KiwiGTI

And how many of these are breaking the law and using their Polish vehicles in the UK for more than 6 months in a 12 month period?

And how many of these are working but only earning £15,000 and able to claim low income benefits and concessions from the council. In fact they can be in council housing if they earn under £30k for a 1 bedroom, £40k for a 2 bedroom etc.

So quite conceivably a Polish immigrant could be living in a 2 bedroom council apartment (and a lot aren't sihtholes these days) and paying £250 a month while earning £35,000pa and flaunting a lot of other things too like car registration, parking fines, speed cameras etc. While his wife earns £20,000 cash as a cleaner that is undeclared.

pwhittle

Plus if Little'un had called his work collegue "Black" or any other remark, he'd probably be sacked for racist remarks.[/quote]

Not for calling someone Black, Black is an ethnic origin catogory, as in BME - Black or minority ethnic. I doubt anyone would be offended by that title.

GC8

Because there's more speculation about a US-led invasion, prompted now by the confirmation that Iranian-trained fighters have been captured by the Isrealis in Southern Lebanon. A thinly-veiled nuclear ambition combined with endless anti-Isreali and anti-Western rhetoric; and a ****-load of oil in the back garden, all help to make Irans position uncertain.

Simon

TelBoy

What good would i be over there though?

GC8

Aren't you a reservist Tel?

TelBoy

No, just too bloody old for all that malarkey

The Zohan

Sits back to wait for the first 'ýou are a racist comment'.

The fact is no-on knows and it appears ignored by police and council people i speak to.


It then festers and creates more bad feel and resentment.

davegtt

I dont know, do you? Or you just guessing and tarring people with a dirty brush?

And so coud you or I no?

Yeah sure theyre earning 20k a year in cleaning wages round here Its hard enough to get 20k around here as a bloody engineer or technician let alone cleaning.

Ohh and why would it be undeclared compared to the english who live next door to them? We have as much troubles with our own doing dodgy dealing without worrying about a minority of immigrants.

SJ_Skyline

I bet the water shortage in the south east has been caused by the Polish immigrants drinking all the water too!

* Note to self:
Must remember not to read the Daily Mail

The Zohan

Dave, the number of purely illegals is not known, assuming 750k best guess by Blair and the fools so double may be closer, the number of uk chavscum abusing the system is not known but could be similar numbers, could be double, could be triple, could be half. who knows??

However - answer me please

Do you really, hand on heart think that letting people into the UK who then abuse the system is ok?

Is it Ok if immigrants do this because some ***** do it who where born here do the same is ok?

Neither is acceptable in my mind!

It really grates on me that the UK is seen as the soft touch.

DCI Gene Hunt

Not ALL immigrants are scumbags especially the few hundred that work in the fields around me..... they're up every morning at 4 - 5 AM picking onions, carrots etc. and still there gone 7 - 8 PM......

Trouble is that we NEED them here, there's a market for them and they arrive READY to work...... Unlike the lazy ar5ed Brits, who spend all day slagging them off............... and wouldn't be seen DEAD in a feckin field WORKING for a living!

davegtt

Sorry, Didnt think illegals got a council house given too them, isnt that for the asylum seekers? Dont the illegals hide illegally? hence not knowing how many there are in the country? we'd know how many there were if we was giving them all a house wouldnt we? No I dont agree with letting people in to abuse the system, Id be suprised if anybody at all agreed with it. But how do you know someone is abusing the system? How do you know out of say 100k migrants, how many of them are here to abuse it? You dont because you just presume they all are. Judging a book etc.

KiwiGTI

Don't get me wrong, I think the number one problem this country needs to sort out is it's own people - the chavs/yobs, the benefit cheaters, the lazy welfare spongers etc but i find it more offensive that a foreign person can do that.

I arrived in the UK with about 5 years ago and have never once had a benefit, handout, discount etc or expected one. And I would never expect to go to another country and do the same.

And I didn't tar them all with the same brush, just asked how many of them are doing it.

GC8

Everyone posting on this thread seems to have differentiated between 'illegal immigrants' and 'asylum seekers'. Has New Labours political spin started to take effect? Most asylum seekers have no more right to be here than the illegal immigrants that everyone seems to hate. Id suggest that most of the problems that we have and that are being discussed here are actually caused by bogus asylum seekers; who're here quite legally. The only sensible thing that one poster has said, is that illegal immigrants dont get council provided housing nor benefits; as a result the greater majority have to work in the black economy (can I call it the black economy without repressing anyone?).

Simon

KiwiGTI

They work in the Jamaican community?

davegtt

Sorry I misinterpreted that then, thought I read it with a tone of saying the majority are driving around illegally etc. My fault. They could well be though, we just dont know but I should imagine theyre pulled over fairly regually. Especially if theyre working and have housing theyre going to be traced as to how long theyve been here etc.

DCI Gene Hunt

about right......

RichWalk

i watched this and stuggled to come up with a suitably 'balanced view' on what was said- all in all I was left feeling exactly as you have written above.

Hoppy

Some facts as I understand them:

The subject is British Muslims, born and bred here - not immigrants, illegal or otherwise.

