Thanks to rover
06 September 2003, 11:04 AM
#121
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Rich and Mini,
You make some valid points. But, remember no matter how experienced or not you are for your years, no one is ever too old to learn. What I'm trying to say is that you, me and the rest of us will ALWAYS have something to learn. Yes, some of those accidents were driver error. I'm convinced that most of those errors came about because too many drivers OF ANY AGE nowadays believe all the hype and think their modern gizmo-toy loaded cars will do it all for them. They won't and never will. Thus they live in a safe but, false sense of security for that 99.99% of the time. Then along comes that 0.01%. Then it's; look mum, no brakes or steering. They've never known that before .... and that new steep learning curve experience often comes along with a BANG... a BIG one!.... thus putting other road users at serious risk as they did to me that day....
Had your modified Mini had it's original skinny rims instead of those 13 x 7s, it would almost certainly have been far better in those conditions than most modern gizmo-loaded cars. Here again I speak from experience.
Back to the subject of Ultimate Driving Machines you work with - yes I'm referring to the krautmobiles of a certain marque... got a copy of Auto Express ..... check out the MG ZT advert on pages 46-47 ....
"8 OUT OF 10 PEOPLE PREFERRED DRIVING THE MG ZT" instead of the similarly priced beemer apparently.... also ran "BMW" .... what a turn up for the books. Way to go MG-R.
Also in the same issue a first impression of the City Rover ..... read it ! Another turn up for the books!
You make some valid points. But, remember no matter how experienced or not you are for your years, no one is ever too old to learn. What I'm trying to say is that you, me and the rest of us will ALWAYS have something to learn. Yes, some of those accidents were driver error. I'm convinced that most of those errors came about because too many drivers OF ANY AGE nowadays believe all the hype and think their modern gizmo-toy loaded cars will do it all for them. They won't and never will. Thus they live in a safe but, false sense of security for that 99.99% of the time. Then along comes that 0.01%. Then it's; look mum, no brakes or steering. They've never known that before .... and that new steep learning curve experience often comes along with a BANG... a BIG one!.... thus putting other road users at serious risk as they did to me that day....
Had your modified Mini had it's original skinny rims instead of those 13 x 7s, it would almost certainly have been far better in those conditions than most modern gizmo-loaded cars. Here again I speak from experience.
Back to the subject of Ultimate Driving Machines you work with - yes I'm referring to the krautmobiles of a certain marque
... got a copy of Auto Express ..... check out the MG ZT advert on pages 46-47 .... "8 OUT OF 10 PEOPLE PREFERRED DRIVING THE MG ZT" instead of the similarly priced beemer apparently.... also ran "BMW" .... what a turn up for the books. Way to go MG-R.
Also in the same issue a first impression of the City Rover ..... read it ! Another turn up for the books!
06 September 2003, 11:04 AM
#122
Back on topic..... !
Happened to be in a Rover dealers yesterday checking over a part ex for my brother who is not mechanically minded, Rover 214 SLi with 68k, FSH, electric bits, new tyres, exhaust and one owner, it cost a grand, thats for a 95 M reg and its mint, thats the point of Rovers for me, cheap transport that isnt too painful, it goes quite well as its 104 bhp wheras the equivalent Astra, Escort or similar is nowehere near and not a patch on the old 200. My dad got a 200 Coupe, again a minter (we have an arrangement with the dealer for part ex's, a hundred quid in his pocket), a grand again for an N reg, he has been offered 1800 quid for it so somebody likes them.
Dealer wasnt too hopeful about Streetwise sales with one enquiry so far, he followed it up a week later and they had bought a New Astra, in fact the two I asked (with this thread in mind) were a little embarassed about it, however in the showroom in Mettalic red I have to say it looked ok in the way fat birds can I suppose, In fact if I was drunk at ten to two in the morning and happened to be in a Rover showroom I may just buy one !
