mpr

You seem to miss the simple fact that women are the primary driver behind the decision to have children.... It's THEIR decision alone if you want to take it to an extreme conlcusion. The man cannot, on his own, decide to have children. In virtually every case of people with kids I know, the man has been at best ambivalent towards the issue of having them or not.... it's nearly always the woman "pushing" for them.

All this losing out on their career lark is fine..... it's like me buying a ferrari and then moaning about how much it costs to service it. The women want the kids, the women should do a fair bit of the paying for the kids IMHO. It's perfectly possible to have kids AND a career IF THEY WANT TO. If they choose not to, for whatever reason, then the man should not necessarily have to foot the bill for their "lifestyle" choice.

weapon69

I cannot speak for other people but my own situation was nothing like that and my partner did want our Son equally as i did.

You say the woman should pay for the kids as they are a 'lifestyle' choice. It sounds to me like you want to have your cake and eat it TBH.

mpr

No, you misunderstand. I mean it's a "lifestyle" choice to not go back to work after they've had the kids.

John Catlin

After 38 years still love her **** to bits.

Don't have a problem.

Adrian F

Why is it assumed that the women has to give up work? I know a number of women who wanted to give up work to spend time with there children and have done so leaving the man to support her and the children etc so having to carry the responsability of being the sole provider.

And then when it doesnt work out he is punished because she has sacrificed her career and has to pay more money!

The only fair way forward is Prenup agreements which should be made to be binding in the UK.

Maybe a holiday to USA get a prenup there and have wedding there that might protect you?

As to responsability for children if the man doesnt want it it is tough he cant force her to have an abortion can he!

Dunk

iTrader: (1)

It's the only way...




D

Jaydee5

There speaks the voice of someone who understands what partnership is all about

If you approach marriage as a "nice little earner" or a "high risk enterprise" no wonder it back fires and you all deserve exactly what you get

Miss Kinky

yep...agree completely

and btw its not always men who lose in divorce cases... when i split with my ex husband he took me to the cleaners... he got a large share of the property i bought before i knew him... he also tried for custody of my son (his step son)...

anyway i've married again, and have married for love and not for financial gain or any other ulterior motive...

Jaydee5

Rubbish, Kinks....you're just as demanding as the rest...you want unbridled kinky sex ...to great music

Diesel

An odd thread this one! Chap is deemed guilty of not being loving or ready for marriage as he is considering if said marriage should fail he would prefer to not end up in a dingy 1 bedroomn flat somewhere minus his pension... I think that is very simplistic and really quite a cheap shot in support of the concept of marriage.

I think marriage is quite unecessary - getting on with each other is far more important. What does he stand to gain by marrying? How will their relationship improve? WHY is marriage so important to his partner - is it really the potentially better odds on financial gain should there be a split [add kids and all that becomes quite irrelevant mind - THEY come first at court].

I think day to day reality is FAR more important than blowing £20k on an event that brings no guarantees and can often have a negative impact on the longevity of a relationship when expectations are not met and when rose tinted glasses are taken off.

I've seen too many men unfairly ruined just cos the woman went off them - or whatever the cause for divorce was. In fact a mates' missus went off with another woman recently and BOY did he have to pay for that, as he moved out and left his lovely house for them both to enjoy, with his kids... Ouch.

SO, just be nice to each other and focus on enjoying life together rather than the discos, dancing uncles and signed bits of paper bits of a relationship!

D
[another similarly nagged one ]

Miss Kinky

and i'm getting it

Miss Kinky

£20k? we spent much less than that!!

what's it brought to our relationship? a sense of commitment... we have stood up infront of family and friends and declared our love for each other... its also made my son much happier as he now feels he has a father figure to look up to. To my son, my marriage means security... its made us into a family

DCI Gene Hunt

Quick... pass the sick bucket................

Miss Kinky

Apparition

Poor girl.... if I knew her name I'd warn her to get out ....NOW !
Yve

Mick

iTrader: (1)

Where does the 50% of marriages end in divorce figure come from?
And...
Looks a lot better odds for you than 50%

Also as I mention to my missus occasionally marriage vows are only 'until death us do part' - and that can be arranged

All the best mate - hope you work it out

Mick

Clarebabes

You really are a selfish person aren't you? Perhaps you should have had more backbone and told her 'no' to kids if you didn't want them.

What I want to know is where did the idea that a relationship is a partnership go? Each partner brings different skills and ideas to the table and work together. My fiance brings in the majority of the money and I work too. I look after the house, cook our dinners, clean and iron his shirts and generally look after him

You get a woman pregnant, she gets tired and looking after a baby is hard work! Men would not be able to cope with the physical and emotional changes.

mpr, with such a negative outlook, you're bound to fail. So instead of trying to find a way of protecting yourself, face up to your responsibilities. Or do the right thing and leave her now before she's too old to find someone who really cares for her.

Miss Kinky

couldn't have put it better myself!

