paulr

Thanks for some great replies.
So it seems amps and speakers are still good even though they are say,10 years old.CD technology,maybe only 5 years old.

96,sorry,never been a B/O fan.

Tel,how would a new £100 amp compare to a 15 year old Audiolab 8000A bought s/h for £100?

Anyone owned a Pioneer 717?

paulr

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[Edited by paulr - 12/9/2003 8:37:35 PM]

corradoboy

The Audiolab would kick butt. A few years ago a friend of mine finally succumbed to my influence after years of buying cheap hifi, only to be disappointed and jumping back on the upgrade bandwagon within months. I took him and his new £170 Pioneer amp and some £200 Gale 4's (5 star reviews in What Hifi ) to our local specialist dealer. After half an hour or so he was convinced that the Pioneer was going back and in its place was a 5 year old secondhand Audiolab 8000A, and a pair of Mission floorstanders. The Gales were blown away (groan) by a pair of £130 Mission bookshelfs on £70 stands. So much for the 5 stars, nothing to do with Gale being owned by Julian Richer, What Hifis largest advertiser

I wouldn't be so sure that any CD player over 5 years old isn't upto the job. I have a Cyrus dad7. A £900 machine with a superb sound even today, and yes I have compared it (to my mates fairly new Arcam). This thing is made from die-cast magnesium to minimise vibration and isolate it from radio frequency interference. It has 9 independent internal power supplies which automatically switch on/off to reduce electrical interference. A great piece of kit.

[Edited by corradoboy - 12/9/2003 7:52:49 PM]

TelBoy

Agree with Corradoboy - an 8000A takes some beating. If you have the funds, and can find one, an 8000S even better.

Mission speakers are excellent. I had a pair of 751s for a while, and also 753s before turning to my local company, Ruark. I don't remember Mission doing any "dud" ones, but 751s were the speaker five years ago, and rightly so.

For a CD player, get a Marantz CD-63SE, or the KI version if you can afford it and can find one.

I'd personally underwrite that combination. Don't skimp on interconnects, speaker stands or speaker cable, and you'll have a great sounding system.

Cosworth427

lol, Audiolab 8000As, Mission 753's, Marantz CD63s! They bring back memories. Always winning top awards from What Hi Fi, but not much else in other magazines.

I got an old Meridian 200 transport and 203 DAC unit, Arcam Alpha 9 Pre amp and Power amp combo. Pretty good, but rarely ever listen to the system anymore.

hades

I agree the playback will be extremely close to the source you recorded, but it won't be any better. So for your statement to be true, you'd need a source that will "give *any* CD player a very good run for its money". Even with a Nakamichi, normal pre-recorded cassettes are a bit of a waste of space IMHO.

Having said that, I'll second your choice of your local speaker company. I have worked my way up through the Ruark range over the years, now running the (late model silver wired) Equinoxes, which I do like lots. Suspect I'd need an even bigger house to go to Solstice or Excalibur.

civictyper

That'll be anything that plays a bit of vinyl then

WRT the hi-fi I'd also have a look out for an 8000A. Quality stuff and still good now as they were pretty neutral. Massively upgradeable too as you can add a fair few monoblocs to it.

Alternatively you could go for a Naim Nait 3 for arround £200 or so. Different in presentation but cracking considering the modest 30w output. If you could pick up a CD3 for a good price too then you'd be in business.

tiggers

civictyper,

Naim gear - now you're talking.

As for vinyl - you do know you're right don't you? Most people don't believe it until they hear vinyl on a proper system - then they start wishing they hadn't taken all their records to the seconhand shop ten years ago -

tiggers.

civictyper

Of course I know I'm right I just didn't want to start the old vinyl/analogue vs CD/digital debate

I currently have an old Systemdek (poor mans LP12 ), silver wired Roksan Tabriz, Goldring 1042 and on a good day it gives my CD3.5 run for its money. Not bad considering the CD3.5 cost nearly twice as much new.

I've pretty much had it with upgrading (might go for a power amp later on) as its starting to get expensive but would love, eventually, to treat myself to a really nice turntable. Something like a Gyro with an SME arm and a decent MC pickup. Then I'd never use CD again.

Only downside is that vinyl seems to be cool at the moment so HMV are charging £15-£20 a record [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]

tiggers

Yeah know what you mean about the upgrading thing. I always always wanted a Naim active setup - got it now so that's it I'm done. Got an LP12, but must admit love the sound and looks of a Gyro - Oh God don't start me looking for God's sake.