Perhaps Rover are missing a marketing opportunity here.
Happened to be in a Rover dealers yesterday checking over a part ex for my brother who is not mechanically minded, Rover 214 SLi with 68k, FSH, electric bits, new tyres, exhaust and one owner, it cost a grand, thats for a 95 M reg and its mint, thats the point of Rovers for me, cheap transport that isnt too painful, it goes quite well as its 104 bhp wheras the equivalent Astra, Escort or similar is nowehere near and not a patch on the old 200. My dad got a 200 Coupe, again a minter (we have an arrangement with the dealer for part ex's, a hundred quid in his pocket), a grand again for an N reg, he has been offered 1800 quid for it so somebody likes them.
Dealer wasnt too hopeful about Streetwise sales with one enquiry so far, he followed it up a week later and they had bought a New Astra, in fact the two I asked (with this thread in mind) were a little embarassed about it, however in the showroom in Mettalic red I have to say it looked ok in the way fat birds can I suppose, In fact if I was drunk at ten to two in the morning and happened to be in a Rover showroom I may just buy one !
Perhaps Rover are missing a marketing opportunity here.
06 September 2003, 11:22 AM
#123
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J4CKO,
What you're doing with that dealership is "underwriting" their old part exchanges they take in against new or newer cars. Those are the tidy cars which are still too old for the dealership's used car Forcourts. Thus, you are helping them to deal on new car sales. Many "traders" both full time or occasional have similar arrangements with dealerships of any car marque you care to mention.
As you have found; it's a money saving way to acquire some tidy used cars which you can sell on later. Do it too many times in any one year though and Mr VAT man will be giving you a call.....
(They have powers).
What you're doing with that dealership is "underwriting" their old part exchanges they take in against new or newer cars. Those are the tidy cars which are still too old for the dealership's used car Forcourts. Thus, you are helping them to deal on new car sales. Many "traders" both full time or occasional have similar arrangements with dealerships of any car marque you care to mention.
As you have found; it's a money saving way to acquire some tidy used cars which you can sell on later. Do it too many times in any one year though and Mr VAT man will be giving you a call.....
(They have powers).
06 September 2003, 11:57 AM
#124
You can sell seven cars in one year I beleive, may be wrong though.
I used to buy all the companies ex fleet 200's for about 1500 quid, mint them up, MOT them and sell them for between 2 and 2 and half grand until the directors got wise to me and started asking more for the car, gits
I used to buy all the companies ex fleet 200's for about 1500 quid, mint them up, MOT them and sell them for between 2 and 2 and half grand until the directors got wise to me and started asking more for the car, gits
06 September 2003, 01:14 PM
#125
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quote: "..... check out the MG ZT advert on pages 46-47 ....
"8 OUT OF 10 PEOPLE PREFERRED DRIVING THE MG ZT" instead of the similarly priced beemer apparently"
I think the clue here is that the info is printed in an advert for Rover. They are hardly going to say "8 out of 10 people would have a BMW but can't afford one so ended up in a Rover".
Whether or not they are better cars is hardly relevant to the type of people who are potential customers for either marque. The Rover will garner you far less respect from shallow people who don't understand cars (ie most people). BTW I still firmly believe that the "streetwise" is a complete disaster- how well has Fords Fusion done? A similar car in a similar sector of the market.
The thing that has amused me most in this thread is the assumption of some low life types that I somehow "hate MG rover" or am not "patriotic" (not jingoistic thats for sure)- they then resort to cheap insults. Losers.
"8 OUT OF 10 PEOPLE PREFERRED DRIVING THE MG ZT" instead of the similarly priced beemer apparently"
I think the clue here is that the info is printed in an advert for Rover. They are hardly going to say "8 out of 10 people would have a BMW but can't afford one so ended up in a Rover".
