite takes my fancy.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Don't get me wrong mate: i'm not saying they aren't useful, just that for the average joe, keeping it simple is probably the best

I seem to recall in a exchange with Audilover who was saying some fairly inflamatory things about your physique, you put a photo on SN. It was obvious from that you're no 8 stone weakling, so I would respectfully suggest that simply training in a few strikes a blocks probably wouldn't be much less effective for someone like you, unless you reached a high deal of proficiency in something more fancy.

There are very effective ways of negating size/strength differences, but I'd much rather be the bigger man in a fight, especially if I also knew those techniques!

Actually, I'd much rather not be in the fight in the first place: I really dislike violence- especially those who are violent to prove something

Did AudiLover ever respond to your pose down challenge?

Matteeboy

LOL!!!

No he didn't - I'm convinced he's a 16 stone lardo or maybe a 7 stone wiener!

Been training is martial arts since 11 (now an elderly 32) and one thing it has taught me is - avoid violent situations at all costs! And that anyone that goes on about "being hard" is actually a bit of a loser.

Done competition kickboxing, karate and a bit of kung fu - enjoyed the KBing the most but sadly I can't find a decent club in Cornwall so have to partake in "training with me, myself and I" or if I'm feeling energetic, play fighting with the puppy!

Anyway, back on subject - I've met high grade martial artists who would simply panic in a real situation - It's a lot about using your mind and keeping your head rather than throwing some double spinning axe kick or similar (and falling over)!

Might post my "how to do a Chinese press up" pics one day..Tee hee...

Luan Pra bang

I think its accepted that for the first 5-6 years of marital arts 25% of your class room skills may get used in a fight the rest is lost in adrenaline and panic but at its most basic if that 25% teaches you to punch straight while keeping balance and keeping your hands in the way to block then it can make a massive difference. Footwork a blalance can make the difference between ending up on the floor or not and staying upright should be enough to keep you alive with your brains intact.

Deep Singh

Thanks. Lots of useful info here for me to look into. I have a Krav Mag class not too far away in Essex, maybe I'll go take a look. Could anyone with knowledge please give me a quick comparison( ie pros and cons) of the following;

Krav
Jui Jitsu
Akido
Wing Chun

njkmrs

well I wasnt going to mention what my wife did to me one day at a family BBQ.

But lets say it stopped me in my tracks .!!

My own fault .Beer got the better of me and I got a bit cocky ,forgetting she was the jujitsu expert ,not me .!!!

Did not see it coming ,but good to know she can look after herself ,if she needs to .Yes still together .
I just know my place a bit better .

warrenm2

Like I said, Krav is a "quick and dirty" wing chun, (adapted by the Isreali military), more emphasis on strength and aggression. Wing chun is softer and more subtle, but may take longer to master it, but you will be better at the end. Your choice as to what you are aiming for. As mentioned before, go along to a class and watch, dont pick the first one you see though.

Bruce Lee started in Wing Chun, and then went on to form JKD by the way.

Cant comment on the other 2!

NeilT

Self defence - I think theres a belief that arts such as Krav Maga and some others (kickboxing) can offer a quick route to 'master' level but IMHO none of the above will give you much benefit in self defence until you've been studying them for years, its not until that time you learn the focus, distance, muscle memory and improve your reaction time amongst other factors (such as learning to take a blow). Up until then you might have a slight advantage. Once you've been at them for a few years all will offer an advantage in self defence, depening on how proficient you are.

Fun factor - (which is important, else you end up jacking it in when it gets tough) all depends on the instructor and the other students.

Fitness - Probably all much the same, Martial arts is great for cardio workouts.

Other factors include perfection of character, inner calm and stress busting. No idea how they might compare on this level.

I'm at currently studying brown/black level in Shotokan (last level of brown before black) and only over the last few weeks have started to feel something developing with regards to focus and power (kimae) which one of the hardest aspects to learn (i.e. when to apply the focus and power for full effect and when to become loose the for speed). Despite my grade, I still rate myself a beginner.

As I said before, try a few and see what suits you, be interested to see what you think of Krav Maga though.

Also, have a look on KarateForums.com - Karate and Martial Arts Discussion Forums - basically Scoobynet for the Martial artist. Lots of superb advice on there.

Neil

Hol

iTrader: (1)

I just typed up a load of advice based on my experience, including something that happened at Trax 3 years ago. But it reads like I am some sort of nuutter. So I deleted it.


