Tesco 99RON photographic proof
30 April 2005, 11:36 AM
#121
From what I understand (and please anybody that knows can correct me), but I would assume that changing fuel even with a self learn ECU (and I do not know how much the Scooby ECU will actually self learn - ie what parameters it can actually advance and to what levels, but I presume we are talking about ignition here) will not make significance changes to power and torque. But changing other parameters via a re-map would allow for increased boost targets and more advanced timing, which would obviously help torque and bhp.
On a standard car (or car mapped for a previous lesser fuel), I would presume sharper and better response would be the order of the day perhaps, until a remap could fully unleash any benefits.
Regards,
Shaun.
On a standard car (or car mapped for a previous lesser fuel), I would presume sharper and better response would be the order of the day perhaps, until a remap could fully unleash any benefits.
Regards,
Shaun.
30 April 2005, 11:36 AM
#122
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If you switch fuels, shouldn't you at least give it quite a few tankfuls or reset the ECU so that it can adjust (if at all) to the higher quality fuel?? Trying one or two tanks will make sod all difference IMHO.
Unless someone sticks a standard car on some rollers and does test with different fuels, then I'll be sceptical about performance increases that are "that" noticeable on something standard.
What I would be inclined to go along with is better fuel consumption if the higher quality fuel can burn more efficiently.
Stefan
Unless someone sticks a standard car on some rollers and does test with different fuels, then I'll be sceptical about performance increases that are "that" noticeable on something standard.
What I would be inclined to go along with is better fuel consumption if the higher quality fuel can burn more efficiently.
Stefan
30 April 2005, 11:46 AM
#124
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I couple of years ago I took my MY00 with PPP to Ireland. I took it over there with a tank of 97 RON SUL, but soon used that up and had to refill with 95 RON - a fuel which the car is advertised as being able to run on without damage, but with reduced performance.
The engine immediately became noisier, wheezy and asthmatic. Not good.
With that in mind, the step up from 97 to 99 should be very noticeable, provided the car is actually able to learn, adjust and benefit from the increase. It does require an ECU which is able to detect the difference and adapt, of course.
The engine immediately became noisier, wheezy and asthmatic. Not good.
With that in mind, the step up from 97 to 99 should be very noticeable, provided the car is actually able to learn, adjust and benefit from the increase. It does require an ECU which is able to detect the difference and adapt, of course.
30 April 2005, 01:12 PM
#125
Scooby Regular
Even me, with my sceptical view on most bull****, can tell the difference between 95RON NUL and 97RON SUL ....... the 97 is smoother, more responsive and a higher gear can be used for the same speed without any pinking, it also gives a better mpg (or that could be because my MAF is shagged?) ... but, and this is the crux of what I say, I am NOT so anally stupid to believe that my engine will explode into 1,000 pieces if I do what Subaru say I can do - and that is ""Use NUL all the time!""
This BBS is like Car Clubs held all over the country, in the corners of dark rural pubs - every 2nd Thursday in the month - where those with no other investment in life drink Real Ale and scare the **** out of each other about the fragility of their cars - because a friend, of a friends mums, Aunties, Uncles, Sisters, Mechanic has said that their engines will blow-up due to heat-soak through the tyres that reaches the MAF sensor due to the wrong oil change carried out 2 months previously
I love it here .......... the **** have no humour whatsoever because this subject, to them, is extremely serious; it's their whole life, I can't help myself but to smile at their convictions - their enthusiasm is excellent, but they are completely barmy!!
Someone said that 1,000's of these cars blow their engines ..... all I would say is that the Imprezas bought as UK cars, designed and built for the UK market, not modified to make them susceptable to damage, driven sensibly and serviced at the correct intervals are NOT about to blow their engines!
If you buy a dodgy imported car from Japan, modify it beyond its designed limits, drive it like a NovaBoy and spend more money on Speed Trap Detectors than you do on proper servicing, then you are going to get a very unreliable car!!