Whether or not they are better cars is hardly relevant to the type of people who are potential customers for either marque. The Rover will garner you far less respect from shallow people who don't understand cars (ie most people). BTW I still firmly believe that the "streetwise" is a complete disaster- how well has Fords Fusion done? A similar car in a similar sector of the market.
The thing that has amused me most in this thread is the assumption of some low life types that I somehow "hate MG rover" or am not "patriotic" (not jingoistic thats for sure)- they then resort to cheap insults. Losers.
06 September 2003, 02:21 PM
#126
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John - I'm always willing to learn, and am in awe of my dad's driving capabilities, I still consider him to be one of the most capable drivers I've been out with in a car. He taught me how to drive at the age of six, and I haven't looked back I know why my Mini was awful in the snow, and again, I have experience of this too, as my other Mini is on 165/60/12 Yoko tyres, which were ok in the snow, but no where near as good as the 145/70/12 Pirelli which are standard fit. The Pirelli are awful in anything other than snow though, but just because it snows once every 2/3 years, I'm not going to keep them on in that off chance it might snow, because the Yokos are better 99.99% of the time
Seriously though, I don't mean to come across as a know all who isn't willing to learn, these are just my thoughts.
The ZT 190 is a good car, and I'd have one over the equivalently priced BMW (which would be a 320, they are 2.2 straight 6 with 171bhp, so already 20bhp down on the MG), simply because they are a more sporting drive than a lowly 320 saloon. They look better too. But, I wouldn't buy a saloon in the first place, I'd buy a Coupe, in which case, again, there'd be no contest, BMW everytime.
Jawa - can we agree to disagree mate? How's the 205? I still so want one, VTS gotta stay for another year or so though 
Rich
I know why my Mini was awful in the snow, and again, I have experience of this too, as my other Mini is on 165/60/12 Yoko tyres, which were ok in the snow, but no where near as good as the 145/70/12 Pirelli which are standard fit. The Pirelli are awful in anything other than snow though, but just because it snows once every 2/3 years, I'm not going to keep them on in that off chance it might snow, because the Yokos are better 99.99% of the time Seriously though, I don't mean to come across as a know all who isn't willing to learn, these are just my thoughts.
The ZT 190 is a good car, and I'd have one over the equivalently priced BMW (which would be a 320, they are 2.2 straight 6 with 171bhp, so already 20bhp down on the MG), simply because they are a more sporting drive than a lowly 320 saloon. They look better too. But, I wouldn't buy a saloon in the first place, I'd buy a Coupe, in which case, again, there'd be no contest, BMW everytime.
Jawa - can we agree to disagree mate?
How's the 205? I still so want one, VTS gotta stay for another year or so though Rich
06 September 2003, 03:32 PM
#127
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>>The Rover will garner you far less respect from shallow people who don't understand cars (ie most people). <<
Probably the most astute observation in over 1200 NACRO postings here ...
Probably the most astute observation in over 1200 NACRO postings here ...
06 September 2003, 06:08 PM
#129
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quote: "Probably the most astute observation in over 1200 NACRO postings here ..."
Have you read them all to be qualified to make that statement? Or are you talking out of your lower orifice as usual?
Have you read them all to be qualified to make that statement? Or are you talking out of your lower orifice as usual?
06 September 2003, 07:44 PM
#130
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Aahhh yes, the wonderful new Rover ad.
2 things:
1. Negative advertising (i.e. slagging off another brand to sell yours) just shouts desperation. Why on earth did they put this advert in, its a patehatic way to advertise, and it devalues the MG, which is a good car.
2. I bet you I could go up to the first 10 people on the street and the results would be quite the opposite.
2 things:
1. Negative advertising (i.e. slagging off another brand to sell yours) just shouts desperation. Why on earth did they put this advert in, its a patehatic way to advertise, and it devalues the MG, which is a good car.
2. I bet you I could go up to the first 10 people on the street and the results would be quite the opposite.
06 September 2003, 08:50 PM
#131
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NACRO's at it again ...
