G_Sleigh_STi

I think their is one massive problem with having the PPP fitted...

At TSL they take you out in your car on a quick run, they tell you where its boosting, where the power band is. Show you the different torque in different gears and explan how your car is handling and explain what will happen after wards.

Then when their tune ups are done like the Triple 3 they take you back out with the lap top plugged in. They then explain all the changes, the power band change, the extra torque low down and let you play about with it while telling you what they have done.

This way you see much more whats going on and exactly what has been done. If you drop ya car off, pick it back up and dont get much feed back i can imagine its hard instantly tell where the differences are?

Also did you get an uprated fuel pump with that? cause thats mega important.

billythekid

Fuel pump is not needed on WRX PPP really.

If you cant notice 20% lift then you are either driving off boost all the time or you have some kind of inner ear infection

ruminator

No fuel pump, thats for STi only as I understand it. Mines a bog standard WRX
WRXs' get backbox, intercooler hose and remap.
STi get in addition uprated fuel pump and changes center pipe AFAIK

............. have had a runny nose recently......... wonder if im coming down with a cold

MJW

AFAIK, the exisiting ECU is not remapped, it is changed altogether for one with a different map. PPP for the bugeyes between 2000 to mid 2002 used a piggyback chip which gave about 20bhp less power than post 2002 PPP.
I had my 02 wagon done at around 20k miles and must admit when I first picked it up it was not an earth shattering performance difference. But as time went on and the miles piled on it seemed to pick up a lot quicker. You should notice the turbo start to spool up about 500rpms earlier than standard and feel more of a shove through the gears. I particularly noticed it when on the motorway : if the traffic slowed to 60mph and I was in 5th I had to knock it into 4th to get enough power for a decent 'lunge', but with PPP you can keep it in 5th and still make decent progress.

billythekid

But this is a 2005 WRX, so he should feel the extra power.

p1doc

take it back to garage for ecu reset and test another wrx ppp of same age-may be hard to find 05 wagon and see how they compare there should be a big difference
martin

Mother Theresa

You should have had the centre cat removed with the PPP, this probably makes more difference than anything else; just stick your head underneath and if it's there then you've been done.

Just to echo, there is no way you would not notice if it had been done properly.

mightyyid

Agree with all. Centre pipe should be replaced (did they give you the old stuff back?) and if they got confused and used an unmapped ECU, that would certainly make the difference. As MJw said, the ECU is not remapped but replaced with a new one sent with the kit, and they send the old one back to Prodrive to be remapped to a standard mapping there.

I know on my boost gauge that prior to PPP being fitted, I was getting max 15psi. With PPP it shot up to 20psi - so regardless of the figures, I did see an increase in boost so knew the ECU had been changed.

You will feel the difference although I was and still am slightly disappointed in the amount of power. It;s good, just not great!

ruminator

Center Pipe and Cat have not been changed, just going to take some pics to make sure. Back in a bit

ruminator

Spoke to dealer,
"Center pipe definately changed. Looks the same because the cat heat shields are put back in place, but underneath them its a straight through pipe".

"ECU flashed because we had to re-program the keys to the ECU which we wouldn't have had to do if it hadn't been flashed"

Backbox and intercooler pipe are obvious

So.. it looks like it could be me!!

All will be revealed on RR, Monday I suppose. Looking for 210 or more!

A little knowledge..... yada yada......

MJW

MY02 PPP and MY05 PPP give the same power outputs.

wrxseeker

iTrader: (1)

According to Prodrive's website the WRX doesnt have any changes to the cat just the sports tailpipe. It is only the STI that has the high flow catalyst fitted.

http://www.prodrive.co.uk/uploads/03MY%20STi%20PPP.pdf

http://www.prodrive.co.uk/uploads/03MY%20WRX%20PPP.pdf

Anyone know for definate ??

Daz34

WRX has mid section and back box changed as part of PPP.
STI has downpipe and back box changed as part of PPP.

HTH - Darren

Butty

iTrader: (2)

Last year, I used Delta Dash to diagnose similar trouble on a PPP WRX.
As I was also running a PPP, it was pretty easy to see there was something amiss betweeen our cars.
His car was performing like a std WRX.
The car went off to Prodrive (to Mike Wood I believe?) and a new ECU fitted. The original ECU had an incorrect ref. code in it, despite the sticker on the ECU box being correct for his age of car.
Car is now back to what it should be.
Perhaps a call to Prodrive to explain your trouble may get a better response.
Sending a deltadash file of your cars performance may assist them. Is there anyone you know who can carry out the diagnosis?