I have noticed, for the first time, some nice new scare phrase thrown into the **** Mix ............ 'I/C Heatsoak' ... I assume this means the Intercooler Gets Hot?? Can someone explain what the hell this means? Is it that the air will not be cooled as much? and why would this new found fault blow your engine?
To my mind, there are 4 Groups of people who frequent SN:-
1. The absolutely, totally obsessed, petrol-heads who dream up all kinds of problems 'they just need to fix' and develop freakish routines to do things (like the utter bollox of the NON start-up after an oil change!) - they can talk for hours on Octane Ratings and Petrol Refineries (and how their 'mate' works on an Oil Tanker and tells them what quality of crude is delivered where, so THEY can get the tip-off to better petrol once refined!)
2. The mechanically and Electrically uninformed (Bankers, IT bods, Estate Agents, etc.) who wouldn't know a spanner from a spark plug ......... these people read some of the crap and get scared witless, they are led down the garden path by those in 1. above - they are also crapping themselves when they read Car-Jacking threads and sell their cars because they believe that they are in mortal danger.
3. This group is my favourite, they are the 'normal' bods who look at the information available, extract the crap, and act upon whats left. They are the ones who can talk about cars, but also have an interest in football, women, fishing - and you can have a laugh with them without them crying to mummy - you know who you are
4. Then theres me
Pete
This BBS is like Car Clubs held all over the country, in the corners of dark rural pubs - every 2nd Thursday in the month - where those with no other investment in life drink Real Ale and scare the **** out of each other about the fragility of their cars - because a friend, of a friends mums, Aunties, Uncles, Sisters, Mechanic has said that their engines will blow-up due to heat-soak through the tyres that reaches the MAF sensor due to the wrong oil change carried out 2 months previously
I love it here .......... the **** have no humour whatsoever because this subject, to them, is extremely serious; it's their whole life, I can't help myself but to smile at their convictions - their enthusiasm is excellent, but they are completely barmy!!
Someone said that 1,000's of these cars blow their engines ..... all I would say is that the Imprezas bought as UK cars, designed and built for the UK market, not modified to make them susceptable to damage, driven sensibly and serviced at the correct intervals are NOT about to blow their engines!
If you buy a dodgy imported car from Japan, modify it beyond its designed limits, drive it like a NovaBoy and spend more money on Speed Trap Detectors than you do on proper servicing, then you are going to get a very unreliable car!!
I have noticed, for the first time, some nice new scare phrase thrown into the **** Mix ............ 'I/C Heatsoak' ... I assume this means the Intercooler Gets Hot?? Can someone explain what the hell this means? Is it that the air will not be cooled as much? and why would this new found fault blow your engine?
To my mind, there are 4 Groups of people who frequent SN:-
1. The absolutely, totally obsessed, petrol-heads who dream up all kinds of problems 'they just need to fix' and develop freakish routines to do things (like the utter bollox of the NON start-up after an oil change!) - they can talk for hours on Octane Ratings and Petrol Refineries (and how their 'mate' works on an Oil Tanker and tells them what quality of crude is delivered where, so THEY can get the tip-off to better petrol once refined!)
2. The mechanically and Electrically uninformed (Bankers, IT bods, Estate Agents, etc.) who wouldn't know a spanner from a spark plug ......... these people read some of the crap and get scared witless, they are led down the garden path by those in 1. above - they are also crapping themselves when they read Car-Jacking threads and sell their cars because they believe that they are in mortal danger.
3. This group is my favourite, they are the 'normal' bods who look at the information available, extract the crap, and act upon whats left. They are the ones who can talk about cars, but also have an interest in football, women, fishing - and you can have a laugh with them without them crying to mummy - you know who you are
4. Then theres me
Pete
Last edited by pslewis; 30 April 2005 at 01:15 PM.