No, you are quite correct. I have NOT read all of them .... that's why I qualified my statement by using the word "probably" ...
You really must try harder .... and your obsession with things **** must be a worry for you poor dear ... there's an ointment available for your condition. Or perhaps in your case it's a permanent one with no known cure ....
Skittles,
It can be a mistake to judge things purely from your own viewpoint. Unlike a few decades ago, modern car buyers have a vast variation in tastes, standards and values now. MG-R are fully aware of that and know that this advertising technique is quite effective and reaches those who would not otherwise notice a more routine advertising approach. ...... and in the final analysis, reaching a wider audience must be high on MG-R's priorities list now. Something sadly neglected in past efforts.
Your use of the term "desperation" I feel is wrong because I suggest that ALL manufacturers are at least keen to sell their products by whatever means they feel will work. For survival, MG-R are right to experiment and explore all possibilities. This is simply one of them.
No, you are quite correct. I have NOT read all of them .... that's why I qualified my statement by using the word "probably" ...
You really must try harder .... and your obsession with things **** must be a worry for you poor dear ... there's an ointment available for your condition. Or perhaps in your case it's a permanent one with no known cure ....
Skittles,
It can be a mistake to judge things purely from your own viewpoint. Unlike a few decades ago, modern car buyers have a vast variation in tastes, standards and values now. MG-R are fully aware of that and know that this advertising technique is quite effective and reaches those who would not otherwise notice a more routine advertising approach. ...... and in the final analysis, reaching a wider audience must be high on MG-R's priorities list now. Something sadly neglected in past efforts.
Your use of the term "desperation" I feel is wrong because I suggest that ALL manufacturers are at least keen to sell their products by whatever means they feel will work. For survival, MG-R are right to experiment and explore all possibilities. This is simply one of them.
07 September 2003, 12:50 AM
#132
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Nacro quote: "some low life types"
Nacro quote: "then resort to cheap insults. Losers"
Nacro quote: "Or are you talking out of your lower orifice as usual?"
Pots and kettles, dear boy, pots and kettles. You're letting your standards slip.
Nacro quote: "then resort to cheap insults. Losers"
Nacro quote: "Or are you talking out of your lower orifice as usual?"
Pots and kettles, dear boy, pots and kettles. You're letting your standards slip.
07 September 2003, 01:37 AM
#133
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8 OUT OF 10 PEOPLE PREFERRED DRIVING THE MG ZT" instead of the similarly priced beemer apparently"
having owned a rover 827, and yes its a quick car, it does doesn't compare with a beemer.
sorry, end of story.
and before you ask, the current models are of far worse build, so even less comparable!!!
Cack of the highest order!!!
LMFAO at even trying to compare!!!!
BB
07 September 2003, 09:17 AM
#134
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NACRO Wrote:
>>Getting back on topic it's a shame about the streetwise then. It will be fun to see what you have to say when the sales figures for them start to become available.<<
Right - please advise what in your opinion would be the level of "success" as far as the Streetwise is concerned. Then, in the unlikely event that it's a reasonable level ( - some of your "reasonable" previous postings do not inspire confidence in this respect ) may I suggest a little money where your mouth is? That is; how about a little wager? The Streewise is not my cup of tea as previously stated, but then, I'm not every other car buyer with similar tastes. I've driven one and seen two. The Oxygen Blue example looked so much better than the grey version I drove. It will have appeal to some buyers - question is how many...
BTW, who mentioned "lower orifice" first? Nah, nah na-nah nah! You child ... so lets treat you as such ....!
beemerboy ... we've exchanged views before ... just noticed your ESSEX location. I used to live in Essex, gorn right dahn the pan since I left apparently .... all bleedin' beemer drivers - the A12 and A13 infested wiv 'em init m8..... Ubiquitous or what ....no longer "exclusive" - well dahn the pan mefinks - forget them Chelsea land barges, Chigwell Chuggers or what ....
