Subaru Heist at Drayton Manor!!!!!
24 June 2006, 11:09 AM
#31
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MaDaSS you are saying you won't go to Drayton Manor because a few people have had their cars stolen, You had best be careful, Maybe you should leave the scoob in the garage next time you pop to asda/tesco's I am sure recently a few have been stolen in the Notts area 
It's the car they are after, thy are not bothered about where they steal it from!
It's the car they are after, thy are not bothered about where they steal it from!
only if they know what they're doing
24 June 2006, 11:17 AM
#34
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Originally Posted by ScoobywagonGl
MaDaSS you are saying you won't go to Drayton Manor because a few people have had their cars stolen, You had best be careful, Maybe you should leave the scoob in the garage next time you pop to asda/tesco's I am sure recently a few have been stolen in the Notts area
It's the car they are after, thy are not bothered about where they steal it from!
It's the car they are after, thy are not bothered about where they steal it from!
There have been a load of cars stolen in Notts for sure.
But it would put me off leaving it for a day in an area being targeted at the minute.
Now i know cars are being targeted all the time, all over the place, but if you then hear of a certain place being hit, would you still go?
You cannot really compare shopping for 2 hours to leaving it all day in an area you know it being hit.
24 June 2006, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by MaDaSS
You cannot really compare shopping for 2 hours to leaving it all day in an area you know it being hit.
she may need more than 2 hours As for going to an area I know is being hit then yes I would still go, that is why I have insurance. Apart from that I hate my car so they would be welcome to it
24 June 2006, 01:03 PM
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On a busy day (ie most of the summer) DM have thousands of cars parked, like most theme parks/big events in fields set aside for parking.
So either the thieving scumbags are watching near the gate (for many hours possibly) or driving around the car parks (note car parkS as there is more than one field). Once found, they know they probably have a number of hours before the owner returns.
Basically beyond common sense precautions if you're still worried about your scoob being taken then sell it for a knacker. (note knacker, as any other similarly desirable car is equally likely to be targeted, you only hear about scoobs as this is a subaru forum).
Also, am I correct in thinking that it's only classic scoobs that are taken by 'hot wiring' like this..?
So either the thieving scumbags are watching near the gate (for many hours possibly) or driving around the car parks (note car parkS as there is more than one field). Once found, they know they probably have a number of hours before the owner returns.
Basically beyond common sense precautions if you're still worried about your scoob being taken then sell it for a knacker. (note knacker, as any other similarly desirable car is equally likely to be targeted, you only hear about scoobs as this is a subaru forum).
Also, am I correct in thinking that it's only classic scoobs that are taken by 'hot wiring' like this..?
24 June 2006, 04:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Iwan
that the RAC Trackstars fitted in their cars were effectively just dead weight. Sad thing is even if they do work, they can be found and killed in about 5 minutes if you have half a clue what you're doing.
There are certain cheap things that blacks out the signal till its found
Originally Posted by sienar33
Do insurance companies get kick backs for stipulating Trackers must be installed?!
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Originally Posted by p1mark
he said dont worry they only put them in 1 of 2 places on subarus.
Took him about 30 seconds to find it!
Took him about 30 seconds to find it!
BTW even if you don't subscribe you are still being tracked
24 June 2006, 04:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Raartoot
...basically the five O said it was becoming a headache for both Drayton and themselves, Drayton have lost quite alot of visitors due to the word getting around and so it should be. Not being funny but the park has had approx 24 performance vehicles swiped in 18months!!!!!!....So why havnt they sorted their security out???!!!???!!!!!Gits.
a cynic may suggest that the low-life scum have someone on the inside. not that i'm pointing a finger at anyone.
24 June 2006, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by N1gel 1970
i have no knowldge of this place, but an expensive bit of metal being stolen on average every 3 weeks (even more when you think most places close for 4months during the winter) does seem unreal.
a cynic may suggest that the low-life scum have someone on the inside. not that i'm pointing a finger at anyone.
a cynic may suggest that the low-life scum have someone on the inside. not that i'm pointing a finger at anyone.
I thought the same when a scoob was disappearing off Brum Airport's NCP multi-story car park on a weekly basis (both classics and new age). Especially considering you needed to pay to get out through the barriers
25 June 2006, 02:33 PM
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RAC probably won't do it. But any auto electrican or compenent person could move it. 