30 April 2005, 01:47 PM
#127
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Originally Posted by pslewis
Even me, with my sceptical view on most bull****, can tell the difference between 95RON NUL and 97RON SUL ....... the 97 is smoother, more responsive and a higher gear can be used for the same speed without any pinking, it also gives a better mpg (or that could be because my MAF is shagged?) ... but, and this is the crux of what I say, I am NOT so anally stupid to believe that my engine will explode into 1,000 pieces if I do what Subaru say I can do - and that is ""Use NUL all the time!""
This BBS is like Car Clubs held all over the country, in the corners of dark rural pubs - every 2nd Thursday in the month - where those with no other investment in life drink Real Ale and scare the **** out of each other about the fragility of their cars - because a friend, of a friends mums, Aunties, Uncles, Sisters, Mechanic has said that their engines will blow-up due to heat-soak through the tyres that reaches the MAF sensor due to the wrong oil change carried out 2 months previously
I love it here .......... the **** have no humour whatsoever because this subject, to them, is extremely serious; it's their whole life, I can't help myself but to smile at their convictions - their enthusiasm is excellent, but they are completely barmy!!
Someone said that 1,000's of these cars blow their engines ..... all I would say is that the Imprezas bought as UK cars, designed and built for the UK market, not modified to make them susceptable to damage, driven sensibly and serviced at the correct intervals are NOT about to blow their engines!
If you buy a dodgy imported car from Japan, modify it beyond its designed limits, drive it like a NovaBoy and spend more money on Speed Trap Detectors than you do on proper servicing, then you are going to get a very unreliable car!!
I have noticed, for the first time, some nice new scare phrase thrown into the **** Mix ............ 'I/C Heatsoak' ... I assume this means the Intercooler Gets Hot?? Can someone explain what the hell this means? Is it that the air will not be cooled as much? and why would this new found fault blow your engine?
To my mind, there are 4 Groups of people who frequent SN:-
1. The absolutely, totally obsessed, petrol-heads who dream up all kinds of problems 'they just need to fix' and develop freakish routines to do things (like the utter bollox of the NON start-up after an oil change!) - they can talk for hours on Octane Ratings and Petrol Refineries (and how their 'mate' works on an Oil Tanker and tells them what quality of crude is delivered where, so THEY can get the tip-off to better petrol once refined!)
2. The mechanically and Electrically uninformed (Bankers, IT bods, Estate Agents, etc.) who wouldn't know a spanner from a spark plug ......... these people read some of the crap and get scared witless, they are led down the garden path by those in 1. above - they are also crapping themselves when they read Car-Jacking threads and sell their cars because they believe that they are in mortal danger.
3. This group is my favourite, they are the 'normal' bods who look at the information available, extract the crap, and act upon whats left. They are the ones who can talk about cars, but also have an interest in football, women, fishing - and you can have a laugh with them without them crying to mummy - you know who you are
4. Then theres me
Pete
This BBS is like Car Clubs held all over the country, in the corners of dark rural pubs - every 2nd Thursday in the month - where those with no other investment in life drink Real Ale and scare the **** out of each other about the fragility of their cars - because a friend, of a friends mums, Aunties, Uncles, Sisters, Mechanic has said that their engines will blow-up due to heat-soak through the tyres that reaches the MAF sensor due to the wrong oil change carried out 2 months previously
I love it here .......... the **** have no humour whatsoever because this subject, to them, is extremely serious; it's their whole life, I can't help myself but to smile at their convictions - their enthusiasm is excellent, but they are completely barmy!!
Someone said that 1,000's of these cars blow their engines ..... all I would say is that the Imprezas bought as UK cars, designed and built for the UK market, not modified to make them susceptable to damage, driven sensibly and serviced at the correct intervals are NOT about to blow their engines!
If you buy a dodgy imported car from Japan, modify it beyond its designed limits, drive it like a NovaBoy and spend more money on Speed Trap Detectors than you do on proper servicing, then you are going to get a very unreliable car!!
I have noticed, for the first time, some nice new scare phrase thrown into the **** Mix ............ 'I/C Heatsoak' ... I assume this means the Intercooler Gets Hot?? Can someone explain what the hell this means? Is it that the air will not be cooled as much? and why would this new found fault blow your engine?