More seriously though, that 827 you had, the one with the Honda engine, did you have it from new? and:
>>and before you ask, the current models are of far worse build, so even less comparable!!!<<
Think you're well off the mark there ...... speaking from personal experience are you, or simply another "hype brainwashed" victim? Well out of order .... open those peepers ....
Have a nice one, whatever you drive ...
>>Getting back on topic it's a shame about the streetwise then. It will be fun to see what you have to say when the sales figures for them start to become available.<<
Right - please advise what in your opinion would be the level of "success" as far as the Streetwise is concerned. Then, in the unlikely event that it's a reasonable level (
- some of your "reasonable" previous postings do not inspire confidence in this respect ) may I suggest a little money where your mouth is? That is; how about a little wager? The Streewise is not my cup of tea as previously stated, but then, I'm not every other car buyer with similar tastes. I've driven one and seen two. The Oxygen Blue example looked so much better than the grey version I drove. It will have appeal to some buyers - question is how many...BTW, who mentioned "lower orifice" first? Nah, nah na-nah nah! You child ... so lets treat you as such ....!
beemerboy ... we've exchanged views before ...
just noticed your ESSEX location. I used to live in Essex, gorn right dahn the pan since I left apparently .... all bleedin' beemer drivers - the A12 and A13 infested wiv 'em init m8..... Ubiquitous or what ....no longer "exclusive" - well dahn the pan mefinks - forget them Chelsea land barges, Chigwell Chuggers or what .... More seriously though, that 827 you had, the one with the Honda engine, did you have it from new? and:
>>and before you ask, the current models are of far worse build, so even less comparable!!!<<
Think you're well off the mark there ...... speaking from personal experience are you, or simply another "hype brainwashed" victim? Well out of order .... open those peepers ....
Have a nice one, whatever you drive ...
07 September 2003, 09:36 AM
#135
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Also, beware Professionals and their opinions because often that's all they are .... that dealer who was less than convinced about whether the Streetwise would sell or not reminds me. Back in 1982 when the MG Metro was first introduced. I spoke to the Sales manager of an ARG dealership. In his opinion he'd seen it all before and the new MG was simply a "tarted up" Metro. Thus, he only ordered a dozen. Later I learned that his sales staff raced each other to put sold tickets on that dozen for their clients before they were removed from the transporter!! He wished he'd ordered much more as he turned away lots of paying customers who wanted one right now and all his were already sold. IIRC, on August 1st 1982, 1% of all new car registrations was an MG Metro.
Oh yes, I bought one in 1982 too! Nice family runabout. Course, it fell to bits like most Rovers (and other cars) do...... 16 years and 100,000+ HARD miles later when I gave it away ... after removing the engine and those excellent seats which lived on in another car ....
As I said, reserve judgement .....
Oh yes, I bought one in 1982 too! Nice family runabout. Course, it fell to bits like most Rovers (and other cars) do...... 16 years and 100,000+ HARD miles later when I gave it away ... after removing the engine and those excellent seats which lived on in another car ....
As I said, reserve judgement .....
07 September 2003, 09:59 AM
#136
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beemer boy,
Just when you thought .... It gets worse ...
Just have to tell you this and apologise to you and others if you're bored with it all already but it does relate in some way to this "Streetwise" theme;
Sometime after I took delivery of that new MG Metro back then, my life-long close "seen it all, done it all" friend who lived in Chingford (That Essex enough for you?) had a right go at me for my choice of runabout. He actually used that same term "Tarted up Metro". I then tossed him the keys and we went for a little run........ Long story short - he got a new one sometime later ..... ideal back then for getting about the roads in the Metrollops ... errr cant spell ... capital city ....
Just when you thought .... It gets worse ...
Just have to tell you this and apologise to you and others if you're bored with it all already but it does relate in some way to this "Streetwise" theme;
Sometime after I took delivery of that new MG Metro back then, my life-long close "seen it all, done it all" friend who lived in Chingford (That Essex enough for you?
