ex-webby

As has already been pointed out, the difference between a Classic and Newage can mean different spring rates (depending on what you want)..... put it this way, I am trying a totally different combination than already remarked upon in this thread. You never know until you test!

The big test being the ScoobyNet Live/ScoobyShootOut handling circuit!

As soon as I have gone through the testing process a full article will be published!

Regards,
Shaun.

novarally

I had a 22mm Rollbar fitted on the front when I had the AST`s fitted and I also have a 22mm rear and the car was under steering like hell with 40/30 so when I went back to Power station to put on 50/40 they fitted a standard arb back on the front as the under steering problem came from both arb`s were 22mm. Can you explain this

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

Which setting did you have the rear 22mm a/r bar set at?

There are front adj 22mm front a/r bars available so maybe this will solve the problem?

F

911

As I've said before and above maybe, it is the sum of the mods/parts that generate a good chassis.
I am no brilliant driver, average at best, so I need all the help I can get, ie a very easy car to drive and handle.(I'm scared stiff of crashing the car)

I have the 22mm bars front and rear with the rear on middle.
Tried 'hard', tried 'soft' holes and always come back to middle.
I do however have huge caster angles on the front, about double stock Sti.
Additionally, I have the Anti lift kit and a bib-full of negative camber too.

The front end goes where I steer it. It does not understeer, and the car does not oversteer. (must try harder?)
Changing the spring rates increased the roll resistance, stabilised the car under accelleration/braking, and damping contol is key.

This is where the design and engineering of the AST's did it for me, especially the last bit!

I wish a real pilot could hill climb the car and I could realise what this car will do in far more capable hands! (no volunteers please except AndyF)

Not sure if that explains things?

Graham.

alanbell

iTrader: (6)

I have the full type 25 suspension set up , its GREAT >> faultless thanks power station,

Carlos13

When I had my stuff fitted I asked for 22mm front, 24mm rear but was strongly advised that a 24mm bar would make the car "undrivable". It was not Powerstation who gave this advice but another very well known Subaru specialist (who it has to be said will never see another penny of mine, but that's another story).

So I opted for stock front, adjustable 22mm rear on the middle hole. My car is only really used on track and to and from track, so I can afford to stiffen it up some more. My aim is for the car to be as fast and as safe as possible.

Fuzz

No problem Alan.

Spring rates quoted on page one are designed around the classic not the new age.

Shauns article should show you some good rates for the new age, although I believe it will be a little lighter than your normal road going spec C

Andy

ex-webby

Quick update for Newage cars.....

3 way adjustables are now fitted.

Initially the setup was not right, but after a setup on Saturday of the rebound and compression / geometry the improvement is like chalk and cheese.

Initial comments from my test drivers (lol - and my brown underpants) concluded that this is perhaps one of the quickest (no point in having power without handling) B road Scoobs around regarding handling and grip levels (I was shocked and stunned).

Still a fair amount of testing to do (track testing), and full report in the future as an article.

Fuzz,
Please let Curtis know that the changes in Toe have made the car feel more positive regards feedback.

Regards,
Shaun.

Fuzz

He'll probably read it in the morning but will do any case.


Andy

911

Shaun:
pm if you like, but what 'clicks' are you using?(although this will be dictated by the spring rates, but the 'ratio' between them is of great interest.)
ps: I'm not doing TOTB5.
ps2: I will willingly send you my clicks/spring rates

Graham

ex-webby

Graham,

I'm not 100% certain of the clicks on all 3 adjustments. I will need to count while winding them all back to be certain.

Current springs are 65/50.

It would be interesting to see how my car performs on your hill climb circuits.

Regards,
Shaun.

911

Same spring rates as me.
I find that i am on the 'soft' side of the clicks, but it is hard to determine if the car is bouncing on compression or rebound!

Adjusting these parameters is much harder than on the 'normal' AST's I had last year.

If you do a hill climb with me then do it in the Midlands and please let me know in advance so i can dream-up some good excuses....

Graham

ex-webby

Yep... I am also on the "softer" settings, but this initial setup is for road use. Will see what needs to be adjusted for track use. The amazing thing is even on these springs you can go flat out on normal roads with the geometry and strut settings at present in my spec c....... there is so much adjustment on these 3 ways to enable you to dial out bounce, dive, over stiffness etc etc.

What is the weight of your car approx?

lol regarding the Hill Climb.

Regards,
Shaun.

911

Bog stock Sti v3 with a 6 point cage/full trim etc so i guess about 1270Kg.

The units certainly are compliant.
For the hills i add a click of hardness.

I had best put this info on my Project thread to please my sponsor!

Graham

jgevers

Hi Graham,

The easiest way to distinguish if the bumpiness comes from bump or rebound is:

Too much rebound will give 'jarring' feeling in your back and ***. As feeling the car is 'holding on to it's wheels'.

Not enough rebound for the tyres will normally start some diagonal pitching on 'high load' corners.

Too much high speed bump will 'launch' the car over the bumpy stuff. The feeling of not having enough suspension compliance or travel as the damper 'locks up' when the spindle has to perform high acceleration.

Not enough high speed bump will allow the car to bottom out over bumps.

Too much low speed damping generally reduces grip as not enough suspension movement is generated during braking and turn in.

