M3 Vs GTR34 V-Spec
14 April 2004, 12:02 AM
#271
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 81
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Standard...no.
With the Phoenix Power Gear Set yes. So baaaaaaaaa!
Stop blowing this out of proportion like you are with THIS thread!
Now get my back in your Cav :P
With the Phoenix Power Gear Set yes. So baaaaaaaaa!
Stop blowing this out of proportion like you are with THIS thread!
Now get my back in your Cav :P
Originally Posted by Cosworth427
WRX 280 did. He owns a modified one now, but back in the day there was a huge augmentive thread about it, he completely had it in his head that a standard MR-2 Turbo can do over 170 MPH. He used some web applet software as "proof".
14 April 2004, 04:14 PM
#274
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 573
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by WRX_280
Standard...no.
With the Phoenix Power Gear Set yes. So baaaaaaaaa!
Stop blowing this out of proportion like you are with THIS thread!
With the Phoenix Power Gear Set yes. So baaaaaaaaa!
Stop blowing this out of proportion like you are with THIS thread!
This isn't blowing things out of all proportion, its just you can't take back what you have dished out. You were wrong about the MR2 doing 170 MPH then and you are wrong now.
14 April 2004, 11:56 PM
#278
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 81
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That applet i pointed to WASN'T for the stock gearing...it was SPL gearing. The other links posted were for stock gearing...unfortunately you are wrong AGAIN CavBoy 
Originally Posted by Cosworth427
Funny that you used the standard gear ratios of the MR2 on the java applet that you used as "proof".
This isn't blowing things out of all proportion, its just you can't take back what you have dished out. You were wrong about the MR2 doing 170 MPH then and you are wrong now.
This isn't blowing things out of all proportion, its just you can't take back what you have dished out. You were wrong about the MR2 doing 170 MPH then and you are wrong now.
15 April 2004, 11:08 AM
#280
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 573
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by WRX_280
That applet i pointed to WASN'T for the stock gearing...it was SPL gearing. The other links posted were for stock gearing...unfortunately you are wrong AGAIN CavBoy
Ok...
15 April 2004, 11:11 AM
#281
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 573
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by CavT
Yeah, potter around in a straight 6 engined car doing 30mph in 5th..... theres someone who knows how to drive a car! All because he can't be arsed to change gear! Whatever
You don't get that problem in an M3.
15 April 2004, 11:43 AM
#283
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Cosworth427
By your logic, a "standard" MR2 can reach 170 MPH because some applet with "SPL" gearing says it could.
Ok...
Ok...
Its ok for you to point out links, but not others.
Be consistent or stick your head, back up your bum
15 April 2004, 12:46 PM
#284
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 573
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by WRX280
Oh oh oh...this is coming from someone who believes that a Jspec Supra fuel pump can't support anything over 280BHP because it says so on some website in Australia.
Its ok for you to point out links, but not others.
Be consistent or stick your head, back up your bum
Its ok for you to point out links, but not others.
Be consistent or stick your head, back up your bum
I KNOW you knew this, so let me ask you a simple question...
Why are you so desperate to get one over me by twisting the truth??
15 April 2004, 01:01 PM
#285
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Cosworth427
I was the only one who actually said that the J-spec fuel pump can support over 280 HP, idiot.
... i just reverese psycholog'd you. Damn you get defensive
Originally Posted by Cosworth427
Why are you so desperate to get one over me by twisting the truth??
All am trying to say to you is...why can you point to a website and expect everyone to believe it and as soon as someone else points to a website its rubbished? Are your links special?
You my friend are nothing but a backdoor specialist
15 April 2004, 01:11 PM
#286
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 573
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by WRX280
All am trying to say to you is...why can you point to a website and expect everyone to believe it and as soon as someone else points to a website its rubbished? Are your links special?
You my friend are nothing but a backdoor specialist
I dismiss links to overpriced online-shops (tdi-plc.com) as proof. They sell aftermarket fuel pumps, soo of course they will show you a graph to "prove" a standard pump isn't up for the job.
15 April 2004, 06:22 PM
#287
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Earth
Posts: 879
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I guess you really would need to shift down 2 or 3 gears ...
You don't get that problem in an M3.
You don't get that problem in an M3.
, the M3 still has an internal combustion engine, which means power is going to be broadly a function of revs - true for the portion of the rev range that has a flat torque curve - the M3 will ultimately go quicker if you drop down cogs, unless BMW have somehow changed the rules that govern petrol engines... So if ya wanna go fast, in an M3 or anything with a reciprocating piston ICE then you should be changing down gears.Truth be known, the only vehicles in which you truly do not have to change down gears are electric vehicles, as the power is (to all practical purposes) constant and the torque is proportional to 1/revs.