As for the price of records - bloody typical isn't it - we hang in there when everyone's laughing at us and now they're all trendy the price goes through the roof.

Regards,

tiggers.

TelBoy

Hades, what i was trying to get at, was that an MA-XG version of a song recorded from a very good CD player, will be better than the playback of many cheaper CD players. That is, tape *can* be better than CD. The real problem with tape is that it degrades (much like Optimax of course ) - it's almost impossible, even with metal storage boxes, to prevent it, given time. And yes, pre-recorded tapes are just hideous. That's the problem with any decent hardware, they make this sort of offering sound truly awful.

BTW, you don't need a massive room to appreciate Solstices, they just do more of what Equinoxes are capable of. But Excaliburs do benefit from a bigger operating space, from what i've heard.

Agree regarding vinyl, it's hard to dispute. I'm still buying as many 12" dance records as i ever have done, and still have every LP i ever bought! 80's disco night, anyone?!

corradoboy

I always thought the Linn Basik was the poor mans LP12 ! I used to have one of those. It was, and still is stunning for the money. I bought it after auditioning the top 8 turntables of the time and IMHO it was leagues ahead in that price bracket. Best bit is though, I still get to listen to it on my mates valve amp through his £3k custom made speakers. Lush

ProperCharlie

<note to self - avoid the vinyl vs. digital debate>

oh what the hell. like i said in a different thread, i believe vinyl is still better, £ for £, than CD. I have a linn axis/akito/dynavector 10x which was £250 second hand (10 years ago). The cart was about £120 IIRC, and that was 5 years ago. My cd source is a meridian 558, which was over 2k. given a well pressed record, the turntable is better IMO. even if you chucked in the cost of the phono stage, i reckon you could get a TT set up brand new for about £1.5k that would be as good or better than the 558 cdp, which is the best cdp i have heard.

yes, i know this is fairly irrelevant to the original question - such is life.

TelBoy

Well avoided Proper Charles.

civictyper

Active Heck, don't even go there. The higher end Naim stuff is awesome IMO but the prices are far too scary. I'm on the bottom of the Naim food chain and I'm scared already.

From my personal point of view though some of the more expensive Naim players are good enough to rival vinyl (almost). Really involving IMO which is why I bought the 3.5. Hmmm CDS II.

Only problem I have with Naim though is the cost of the PSU's. I mean £900 for a Hi-cap which consists of a transformer, capacitors and a few regulators I ended up making one myself and, admittedly it doesn't sound as good, but only cost £200 max.

Hell, got to stop dreaming about hi-fi otherwise I'll get on one and buy another box

Luke

Check this out you naim Nutters
Pink fish


Met a guy from there who built my headphone amp. he builds power supplies for naims (along with many others) for less than £150.00 that walk over the naim stuff.

Luke

Just buy a Denon DM30 and a nice pair of speakers and speaker cable. Cost less than £260.00 . Will be a classic..well its starting to be . Many have them and will tellyou how good they are.
Proper Charlie seems to have one in his pic??? In the digital photography thread

[Edited by Luke - 12/10/2003 10:29:41 AM]

Cosworth427

When I was 19, I tried to get credit for a pair of Monitor Audio MA 20SEs floorstanders. Sevenoaks Hi-Fi had surplus pairs and sold them for £1000! That's less than half the price for retail!

I listened to them with an Arcam Alpha 10 amp, alpha 9 CD player with the Police Greatest Hits, fab quality even on 20 year old recordings.

I got refused credit...

Luke

Next time tell them you own your own house and you are married with kids.. then you can get credit to buy Krell!!!

csm007

tried amstrad cool gear lol

tiggers

Yeah, but it helps if you have a mate who's a Naim dealer and you shop around in the secondhand market. Besides having 4 135's sitting there just looks so cool SOund pretty good too.

I still say that vinyl sounds better than CD and that's with a major league Naim CD player in the system - there' snot much in it, but it's still better.

tiggers.

ProperCharlie

well spotted, luke - it is one of the first series denon thingies. still using it with the mission designed speakers it comes with, which are just about ok, but i've got some old wharfdales that i used to run behind the tv which i might try it with.

still haven't got round to telling the missus about the valve system i've got planned for that room.

(happy christmas, darling )

[Edited by ProperCharlie - 12/10/2003 11:56:12 AM]