To my mind, there are 4 Groups of people who frequent SN:-
1. The absolutely, totally obsessed, petrol-heads who dream up all kinds of problems 'they just need to fix' and develop freakish routines to do things (like the utter bollox of the NON start-up after an oil change!) - they can talk for hours on Octane Ratings and Petrol Refineries (and how their 'mate' works on an Oil Tanker and tells them what quality of crude is delivered where, so THEY can get the tip-off to better petrol once refined!)
2. The mechanically and Electrically uninformed (Bankers, IT bods, Estate Agents, etc.) who wouldn't know a spanner from a spark plug ......... these people read some of the crap and get scared witless, they are led down the garden path by those in 1. above - they are also crapping themselves when they read Car-Jacking threads and sell their cars because they believe that they are in mortal danger.
3. This group is my favourite, they are the 'normal' bods who look at the information available, extract the crap, and act upon whats left. They are the ones who can talk about cars, but also have an interest in football, women, fishing - and you can have a laugh with them without them crying to mummy - you know who you are
4. Then theres me
Pete
30 April 2005, 02:09 PM
#128
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With nearly 11,000 posts, the people who are caught up in this so called "techno-fraud" or whatever PS Lewis calls it, are certainly not the only ones who need to get a life.
30 April 2005, 02:10 PM
#129
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so nobody has tested this stuff yet then??
i would rather hear from sumbody respectable saying it was better then optimax, then a few people saying it made there cars better
we heard stories like that when ultimate came out, and thats complete ****e stuff
i would rather hear from sumbody respectable saying it was better then optimax, then a few people saying it made there cars better
we heard stories like that when ultimate came out, and thats complete ****e stuff
30 April 2005, 02:28 PM
#130
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I agree with most of what PS Lewis is saying and I fit into 3 (except the fishing)...
I heard that if you put 95 ron in a Scooby your parents are slaughtered by little pixies in wellington boots called Dave and your car explodes...
It is fantastic to read the spoddy geeky weirdo's rattle on - its part of the fun on SN god love 'em...
I owned a 99 UK unmodded (except for an exhaust) Scoob, filled it with whatever was cheapest - usually ASDA or morrisons 95 ron - did 45000 miles in 2 years, serviced it regularly and never ever ever was it off the road... I put Optimax in from time to time and never noticed a performance difference... So Tesco can put 99.999999 ron fuel on their forecourts but my new WRX will be drinking 95 and will continue to out accelerate many cars up to the appropriate speed limits...Merrrrrr
I heard that if you put 95 ron in a Scooby your parents are slaughtered by little pixies in wellington boots called Dave and your car explodes...
It is fantastic to read the spoddy geeky weirdo's rattle on - its part of the fun on SN god love 'em...
I owned a 99 UK unmodded (except for an exhaust) Scoob, filled it with whatever was cheapest - usually ASDA or morrisons 95 ron - did 45000 miles in 2 years, serviced it regularly and never ever ever was it off the road... I put Optimax in from time to time and never noticed a performance difference... So Tesco can put 99.999999 ron fuel on their forecourts but my new WRX will be drinking 95 and will continue to out accelerate many cars up to the appropriate speed limits...Merrrrrr
30 April 2005, 02:33 PM
#132
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Originally Posted by StickyMicky
so nobody has tested this stuff yet then??
i would rather hear from sumbody respectable saying it was better then optimax, then a few people saying it made there cars better
we heard stories like that when ultimate came out, and thats complete ****e stuff
i would rather hear from sumbody respectable saying it was better then optimax, then a few people saying it made there cars better
we heard stories like that when ultimate came out, and thats complete ****e stuff
30 April 2005, 02:34 PM
#133
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Abdabz: Suit yourself, but feeding your scooby on 95 RON is like feeding yourself on junk food. You might seem perfectly OK for ages, but you'll never be as healthy as someone who eats a better diet. You might even live just as long, but probably won't. Even if you do eat the occasional vegatable, it won't make you feel instantly better, so there's no point eating them at all - right?