As Cosworth427 appears to be mandating gear change requirement is the be all and end all of performance cars, the only logical conclusions is that we would make the best time if we all drive milk floats
I see I have no takers for my challenge - shame - I would have enjoyed watching an M3 get thoroughly toasted by a Skyline on a sprint course
16 April 2004, 03:57 AM
#288
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 209
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
this
or this
be honest 1= m3 2= skyline
which would you choose, forget about running cost's, massaging seat's and sat nav, pick your beast ? 1 or 2 ?
or this
be honest 1= m3 2= skyline
which would you choose, forget about running cost's, massaging seat's and sat nav, pick your beast ? 1 or 2 ?
Last edited by IwantAscoob; 16 April 2004 at 04:01 AM.
16 April 2004, 05:05 AM
#291
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 209
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
await all the toffs now saying the m3, cos they need a daily driver, im sorry but when you have a passion for cars, forget daily driver and it's the best all rounder etc, what a load of ****.
in this case we could have a totally non all rounder r34 355 360 and any other so called trouble car, and we could buy a £3k ford focus to do all the reliable things?, and then we could enjoy the unreliable beast ?. i think here we are drawing a line between car fans and car enthusiasts.
and im affraid there is a difference.
in this case we could have a totally non all rounder r34 355 360 and any other so called trouble car, and we could buy a £3k ford focus to do all the reliable things?, and then we could enjoy the unreliable beast ?. i think here we are drawing a line between car fans and car enthusiasts.
and im affraid there is a difference.
16 April 2004, 10:32 AM
#293
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 573
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Sprint Chief
As far as I know , the M3 still has an internal combustion engine, which means power is going to be broadly a function of revs - true for the portion of the rev range that has a flat torque curve - the M3 will ultimately go quicker if you drop down cogs, unless BMW have somehow changed the rules that govern petrol engines... So if ya wanna go fast, in an M3 or anything with a reciprocating piston ICE then you should be changing down gears.
, the M3 still has an internal combustion engine, which means power is going to be broadly a function of revs - true for the portion of the rev range that has a flat torque curve - the M3 will ultimately go quicker if you drop down cogs, unless BMW have somehow changed the rules that govern petrol engines... So if ya wanna go fast, in an M3 or anything with a reciprocating piston ICE then you should be changing down gears.Stop recyling clap trap that has already been dealt with earlier in this thread. An overweight turbocharged 2 litre Cavalier, and an even more overweight 2.6 litre turbo charged Skyline needs more downshifting for acceptable acceleration. And no, we're not talking about 1/4 mile or racing from the lights, so quit whoring out what you can do on the 1/4, because it means jack sch1t on the road.
The superior and responsive powerband of a 3.2 litre natural aspirated car means I won't have to shift to low gears, and use sky high RPMs just to climb a hill at a reasonable pace or at full throttle.
This is why big car makers use big natural aspirated engines. You want enough power at all revs. Flexibility makes a better driver's car, and a daily usable car. Every competent car builder knows this, it's a shame a bunch of JDM veilside body kit licking fanboys don't.
Truth be known, the only vehicles in which you truly do not have to change down gears are electric vehicles, as the power is (to all practical purposes) constant and the torque is proportional to 1/revs.
As Cosworth427 appears to be mandating gear change requirement is the be all and end all of performance cars, the only logical conclusions is that we would make the best time if we all drive milk floats
I see I have no takers for my challenge - shame - I would have enjoyed watching an M3 get thoroughly toasted by a Skyline on a sprint course
What does the quicker car on a drag strip prove as a better road car?
Idiot.
16 April 2004, 10:34 AM
#294
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 573
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by IwantAscoob
1 question for cosworth !, choice between a bmw m3 csl, and a ferrari 355 spider, which would you pick ?.
16 April 2004, 03:32 PM
#297
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Earth
Posts: 879
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Oh dear toys out of the pram and all over the floor! Seems like the sense of humour bypass operation was a glorious success then I would explain to you what smilies mean but it is very clear you are set in your ways and not likely to learn!
Oh joy, meaningless subjective words like "acceptable acceleration" that you conveniently don't have to quantify. On the road I plan EVERY acceleration event in advance (like any other IAM driver) so I ALWAYS have plenty of time to downshift - because I am an enthusiast, that is fine. When I get bored of driving, I'll stop downshifting I guess should I get an M3 then?