Although there are limited places to put it really. But I can think of a few awkward nooks and crannies on a scoob that it could be moved to without it being easy to find or get at.
Although there are limited places to put it really. But I can think of a few awkward nooks and crannies on a scoob that it could be moved to without it being easy to find or get at.
25 June 2006, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by marmski
after reading this... i might get mine moved then to make it a little more useful if the car was targeted.
Tony
26 June 2006, 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by marmski
Can you have the RAC Tracker moved to a place randomly choosen by yourself?
Really the antenna should be integrated into a piece of external factory trim as standard, so that it is indistinguishable and undetectable by thieves....
26 June 2006, 06:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Marky9074
Even if the electronics are moved, the GPS antenna would still have to be in the line of sight i.e. in full view of the sky, which um means it can only go in one of two locations....this is why it is so easy to disable.
Really the antenna should be integrated into a piece of external factory trim as standard, so that it is indistinguishable and undetectable by thieves....
Really the antenna should be integrated into a piece of external factory trim as standard, so that it is indistinguishable and undetectable by thieves....
26 June 2006, 08:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Marky9074
Even if the electronics are moved, the GPS antenna would still have to be in the line of sight i.e. in full view of the sky, which um means it can only go in one of two locations....this is why it is so easy to disable.
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IMHO the standard UK scoob Sigma alarm is tottally adequate. The better deterants are the mechanical ones. The big yellow wheel lock and Gearlock these could cause more hassle to scumbags than some very clever electronic options.
The only other base that considering far more are stolen by Hijacking and key theft. There are a few options on the market but remeber If a pro wants your car he will have it.
Originally Posted by Marky9074
Really the antenna should be integrated into a piece of external factory trim as standard, so that it is indistinguishable and undetectable by thieves....
Tony
Ps I would go for the fingerprint option either
you might find writing a problem afterwards much easlier to give them your keys
26 June 2006, 09:24 PM
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Originally Posted by LongTimeLurker
Is the tracker monitor a better bit of kit to have because it uses radio wave instead of GSM?
This is speculation though, as I am sure the positioning is purely done by GPS.
Last edited by Marky9074; 26 June 2006 at 09:28 PM.
26 June 2006, 09:35 PM
#51
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Reading the monitor gumf it does indeed say that it emits land based signal, whether this is just the uplink data from the GPS or actually a land based position I dont know.
Given the radio licensing regulations in the UK, I think the maximum tx power of a radio over the 'medical and research' frequencies (which I assume it would use) is around 1/2 watt. So the police car would almost have to be on top of it to find it.....
I believe the system relies heavily on getting a GPS position, and without that you would have to be really lucky to pick it up from the land signal.
Given the radio licensing regulations in the UK, I think the maximum tx power of a radio over the 'medical and research' frequencies (which I assume it would use) is around 1/2 watt. So the police car would almost have to be on top of it to find it.....
I believe the system relies heavily on getting a GPS position, and without that you would have to be really lucky to pick it up from the land signal.
Last edited by Marky9074; 26 June 2006 at 09:40 PM.
27 June 2006, 11:25 AM
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Thanks Marky9074, basically if the a car thief had half a clue what they were doing he / she could turn an expensive tracker into a paper weight and make off untracked then .
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27 June 2006, 11:32 AM
#53
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Originally Posted by kplonk
shame you have to do this, but makes sence to me.
Originally Posted by Marky9074
Given the radio licensing regulations in the UK, I think the maximum tx power of a radio over the 'medical and research' frequencies (which I assume it would use) is around 1/2 watt. (.
************************************************** ** edited by me
These units sell like hotcakes especially the battery operated ones, I just wonder who uses them!!!! Took me just 30 secs to find on sale ***************Tony
27 June 2006, 12:08 PM
#54
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Originally Posted by Shark Man
I must admit, having ANY type of Impreza turbo and NOT having a means of secondary security in addition to the stock alarm/immobiliser and tracker is somewhat shortsighted and foolish imo.
Don't really want to harp on about hindsight here of what should or should not do, as its useless and won't help the owner now. But it's an opinion that I formed long ago that non-visual security does not put off theives on any car (not just Subarus). If anything, it attracts theives on a desirable car.