A significant proportion of predominantly young Muslim men now see it as their duty to enforce radical Sharia/Islamic 'laws' and impose them on British society, by force if necessary. Much of their thinking is completely at odds with our own religious beliefs and secular laws.

Many of these disillusioned Muslims condone the 9/11 attack, and indeed the 7/11 bombings were committed by those among their number, ie radical British Muslims.

Britain is only just waking up to 'the terrorist enemy within' and finds many radical Muslim views totally incompatible with British citizonship.

Question is, what can we realistically do about it?

Richard.

stilover

Elect another Hitler. The problem should go away pretty soon after that.

I ain't joking either !!

I'm not a Racist, but something needs to be done. This is a small Island that just cannot take in the worlds population, which is what seams to be happening. Taxes are going up, why? Because we are having to pay for all these immigrants (both legal and illegal). House prices are going up, why? Because there just isn't enough houses to go round. If immigrants are being given free houses, it only means that there are less houses to go round, so you and me are now paying on average £200k for a house, while immigrants are getting a house for free, as well as money in their pockets every 2 weeks, free education for their children, free NHS care. Only it's not free. You and me pay for it, and the more that come into this country the more money it takes to house, educate them etc, etc. All of which means the government tax it's British countrymen to pay for them all.

Oh yes, and the sooner that ******* tunnel is blown-up the better. Border control was a lot more manageable when they were just coming in off the Ferry, but we've all seen the news reports of them jumping on the trains (French police not in any particular hurry to stop them staying in France) or they walk through it. One report said up to 12,000 a week coming through. 12,000 just think about that. How many more can this country take?

Elect a Hitler who'll kick them all out, and blow the ******* tunnel up.

He'll get my vote.

davegtt

Lets hope you dont have Black hair and brown eyes then eh...

Erm, we've covered this havent we? Illegal immigrants are illegal because theyve sneaked into the country and doing slave labour for £1 an hour. They are not given free housing that you or I fund.

Brilliant isnt it, back in the 80's when the asain community was rising in certain areas, people were moaning that it was actually de-valuing their property.... Now we'll blame them because houses are too expensive

Can we get off the subject of immigrants because as we've tried to point out, its a completely seperate issue, the thread is about Muslims and their way of life compared to ours etc... The majority of new immigrates are most definately not Muslims.

stilover

No I don't. Thanks for asking.

So when they get ill, they don't go to their local NHS hospital do they not? Suppose they just see a illegal back street doctor do they?

Idiot. A UK hospital is not going to turn a dying/sick man away. This then means that we are paying for his health care. Takes me back to the "We are paying for them" part of my argument then.

davegtt

OK Im an idiot Darent think what we'll describe you as though, can't even find a reasoned debate on topic to have a rant at so we'll completely forget about the Muslims this thread is about and just have a general whinge about a whole group of different people....

I suppose if you was on holiday in Spain and didnt have insurance, if you were dying they'd kick you out unless you handed over money first?

stilover

Glad we agree on something then !

petey

IMO religion is good for not much more than to cause friction and war and suffering, for a concept which is claimed to be the opposite it doesn't do a very good job...

also faith, how can someone believe in something that cannot be proved further more how can someone go as far as to offer they're life for something that has just simply been explained by another human and told to accept it?!...(possibly people are just by nature 'sheep' and follow suit?)


IMO of course and i REALLY am not trying to offend anyone but i am simply trying to understand

rasonline

But Britain hasn't remained static over decades.. Surely some of the so called "radicals" are reactive to some situations that have arisen over time.

It's interesting to see how this thread veered off topic into a spat abouot illegal immegrants. The whole Muslim issue with Britain is more about politics and their perception of British injustice in other countries... well who could convince them otherwise when there are persuasive arguments on their side like Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.

Now some ppl say what the hell does that have to do with them in Britain.. but if you study the Muslim religion, one of their teachings is about being aware of plight of Muslims all over. THAT IS WHY THEY JUMP AND SHOUT ABOUT what happens elsewhere.

Now i'm not condoning anything that is forceful but i just think that we mostly seem to miss the angle from which all the aggression is coming from, and that it turns into a case of Machismo (you don't like it here get the f#$& out!) kind of thing and the prob never gets resolved.

Leslie

Telboy,

Please can you explain your criticism of my post No 40, when your post No 98 effectively says exactly the same thing?

Les

TelBoy

Because "traditions" implies everything that goes with Christianity, which is clearly absurd for a Muslim. As i said, you can't insist somebody stops being Muslim, but you can insist they practice it within the bounds of a Western society. Stop being pedantic, contribute something worthwhile to the thread instead for a change.

Leslie

It is just not true to say that "traditions" imply Christanity, and that is not what I meant of course. I certainly did not say that they should change to Christianity. You have merely fastened on that word in a vain attempt to get off the hook.

Both your post and mine said the same thing. You are the one who is being pedantic incidentally.

Les

TelBoy

Oh do shut the **** up. If i've reached the stage where i need to "get off the hook" with you then it's a sad day indeed. Make yourself clear next time and you won't have to waste your time pretending to be the patriarch of these threads.