It seems a lot of people are pushing their own discipline.
Im one of NS04's 'man mountains', so what works as intimiidation for me, might not for you.

I suppose we need to revisit what YOU want to do (in a confrontational situation):

- Avoid the situation completely
- Stop the situation escallating
- End the situation in your favour.

Hol

iTrader: (1)

Neil,

How long has that taken you.

It takes about 5 years to get 1st Kyu at our Dojo. Then at least a years wait for an invite to the annual Dan Grading.

Sorry to highjack the thread.

Matteeboy

I think rather than making you "hard" it's just an enjoyable way to channel a bit of stress and get fit.
While I have no illusions that I'm super hard, I feel physically confident 99% of the time and that makes life easier - no worrying about dodgy areas, no panicking if people start getting lairy in a pub, etc.

It doesn't take a very long time to develop a proper punch but the instant reactions take ages - I used to get bored to tears of the same old blocks in karate until I realised that if anyone threw a punch or a kick, I could block it without thinking - it's helped out many times in the past.

I wouldn't dismiss those that haven't been training for years and years - some of our students were real naturals and learnt very quickly, others simply couldn't grasp the techniques even after several years.

AndyC_772

iTrader: (2)

I'm not sure that 'pushing' is necessarily the right word - personally I've done Jiu Jitsu for about 4 years, so I feel qualified to comment on it and to recommend it on the basis of what the OP is asking for. I've never done the other martial arts being suggested, so I've no idea whether they're any more or less suitable.

The same is probably true for others too - it only makes sense to talk about styles of which you have personal experience.

The Chief

Agree with above - training in martial arts for a long period of time puts you in a positive mindset and to be honest the confidence shows.

situations where you would normally panic you take in your stride.

I did TKD for 4 years and loved it but there are a lot of stuff in the syllabus that would not work in the street/pub but sometimes it can with certain people give them over-confidence to the point of being arrogant

Doing martial arts is not a guarenteed to make you unbeatable or hard - it gives you an advantage an nothing more.

For instance i would not like to go up against a 20 stone bouncer - i'd come off worse.

The best thing TKD did for me was to learn me to spot trouble and take steps to avoid it, and if that meant walking away then so be it.






If not then i can still do the death touch

NeilT

Yes, just over 5 years so far and again got to wait a year at 1st kyu to take Shodan

I've seen some McDojos where you can get shodan in 2 years - wouldnt waste my time

Neil

Matteeboy

Neil - took me four years to get to brown belt in Shotokan but that was a loooong time ago (aged 15!) and I suspect things may have changed.

Kickboxing, although "graded" is split into two very different areas - those that work up the belts, and those who just compete - a national champ I knew was only officially orange belt! I did a number of KBing grades but I was more interested in teaching the physical side (bit of a sado masochist I think!) and competing - the most tiring thing I have ever been involved in (including RM officer selection, Ironmans, etc)!!

NeilT

yes, agree with the competing - did a competition a couple of years ago, both kata and kumite - was exhausting mentally and physically, plus broke 2 ribs and dislocated my toe havent competed since!

Interesting I do trail running on the side to keep up my fitness for karate and my heart rate monitor watch shows my bpm around 8 higher during karate as opposed to running

Neil

Matteeboy

Neil - I reckon my heart nearly blew up at my last KBing comp - the adrenaline was just daft.
Ended up with concussion that kicked in an hour after I finished. Managed to grab a decent UK ranking before running to the loos to throw up, followed by being spaced out for a good few hours.

Happy days!

Got well into trail running (first 10k trail race a couple of weeks ago) now - verging on being addicted in fact...!

The Chief

The first time i competed i crapped myself.

stepping into that square was an eye opener - loads of people shouting for (and against) me.

My first round i beat the guy quite easy, which made me a bit over confident to be honest.

As soon as the next guy stepped in i knew i was in trouble, being a tubby little ****** i was dumped in the heavyweight division.

Anyway this guy stepped in around 6'2" and looking at him he should have been kept in a cage.

Anyway he proceeded to knock ten tons of s*** out of me and punching me full on on the nose - even though it was meant to be semi contact.

my only strike is when i did a reverese side kick and dropped him - however that was the only decent strike i got in.

i walked away humiliated and bloodied and vowed never again.

(but i did though)