Chrisgr31

What cobblers. A woman might have more biological desire for children but in a steady relationship it is a decision taken by both parties. If as a bloke you don't want children then don't have sex, alternatively have the snip, or alternatively use a condom. It is a fact of life that in most relationships children will become a discussion point in due course. If you don;t want kids may it clear at the start and split up if it becomes a problem.

Equally many men might say it was the womans choice but you sure they aren't saying that because they think it is the in thing to say?

It is not easy having a career and kids as someone needs to look aftr the kids during working hours, and nurseys, childminders etc are not cheap. This also ignores any evidence which says children should be bought upo by their parensts.

As mentioned above children is a joint decision so should be funded jointly

hades

Isn't it interesting in times of alleged equality you still get some women spouting that kind of carp?

The whole point is that the situation shouldn't favour men or women. I do believe if someone has already bought a house outright before meeting someone else (be the first someone male or female), then a divorced partner has no right to "their share" of it IMHO. I do also believe that if either partner has given up a career to look after kids (who ultimately belong to both of you equally!) then that should be considered in any ultimate settlement.

The whole point of the above is that whilst the bloke is more often the one who continues working whilst the woman stays at home, the principles should be applied equally if the situations are reversed. Saying "men couldn't cope" is about as rational, balanced, relevant and truea generalisation as saying "women couldn't cope with a top career" (in case this isn't clear, I'm suggesting both are utter carp)

Ultimately, stereotyping doesn't help much - some women clearly do "gold dig" when there's a break-up, some clearly don't. Equally some men are clearly trying to "screw" the other partner following a break-up, some aren't. Unfortunately, it's often the "innocent" party that loses out.

SD

That second article of yours get's it's maths slightly wrong. Taking the first article, as 1.4% of all couples per year, that means that on average in England if say the average marriage is 30 years then there's a 42% chance that you'll get divorced. Not good odds. Please remember that the emphasis here is 'per year'!

Simon

The Rani

I don't think love and trust come into it at all these days. My ex-partner of 10 years went off last November owing about £25K to all and sundry. All I can say is that his new wife is welcome to him.

Adrian F

So the reasons for not having a Prenup aggreement about who gets what if it goes wrong is?

I think he is right to ensure that he doesnt have to pay an unfair amount out if it doesnt last.

Diesel

Well yes you could just hire a council official and get the paperwork sorted for much less, but where's the romance in that!!!

I think real and practical things like buyng a house together, having 'planned' kids, letting her drive the Scooby , buying life insurance []are worth far more than a 'show' in front of family. They will surely know if you truly love each other without the event. Unsure if your son has a new stepdad now, but that does seem like a very valid reason if it gives HIM security.

I'm not against marriage per se, and will get married myself [once the kids are old enough to chip in for a proper bash ] but I think substance should come before ceremony, and I feel that is often lacking these days. The ceremony is a substitute for nothing and is often seen as the panacea and pinnacle by some ladies which I really feel it is not - and of course it can be absurdly prejudicial to men if it all goes Pete Tong. Still I love a good wedding, the hypocrite that I am

D

Miss Kinky

Our wedding was very romantic and very intimate - exactly what we wanted. It just didn't cost the earth...

We're doing some of the other things you say - getting a house, driving each other's cars... Wish we could have children together but it's not going to happen...

Yes my son has a new step dad

Diesel

Sounds like you understand the real reasons Miss K. Good luck to you [just dont scratch his car]

martyrobertsdj

iTrader: (1)

I recently came home from working overseas (as I have for the last eight years or so) to be told quite bluntly....." I don't love you like I think a wife should love a husband, and the marriage is over".

Shellshocked to say the least, but the decision has been made for me and no amount of "can I do anything to save our marriage and our family?" has made any difference.

We decided to go to mediation because we both feel/agree that solicitors will basically antagonise the situation and create hostility.

My number one priority.....my 2 1/2 year old son! The plan was that we would value the house and have half the equity each. I'd probably buy her out.........then we went to mediation.........

I earn more than her.
My Grandfathers house is half mine legally (therefore I have a major asset). Even though he's still alive and reasonably fit and still lives in the house.

Guess what.............she gets just about all the equity from our house and I get just about nothing. Thankyou very much.

Married for three years, together for twelve. She packed in her job when our son was born.....she HATED the job anyway and I have paid for everything since then. I've paid mortgage, etc for the last eight years too. She's always known about my Grandads house, but said that she didn't want any of my "inheritance"....nothing to do with her (she said).

Oh how it changed when a solicitor (mediator) told her it was included!!!

I've worked very hard, missed half of my son's 2 1/2 years growing up because I work away to earn enough money to maintain the lifestyle she wanted, never questioned her if she wanted to buy anything, etc, etc. Now she can just bugger off coz she's "changed".....oh yeah......she just happens to take all I have with her!!

I have decided........not bothered about the money, the house, etc.......only bothered about my Son. We've sorted out shared parenting and I'll have him 4 days/nights/week when I'm home. Not my dream of family life for the next twenty years, but better than nothing eh?

Who says the system isn't biased??!!!