Sure, they aren't impregnable. But its "one more" thing in addition to the other security measures. That's why I have a CAT3 rated wheelclamp AND a CAT3 rated sterering lock in addition to the factory immobilser. AND in addition, a aftermarket CAT1 alarm/immobilser (not the stock "plug in" sigma tat), in addition to no external door locks, in addition to security film (even though its frameless windows- the glass is much harder to break). In addition to the non-factory tracker (NOT RAC).
Next step is a internal smoke/fog system and remote GSM pager wired to the alarm
Little note with tracker, most people here are on about RAC's tracker. This is different to Tracker the company "Tracker Network UK ltd" (eg. Tracker monitor/tracker Horizon). As not all tracker systems are the same, as they are operated and installed by differnt companies and use different tracking devices, therefore some are more relaible than others.
Don't really want to harp on about hindsight here of what should or should not do, as its useless and won't help the owner now. But it's an opinion that I formed long ago that non-visual security does not put off theives on any car (not just Subarus). If anything, it attracts theives on a desirable car.
Sure, they aren't impregnable. But its "one more" thing in addition to the other security measures. That's why I have a CAT3 rated wheelclamp AND a CAT3 rated sterering lock in addition to the factory immobilser. AND in addition, a aftermarket CAT1 alarm/immobilser (not the stock "plug in" sigma tat), in addition to no external door locks, in addition to security film (even though its frameless windows- the glass is much harder to break). In addition to the non-factory tracker (NOT RAC).
Next step is a internal smoke/fog system and remote GSM pager wired to the alarm
Little note with tracker, most people here are on about RAC's tracker. This is different to Tracker the company "Tracker Network UK ltd" (eg. Tracker monitor/tracker Horizon). As not all tracker systems are the same, as they are operated and installed by differnt companies and use different tracking devices, therefore some are more relaible than others.
I had a mint XR2 stolen from Blackpool back in the early 90's (only had it a week, TPO insurance
)It had alarm, hidden immobiliser, steering lock and gear lever lock and they still took it without problem - there wasn't even any glass around so they must've either broken in carefully, or towed it away.
27 June 2006, 12:43 PM
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Cat 3 locks though?
I've never seen a gear lock that is cat3 as most are too easy to overcome. Same goes for stoplocks and krooklock bars, which have never been cat 3 approved either.
What your gaining is time - as in the time it takes to overcome. Not prevention. If they hang around long enough there is more chnace they'll get spotted, or lose their bottle and give up.
Belive me, if you do enough home work the only way it'll go if its physically lifted with a Hi-Ab. Or dragged onto a flatbed or trailer using wheel dolleys on the clamped wheel. Can't say I've heard of that happen much, but it does rule out the lesser equipped theives.
And then, if there is another car that entices them parked nearby without as much obvious security - they are going to target that before yours - especially in a car parked littered with EVOs and Imprezas
I've never seen a gear lock that is cat3 as most are too easy to overcome. Same goes for stoplocks and krooklock bars, which have never been cat 3 approved either.
What your gaining is time - as in the time it takes to overcome. Not prevention. If they hang around long enough there is more chnace they'll get spotted, or lose their bottle and give up.
Belive me, if you do enough home work the only way it'll go if its physically lifted with a Hi-Ab. Or dragged onto a flatbed or trailer using wheel dolleys on the clamped wheel. Can't say I've heard of that happen much, but it does rule out the lesser equipped theives.
And then, if there is another car that entices them parked nearby without as much obvious security - they are going to target that before yours - especially in a car parked littered with EVOs and Imprezas
Last edited by Shark Man; 27 June 2006 at 12:47 PM.
27 June 2006, 12:53 PM
#56
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As I have had my WRX300 a year now (and my TT) I should have had a renewal for both trackers...
I wonder if as a test they will prove to me if they can track my car, before I agree to pay the renewal? That is after I 'disable' the GPS...
I wonder if as a test they will prove to me if they can track my car, before I agree to pay the renewal? That is after I 'disable' the GPS...
28 June 2006, 12:06 AM
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Originally Posted by LongTimeLurker
Is the tracker monitor a better bit of kit to have because it uses radio wave instead of GSM?