However, I will (try) to educate you on one thing: a sprint meeting is NOT a 1/4 mile drag race, they are two completely different things. It is a rounded test of a cars performance in a range of different situations coupled to the skill of the driver.
Oh dear, I wasn't talking about a drag strip... but this line was followed by:
Touché! We did go on a long mental trip to find this one. Shame it was typed immediately after a sentence you wrote that showed significant ignorance
Just checked and both of last years events were won by turbocharged cars! One was a Dax Rush Hayabusa Turbo, be interesting to see how that compares to a N/A radical or XTR2 - I think it would give both of them a good run for their money in pretty much any situation... Even pipped an N/A Jedi
Ignoring this Cosworth427, if anyone with an M3 wants a go, just let me know. Trouble is they wind up in the same class as TVRs, we get a lot of them, and I don't think that will be a close competition either
I would explain to you what smilies mean but it is very clear you are set in your ways and not likely to learn!
Skyline needs more downshifting for acceptable acceleration
should I get an M3 then? However, I will (try) to educate you on one thing: a sprint meeting is NOT a 1/4 mile drag race, they are two completely different things. It is a rounded test of a cars performance in a range of different situations coupled to the skill of the driver.
What does the quicker car on a drag strip prove as a better road car?
Idiot.
Just checked and both of last years events were won by turbocharged cars! One was a Dax Rush Hayabusa Turbo, be interesting to see how that compares to a N/A radical or XTR2 - I think it would give both of them a good run for their money in pretty much any situation... Even pipped an N/A Jedi
Ignoring this Cosworth427, if anyone with an M3 wants a go, just let me know. Trouble is they wind up in the same class as TVRs, we get a lot of them, and I don't think that will be a close competition either
16 April 2004, 04:37 PM
#298
Scooby Regular
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Twitching with a camera
Posts: 22,177
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Cosworth427 -
I have to ask, purely out of interest on the two sides of this argument, what experience you actually have with cars?
I mean you obviously know what you're talking about in technical terms, and you repeatedly refer to experience of tuning and the like, but I just want to get an idea of what you've achieved, or worked with / on to base these arguments upon.
If you look at Simon DB, he's an open book - we can see what he's done, what experience he has etc. But you're more of a mystery... You can PM me if you don't want everyone to know.
I have to ask, purely out of interest on the two sides of this argument, what experience you actually have with cars?
I mean you obviously know what you're talking about in technical terms, and you repeatedly refer to experience of tuning and the like, but I just want to get an idea of what you've achieved, or worked with / on to base these arguments upon.
If you look at Simon DB, he's an open book - we can see what he's done, what experience he has etc. But you're more of a mystery... You can PM me if you don't want everyone to know.
21 April 2004, 05:32 PM
#299
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ignoring this Cosworth427, if anyone with an M3 wants a go, just let me know. Trouble is they wind up in the same class as TVRs, we get a lot of them, and I don't think that will be a close competition either
21 April 2004, 08:15 PM
#300
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Earth
Posts: 879
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
No, I never said that! What I said was that I would expect the TVRs to be significantly faster than the M3. I also would expect this particular Skyline to be significantly faster than a standard M3. I did not make a comparison between the TVR and the Skyline. However, while you ask
At the last sprint meeting, the TVRs and Skyline were fairly close. Remember this Skyline is pushing out more power than standard, but the TVRs were in stock form, so the comparison isn't quite "apples to apples" - but according to Cosworth427 it is only fair to give these turboheads a power advantage . In wet conditions, the Skyline was quicker by a substantial margin (better able to use the power through the four wheel drive), in the dry it was a little quicker.
An interesting observation is that at the sprint meetings we get a range of drivers - from novices to very skilled and experienced racing drivers - and the TVRs end up with a very big spread of times, because whilst they are fast you need to be a good driver to get the best out of them. Hot hatches, jap rally weapons etc. tend to have a smaller spread as they are "easier" to drive quickly.
At the last sprint meeting, the TVRs and Skyline were fairly close. Remember this Skyline is pushing out more power than standard, but the TVRs were in stock form, so the comparison isn't quite "apples to apples" - but according to Cosworth427 it is only fair to give these turboheads a power advantage
. In wet conditions, the Skyline was quicker by a substantial margin (better able to use the power through the four wheel drive), in the dry it was a little quicker.An interesting observation is that at the sprint meetings we get a range of drivers - from novices to very skilled and experienced racing drivers - and the TVRs end up with a very big spread of times, because whilst they are fast you need to be a good driver to get the best out of them. Hot hatches, jap rally weapons etc. tend to have a smaller spread as they are "easier" to drive quickly.