Go on, treat yourself to a burger - you'll save a few pence over a healthy dinner, and it won't kill you...
Go on, treat yourself to a burger - you'll save a few pence over a healthy dinner, and it won't kill you...
30 April 2005, 02:38 PM
#134
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Originally Posted by Abdabz
I agree with most of what PS Lewis is saying and I fit into 3 (except the fishing)...
I heard that if you put 95 ron in a Scooby your parents are slaughtered by little pixies in wellington boots called Dave and your car explodes...
It is fantastic to read the spoddy geeky weirdo's rattle on - its part of the fun on SN god love 'em...
I owned a 99 UK unmodded (except for an exhaust) Scoob, filled it with whatever was cheapest - usually ASDA or morrisons 95 ron - did 45000 miles in 2 years, serviced it regularly and never ever ever was it off the road... I put Optimax in from time to time and never noticed a performance difference... So Tesco can put 99.999999 ron fuel on their forecourts but my new WRX will be drinking 95 and will continue to out accelerate many cars up to the appropriate speed limits...Merrrrrr
I heard that if you put 95 ron in a Scooby your parents are slaughtered by little pixies in wellington boots called Dave and your car explodes...
It is fantastic to read the spoddy geeky weirdo's rattle on - its part of the fun on SN god love 'em...
I owned a 99 UK unmodded (except for an exhaust) Scoob, filled it with whatever was cheapest - usually ASDA or morrisons 95 ron - did 45000 miles in 2 years, serviced it regularly and never ever ever was it off the road... I put Optimax in from time to time and never noticed a performance difference... So Tesco can put 99.999999 ron fuel on their forecourts but my new WRX will be drinking 95 and will continue to out accelerate many cars up to the appropriate speed limits...Merrrrrr
Sorry, but if you agree with most of what PSL says, you're not category 3, you fit into his category, selected 'members' only, you and him at the last count.
You have the privelage of doing whatever you like with your own car, 'cos it'll be you footing the bill should it peg out. Don't see the point in criticising people who try to take a more preventative approach though.
Even put a smiley on, 'cos that seems to prove you're normal on here these days......
30 April 2005, 03:25 PM
#135
Scooby Regular
Thats ME NORMAL!!!!
Yes, I just had to see if you had learned your lesson and stopped spouting bollox - but, no, its bloody HeatSink I/C Effects now .......... god give us all strength
Heatsink effects
another Real Ale, B.O. Smelling, induced myth from the 'Billy-No-Mate-Club'!!! PMSL!!!! Pete
30 April 2005, 03:43 PM
#136
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Originally Posted by pslewis
Thats ME NORMAL!!!!
Yes, I just had to see if you had learned your lesson and stopped spouting bollox - but, no, its bloody HeatSink I/C Effects now .......... god give us all strength
Heatsink effects
another Real Ale, B.O. Smelling, induced myth from the 'Billy-No-Mate-Club'!!! PMSL!!!! Pete
Put me back on the list Pete, it was more fun when people were annoying you by telling you what I was saying.
30 April 2005, 03:52 PM
#140
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Micared:- you have a serious problem ............ I just question ALL the spotty weirdo geeks, like yourself - you simply are not as special to me as I seem to be to you 
........ you, however have homed into one person, ME!
Can you not see that you are unhinged??
Back to the Petrol ...... there are some on here (see Micared, for an example of the 'type') who will not trust petrol, without TinyTim of TinyTim Motors, Cleethorpes going out with his Knocklink, his Cocklink, his farting machine, his flashing to the music lights, his laptop, his MAF SEnsor measuring device, his Intercooler Heatsink Analyser, his special cut-off device and then pronouncing that its safe (cos he is the REAL expert see - NOT Subaru, they don't know nowt!!)