Nick

GrollySTI

Be careful with expecting 210 at the wheels - I honestly don't thing it will be that high.
Personally I would expect 180-190 max, but just IMHO.

p1doc

go and test other 05 ppp and see if there is a difference if there is back to dealer plus you get to drive several other scoobies!
martin

ruminator

OK.. just back from System R and a rolling road test.

TIME FOR HUMBLE PIE !

Max power achieved 227bhp at wheels. Taking into account drivetrain loses I think it's safe to say its putting out 261 at the fly

http://homepages.tesco.net/hugeness/bhp1.jpg

Obviously its me !!

Ps, lads at System R were really helpful, went to trouble of pulling out carpets in footwell to examine ecu and then putting up on a ramp to check exhaust. Then attached boost gauge and took it down the road to measure boost pressure (I was driving) and all at no extra cost.... TOP

WRX_Rich

iTrader: (5)

had to take the car 30 miles down the road - what a joke, any one who has ever had a remap will tell you this

foget all this mucking about with rolling roads just ask for a test drive in a ppp wrx or a std wrx

you will notice the extra power it won't blow you in to the chair but you will notice it

as said my wrx took 18k before it started to loosen up a bit - probably would have took half the time if the garage had to take it for a "test run" after each visit

mg driver

227 at the wheels ,,,is that right ???

in all the power graph listings cars with 290 at fly are only getting 190 at the wheels (ish) indicating a massive loss through the drivetrain ,,are these accurate ???? surely you can't lose that much,,standard trim cars making 230 bhp are making 140 ish only ,,,can this be right ,how can so much power just be lost.???

Butty

iTrader: (2)

That's not the profile of a healthy car or more likely a well conducted run - there shouldn't be those big (or any) drops in BHP.
Did they actually state that the fly BHP was 261?
227 BHP is uncannily like the peak fly BHP of a std WRX.
For comparision, I got a 180 bhp at wheels for a PPP WRX at what is considered optimistic Power Engineering.

I still think you'rve something to chase.
Give Prodrive a ring - they won't bite you.

Nick

Bob Rawle

Definately an odd looking power curve as already mentioned, should be much smoother, almost as though it was logged as it was run through the gears. typical losses 24% btw so on 260 that would be 65 ish so 190 atw would be the mark.

what boost did it run on the road ?

My thoughts

bob

Anders_WR1

iTrader: (8)

If this was an official dealers statement on why 30 miles was put on your car, they should be investigated by rogue traders! The ECU remap alters the program code in the ECU to let it know that other modifications have been done, so it can run more boost, ignition advance etc.

Sounds like they used it to demo to other customers or something. Mine arrived with 6 miles on the clock and I thought that was high for a brand new car!

ruminator

Thats correct, the bloke explaining to me after the run said not to worry about the peaks as he logged it though the gears.

On the road it held at just short of 1.2 boost when flat out

261/124 *100= 210
261/100*76=198.36

what do you think about these figs ?
I was expecting 195-210 or less so I was a happy bunny

From thr RR figs the most it could be giving at the fly would be 280 which is what... 15 %(ish) above 261. Given a slightly "favourable" RR, the fact that it had just had new filter, oil and plugs, and a comfort zone in Prodrives figs for fuel atmos etc + optimax, would that result be unrealistic ?
Do Prodrive quote best or worst case as a target fig of 261?
Is it guaranteed 261 or above

ruminator

Also...........
If a Scooby is putting out 600 bhp then by standard calculations it could be losing roughly 144 bhp in the drivetrain
If a Scooby is putting out 200 bhp then by standard calculations it could be
losing roughly 48 bhp in the drivetrain

How can this be ??? its the same mechanicals.
Surely there is a fixed bhp drivetrain loss figure. Using a percentage doesn't seem correct. The drivetrain is constant (excluding mods), only the power/torque are variable. Using drivetrain loses as a fuction of power (J/s) cant be right ?.... Can it ???

FLAT ERIC

iTrader: (1)

First off this is what you get in the PPP for an 03 WRX :-



This is how the Prodrive graph looks:-



This is my graph @ 6k miles with high ambient temps in the summer :-



This is my graph @ 12k miles with low ambient temps in the winter :-



I need another run @ Power Engineering to see if nearly 30k miles has altered the graph further.The car felt better through the gears as the miles went on & the engine loosened up.

Mark