WHEELSHOP0_0

HUH? thats only 1.45mins ago

Wurzel

iTrader: (1)

I am a quick learner

oh yeah and I said 830 not 8:30! I was still in bed at 8:30

Shark Man

Is this thread a patheic excuse to empbarce multicultralism and open our boarders ***** nilly?

Remember how many times this country was invaded, and taken over.


Its happening again, just without the wars

Ben v7

I guess in the past too that most of the mixing that has gone on in this country has been largely with people from not too far away - hardly the other side of the world.

Now though its from a completely different region with completely different beliefs - most of Europe has always been either Christian or Orthadox. Funny again how this is supposed to make no difference...

Also it doesn't seem to get mentioned that the immigration currently is on an unprecidented scale. Millions in the last few years... again this is supposed to make no difference.

I also find it bizzare how suddenly it's our Britishness that will win through. We are all 'British' after all eh - whatever that means these days. Ask many immigrants what they are and they will say that they are something first and British second. Very different to how it is in the US where they are all American first and foremost...

Wurzel

iTrader: (1)

I am English first, British second and European third

Leslie

I am half Austrian on my mother's side but having been born and brought up in this country I support the old British set of values which are unfortunately fast disappearing.

I have nothing against hard working immigrants who support themselves and are not a burden on our social services.

I do however believe that we cannot continue to admit large numbers of immigrants any more since we do not have the infrastructure to cope and so our own people are beginning to suffer from lack of housing, schooling and the NHS etc. This is a very highly populated country and we are being pushed over the top. It is not right that the services we have paid for all our lives are being filched by those who have not contributed.

Les

TonyG

I class myself as English, but that's mainly because I was born here. Underneath, I'm 100% Earthling, as I seem to be made of the same elements (born in the heart of a dying star billions of years ago) as everyone else on the planet.

Shark Man

The thing is with the heritage junk, is that the United Kingdom, as a country of its own right isn't really "that" old. Granted, it's older than Australia and the USA, but it follows that whilst under various reigns and empires of rule, our idiginous population goes under a change of origins (hands up if your a Roman ).

Fast forward to more modern times and this country now exists in its own right. And from that point onwards the population would be considered British, despite their ancestor's origins. It's not a isolated case; When looking at more "newer" countries that we previously invaded and populated, some of their ancestors can be traced back to the UK. But now they are independant of the UK they, classify themselves as citizens of their own country, not English immigrants. You could consider than if your ancestor's roots date back in a country for at least 100years, then you are indiginous to that population. But for argument's sake, some people will only consider going back much further Point being, if you go back in time far enough, our ancestors were caveme, so does that make us all evolved apes? The stupidity of this also lies that at one point in time was no such thing as a country, so where "did" we come from then?

The difference is that back in more hostile times countries were taken over, populated or invaded against the idiginous population's wishes, the UK was no exception. So, on the basis of events on our history, we could question modern day immigration along the same lines, and should it be seen as the same; An invasion? Just today, our boarders allows it, not defends it. Even though there are populations who have ancestors dating back for at least a hundred years who are against it, after all, they remained here from the last "invasion". So is it in their best interest to keep it theirs?

Think of it as the Grey Squirrel vs. the Red Squirrel

Ben v7

Also have to ask yourself why countries were even formed in the first place...

Was it not in part to protect the beliefs and values of the people of those countries?

Just wondering if there is any correlation between this apparent decline of national pride plus lack of respect for institutions with mass immigration of those from completely different societies who clearly do not share the same beliefs and values.

Food for thought, that's all.

I also share Leslies view that paying current tax's is one thing, but what was done in the past to establish our society is another. Especially when all the work that went into the country to get it to it's current 'evolved' state is both taken for granted, abused or even resented by large groups of new comers.

TopBanana

Is it repeated?

gingerboy

Loving this thread, as always with SN it would appear that the usual suspects are getting the desired responses.

I can trace my family back 600 years, it is scottish / celt all the way other than the last generation which is Manc / bolton and I am proud to be a born and bred Lancastrian, born in the city of Lancaster.

Strangely enough never considered myself English as their was / is such a strong North / south divide, if asked my nationality the answer was always "Northerner" and as proved in a recent poll / research it's a known fact we are far suprior in terms of sense of humour............................................ .. no offence to you southern shandy swilling ballerinas intended of course ;-).

Begs the question of equality / race in terms of geographic UK areas let alone nationality and or colour of your skin.

Now live in South Wales and my wife is quarter cast, not sure what though as her Gran will not disclose what origins her WWII acquaintance / GI soldier was, so a bit of a mystery their and a shame that it would appear that my wife and our kids will never know their roots on that side of the family as she is now suffering from senial dimensha (spelling) :-(.

So goes to show that their is a real mix out their.

Just my input for what it is worth.

GB

Ben v7

None taken you northern monkey.

gingerboy

Excellent response, see your not that bad afterall , although personally if I had my way they would construct a large damn just south of birmingham and flood the southern end of the country.................... excluding Wales of course .

Now, wheres mi pie and chips wit gravy on it ................................... I know you have no idea what I am on about, gravy whats gravy .

GB

Ted Maul

Interesting about the formation of countries. I guess the UK differs from mainland Europe in this. It could be argued that countries were formed so as to protect the land that they had fought and took ownership of. There are many societies spread across borders that causes issues today.

I think you make a valid point in linking the issue of a lack of national pride with MASS immigration. In the days of my great grandparents coming over here from Poland at the turn of the century, they were obviously a different culture but due to the lack of numbers I think they had to adapt and integrate to survive. I think until maybe 20 years ago the steady trickle of immigrants had blended with the existing population to create what I believe to be a superior community with diversity, but still showing the original fundamental values. I don't blame immigrants of today - they are sticking with what and who they know. I would point the blame at the government for not having the forsight to see the issues of integration becoming a major issue when country borders came down and large scale movements of people began.

There's an attitude that discussing immigration can be concieved as racist. Michael Howard, who advocated much tighter controls of immigration, was attacked because his earlier generations had been immigrants (similar to mine), so how dare he have this view. I think that showed that people were not being intelligent enough to see key differences in the way immigration has developed over the years.

One problem now is that people will blame immigrants in this country for the problems, but this will just aggravate the problems. ITS NOT THEIR FAULT (IMO). Of course there are always bad apples and these are over highlighted in the media, but most are looking for a better life, move to areas where they have familiarity, practise their own culture (wouldn't you?) etc. We have to work better together in slowly changing the problems we have. Turning ones hate towards them will only make things much worse.

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

I am about 10 % Afro, my hair if left to grow goes all 'Shaft'.

shustir

Then I must be your long lost brother

JTaylor

I agree completely.

GarethE

iTrader: (1)

100% Welsh, and I can trace that all the way back to 1348 and a sheep called Flossy and a miner called Dai

Infact its the same at 1948 !!!!

hectic

gobshoites!

Ben v7

That pretty much mirrors my thoughts on the issue.

Trout

iTrader: (1)

Just out of interest if I post at work it is my loss as I own the company and as far as references to my mother are concerned she died earlier this year.