Stuff it in the tank if you want and rely on 'proper' driving to see if it suits ..... not some lighting up machine
Pete
you have a serious problem ............ I just question ALL the spotty weirdo geeks, like yourself - you simply are not as special to me as I seem to be to you ........ you, however have homed into one person, ME!Can you not see that you are unhinged??
Back to the Petrol ...... there are some on here (see Micared, for an example of the 'type') who will not trust petrol, without TinyTim of TinyTim Motors, Cleethorpes going out with his Knocklink, his Cocklink, his farting machine, his flashing to the music lights, his laptop, his MAF SEnsor measuring device, his Intercooler Heatsink Analyser, his special cut-off device and then pronouncing that its safe (cos he is the REAL expert see - NOT Subaru, they don't know nowt!!)
Stuff it in the tank if you want and rely on 'proper' driving to see if it suits ..... not some lighting up machine
Pete
Last edited by pslewis; 30 April 2005 at 03:55 PM.
30 April 2005, 03:53 PM
#141
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Originally Posted by micared
Btw, didn't realise you were 'teaching me a lesson', see your grammar's still as bad as ever!
She'll be turning in her grave to hear that from such a weirdo geek
Pete
30 April 2005, 03:57 PM
#142
Scooby Regular
Anyway, how much is the CockLink Machine and how easy is it to fit??
I assume it just does what the 'supplied with the car' Knock Sensor does??
Only it converts the signal to nice pretty lights so the dash looks ever-so-special for your relatives to see??
Pete
I assume it just does what the 'supplied with the car' Knock Sensor does??
Only it converts the signal to nice pretty lights so the dash looks ever-so-special for your relatives to see??
Pete
30 April 2005, 04:32 PM
#146
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Originally Posted by GC8
Phase 2 ECUs learn to some degree Pete; earlier ones (probably the majority) only retard.
Simon
Simon
30 April 2005, 04:39 PM
#147
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Originally Posted by GC8
Phase 2 ECUs learn to some degree Pete; earlier ones (probably the majority) only retard.
Simon
Simon
Interesting ..... my MY00 learns and adjusts
Would the earlier ECUs once reset and fed with only SUL of, say 99 RON, stay at the required advance?
Whats all this re-map stuff then?
Pete
30 April 2005, 04:58 PM
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The early classics if used on NUL will retard and stay retarded if any detonation is detected by the knock sensor and will only advance when reset.
If ~99 RON fuel is used after a reset the ignition will stay 'further' advanced as the higher octane fuel will reduce the knock threshold therefore less ignition will be 'removed' by the ECU. As already stated the ECU can only advance and retard the Ignition so far
If the ECU is mapped for the specific fuel the maps (Fuel/Ignition/Boost) can be optimised thus resulting in more Hp/Torque without the loss of engine safety.
Knocklinks are ~ £150 including sensor & harness
Cheers
If ~99 RON fuel is used after a reset the ignition will stay 'further' advanced as the higher octane fuel will reduce the knock threshold therefore less ignition will be 'removed' by the ECU. As already stated the ECU can only advance and retard the Ignition so far
Whats all this re-map stuff then?
without the loss of engine safety.Knocklinks are ~ £150 including sensor & harness
Cheers
30 April 2005, 05:01 PM
#150
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Originally Posted by pslewis
OK, point taken but it puzzles me this ............ you mean the ECU cannot 'Advance' once its retarded itself - so, once NUL has been used thats it until a reset?
Interesting ..... my MY00 learns and adjusts
Would the earlier ECUs once reset and fed with only SUL of, say 99 RON, stay at the required advance?
Whats all this re-map stuff then?
Pete
Interesting ..... my MY00 learns and adjusts
Would the earlier ECUs once reset and fed with only SUL of, say 99 RON, stay at the required advance?
Whats all this re-map stuff then?
Pete
A 're-map' deals with so much more than ignition advance. You have a three dimensional map which controls fueling; boost pressure and ignition advance, altered to suit fuel quality, engine speed, temperature etc.