Originally Posted by Shark Man
What your gaining is time - as in the time it takes to overcome. Not prevention. If they hang around long enough there is more chnace they'll get spotted, or lose their bottle and give up.
once located the unit or the points where new alarm cables joins car circuits its a paperwieght. Remember he doesn't have to take things apart with correct tools and without scratching. Technology on these Devices are wonderful but most still work by simple normally open or closed relays cables "Jointed" into existing circuits. The trick is making it look like nothing has ever been added in and then much harder to find
Trackers, GPRS, GSM, Mobile type systems but can be blocked
Most theives will take the Cars keys but Pros wouldn't worry about keys
Most systems will stop "Hope & Dope" though but would strongly advise peeps to systems to protect against HiJack and Keytheft.
"Trackers" are good if they are free but not for £130 a year Subs
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IMHO
Tony
28 June 2006, 11:32 AM
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I believe the system relies heavily on getting a GPS position, and without that you would have to be really lucky to pick it up from the land signal.[/quote]
This is what tracker have to say about Horizon
Stage 1:
If a TRACKER Horizon equipped vehicle is illegally moved, a movement sensor hidden in the vehicle sends a signal to TRACKER HQ.
Stage 2:
TRACKER HQ contacts the vehicle owner to confirm whether the vehicle has been stolen. When confirmed as stolen to TRACKER HQ and the police, the TRACKER unit hidden in the stolen vehicle is activated. The vehicle is now emitting a silent land based radio signal and its position is being logged via GPS satellites. Stage 3:
The silent signal can now be picked up by any of the UK's 52 police forces that are within the vicinity of the stolen vehicle. The signal and the GPS satellite positional information will work in conjunction to direct the police to the exact location of the stolen vehicle.
I gather Autoexpress did a test on various trackers awhile ago and the tracker came out best cos it transmitted a VHS signal (not just gps)which meant the signal could be detected even when the car was placed in a metal container truck. The range that police cars and helicopters have varies quite a bit I gather but should be a few miles. Of course if they are able to disable the system before the signal is sent then no hope!
This is what tracker have to say about Horizon
Stage 1:
If a TRACKER Horizon equipped vehicle is illegally moved, a movement sensor hidden in the vehicle sends a signal to TRACKER HQ.
Stage 2:
TRACKER HQ contacts the vehicle owner to confirm whether the vehicle has been stolen. When confirmed as stolen to TRACKER HQ and the police, the TRACKER unit hidden in the stolen vehicle is activated. The vehicle is now emitting a silent land based radio signal and its position is being logged via GPS satellites. Stage 3:
The silent signal can now be picked up by any of the UK's 52 police forces that are within the vicinity of the stolen vehicle. The signal and the GPS satellite positional information will work in conjunction to direct the police to the exact location of the stolen vehicle.
I gather Autoexpress did a test on various trackers awhile ago and the tracker came out best cos it transmitted a VHS signal (not just gps)which meant the signal could be detected even when the car was placed in a metal container truck. The range that police cars and helicopters have varies quite a bit I gather but should be a few miles. Of course if they are able to disable the system before the signal is sent then no hope!
28 June 2006, 01:52 PM
#59
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Because VHF travels in straight lines, like light, as you travel, the curvature of the Earth prevents the signal from reaching you. This happens between 35-50 miles. This is assuming that there is absolutely nothing blocking the line of sight....like a house or building or anothing else for that matter. Bearing that in mind the range is drastically reduced.
In addition to this, the distances quoted above are for VHF with a decent antenna at 25 watts. Based on the fact that it would be a tiny antenna, hidden inside the car body, and transmitting at less than a watt, I would be very surprised if the range was more than a kilometre.
Anyway, the system would not use VHF for the uplink of the GPS data as it would mean that you would need a VHF network throughout the whole country. It is almost certainly GSM, using the existing infrostructure.
I suspect that the VHF is used as a carrier for DF (direction finding) equipment installed in the mobile police cars.
As we have reiterated, without the GPS uplink data, they would not know where to start looking in the first place.....
In addition to this, the distances quoted above are for VHF with a decent antenna at 25 watts. Based on the fact that it would be a tiny antenna, hidden inside the car body, and transmitting at less than a watt, I would be very surprised if the range was more than a kilometre.
Anyway, the system would not use VHF for the uplink of the GPS data as it would mean that you would need a VHF network throughout the whole country. It is almost certainly GSM, using the existing infrostructure.
I suspect that the VHF is used as a carrier for DF (direction finding) equipment installed in the mobile police cars.
As we have reiterated, without the GPS uplink data, they would not know where to start looking in the first place.....