Too little low speed damping will allow the car to feel 'soggy' during turn in and braking with a feeling like the car 'falls through it's damping'.

Of course these points are generalisations but it is a start to identify where more grip and better balance can be gained. By the way, if you use the low speed bump to 'hold the car up' on turn in until the bars load up, a lot of grip can be gained. As well as using the low speed bump to slow the intial acceleration of the damper down to keep the terminal damper speed slightly lower to prevent bottoming out over undulations.

I would get sombody with a little bit of experience watch your car during a test session. This together with your feedback should get the car dialled in quite quick.

Cheers

jasonius

iTrader: (1)

Had my AST's (sportline) fitted on MY05 WRX last Monday (along with ALK giving me the T25 setup) and all I can say is WOW..!

Initially the car felt much tighter (more like I was used to with my previous cars- some of the best hot hatches ever built 205/*****/172) exactly what I was hoping for (some achievement), however over the subsequent days the car did feel a little 'jiggly'.

So time for an experiment.. Wound up the damper settings (from the 5f 4r that Curtis had set them at) to 7f 5r and, amazingly, the 'jigglyness' has gone and the car/turn in feels even better..! So easy to get all four tyres squealing when going for it.

Ride wise (as a daily driver) it is a little harder than OEM but considering the handling and the fact I'm on 18's it's really not an issue.

As has been said, this has to be one of the best mods you can do to a Scoob..!

911

Job:
Just pick-up you mail above and the pm. due to Snet being down last night.

That is VERY useful info indeed and will be a great help particularly this weekend.
Thankyou.

Jason:
What rates are you on? 50/40 when i had those, I used the same click setting for great results as you have.

Graham.

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

how much do different sets of springs cost?

Jay m A

iTrader: (2)

Not much at all, if you aready have a set and you wnat to go one step stiffer / softer.

For example my car came with 50/40 but I wanted 40/30. All I had to do was buy the 30 springs, the 40's moved to the front. I think the springs cost £120 from memory.

Paying for the labour to swap them over and set it back up was a lot more than the springs!

Jay m A

iTrader: (2)

double post

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

Cheers Jay

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

I've used the AST's on fully soft for road and its quite comfy.

F

Big Sky WRX

I'm looking into the AST competetion setup (triple adjustable), no powerstation here unfortunately so had a few questions: Are AST springs fully linear? I'm assumng they are offered in 10N jumps? How about lengths? Are the helper springs remaining the same w/ spring changes?

I'm thinking about 60/50, 60/60 or 70/60 as possibilities (currently running a 60/50 spring/ fixed perch strut combo). The struts are only single adj (rebound) so triple adjustable could prove interesting

911

You are correct in what you say!
My 3 ways have 60/50 springs and they are hard, but not too hard.

I think any harder and on the UK roads, the car would be a pain to drive.
On a true race track then no problem.

The range of damping available on the AST's will cope with much harder springs than 60/50.
At 60/50 most of my settings are 30% of the range from soft.

Graham

T5NYW

iTrader: (4)

I have a Type 20 with AST set up running 4F/2R on the road and 9F/7R And found it Brilliant on the Track, but have found even on the softest setting a bit hard on the Sh1te roads around our way

I have a question for you guys.

The Car was set on 4F/2RI and i was coming home from a Village along a quiet rough but dry "A" road(more like B or C). As it was quiet traveling between 5-8krpm in 5th the road was undulating. The Car started "bouncing" down the straights and unable to keep wheels contact on the road ended up slowing right up.

I assume that the "Spring" or is it "Rebound" is too hard as my old wallowing soft 02STiUk never did this on this stretch of road.

I understand all suspension alterations are a compromise.


Regards

Tony

911

What spring rates though?
Graham

T5NYW

iTrader: (4)

Graham,

Not really sure IIRC it's the std T25/T20 setup for a MY06 STi i'll have to ask Iain or Fuzz

Tony

911

I found the following worked well on road and track:

AST single adjustor on top of strut.

50/40 F/R spring rate (probably what you have)
Set damping from fully SOFT to 8 clicks front and 6 rear

60/50 rates (stiff)
Set damping from fully soft 11 front/8/9 rear.

There are other factors at play on rough/undulating UK roads with roll bar rates and even tyre pressures, but the stiffer the springs the more 'general' use you loose.

I can get away with 60/50 on my Sti v3 just.

The AST 3 - Way units are in another class and tuning takes on a new meaning (and difficulty). They are also 2 x the cost.

Hope this helps.

Graham

Jay m A

iTrader: (2)

Tony, that to me suggests your dampers are set too soft, Try 6/4 down the same road and see what happens.

BTW I have 40/30 on a classic RA, with 22mm adj front ARB on soft, 24mm rear ARB on medium, 6/4 for the dampers which IMO gives a great road setup.

I am about to do a couple of trackdays, so I have just set both ARBs to full hard, which gives noticably less body roll and the car feels a lot more planted. Not sure if I can live with the increased effective spring rate on my roads, but can't wait for the track where I will up the dampers to 11/8.

Robocop

I had the Type 25 AST setup fitted to my Spec C a couple of weeks ago. Spring rates are 40/30 and I'm currently am using 6/4.