) had a right go at me for my choice of runabout. He actually used that same term "Tarted up Metro". I then tossed him the keys and we went for a little run........ Long story short - he got a new one sometime later ..... ideal back then for getting about the roads in the Metrollops ... errr cant spell ... capital city ....
07 September 2003, 10:24 AM
#137
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quote: "Just have to tell you this and apologise to you and others if you're bored with it all already"
Thanks for the apology it's about time you realised that you are a boring old fart (another *** related comment to keep you happy as you seem to be obsessed with them)LOL.
As I said let MG's "streetwise" sales performance prove my point for me. Your mindless ramblings are starting to sound desperate.
Thanks for the apology it's about time you realised that you are a boring old fart (another *** related comment to keep you happy as you seem to be obsessed with them)LOL.
As I said let MG's "streetwise" sales performance prove my point for me. Your mindless ramblings are starting to sound desperate.
07 September 2003, 10:25 AM
#138
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BTW the MG Metro was the worst of all the hot hatches of the time- destroyed by the Pug 205 Gti, Golf Gti and even the AX GT. Truly a sad muppet mobile and not in any way an MG.
07 September 2003, 10:30 AM
#139
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Surely this thread has run its course now. It's clear there are people who feel very strongly for the success of the MG Rover group, and those who are indifferent to it.
Since we aren't aware of the numbers involved in sales terms, to make the Streetwise a success, it seems pointless bickering about it.
Somehow, considering the fact that MG Rover have launched the CityRover now, one would assume that that model will be the car that they wish to sell to the masses, and the Streetwise will have a lesser role in keeping the company alive.
Quote: the "losers" comment wasn't an insult merely a statement of fact.
Oh, and Nacro, unless you personally know all of us, that cannot be classed as a statement of fact. It's just a comment, or insult, designed to get our backs up. I expect better from you.
Since we aren't aware of the numbers involved in sales terms, to make the Streetwise a success, it seems pointless bickering about it.
Somehow, considering the fact that MG Rover have launched the CityRover now, one would assume that that model will be the car that they wish to sell to the masses, and the Streetwise will have a lesser role in keeping the company alive.
Quote: the "losers" comment wasn't an insult merely a statement of fact.
Oh, and Nacro, unless you personally know all of us, that cannot be classed as a statement of fact. It's just a comment, or insult, designed to get our backs up. I expect better from you.
07 September 2003, 10:58 AM
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No the comment losers wasn't aimed at you as individuals- just as losers on the argument in this thread.
Strange that you would assume I meant it as a comment about you in general. Is it a comment people have made about you? Or just a general feeling you have?
I agree this thread has degenerated into dross, largely due to the efforts of you and the MG evangelist. That being the case why don't you both stop posting on it and let people who are interested in discussing the failure of the "streetwise" (still seems like an ironic choice of name to me)get on with it.
Strange that you would assume I meant it as a comment about you in general. Is it a comment people have made about you? Or just a general feeling you have?
I agree this thread has degenerated into dross, largely due to the efforts of you and the MG evangelist. That being the case why don't you both stop posting on it and let people who are interested in discussing the failure of the "streetwise" (still seems like an ironic choice of name to me)get on with it.
07 September 2003, 11:16 AM
#142
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Nope, never been called that to date. Maybe you ought to clarify your comments more, so they cannot be misconstrued (sp?).
But I agree with you - there's no point in myself or MGJohn adding to this thread. Carry on insulting, laughing at and extracting the urine from MG Rover's latest offering.
But I agree with you - there's no point in myself or MGJohn adding to this thread. Carry on insulting, laughing at and extracting the urine from MG Rover's latest offering.
07 September 2003, 12:55 PM
#143
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Jawa - can we agree to disagree mate? How's the 205? I still so want one, VTS gotta stay for another year or so though
No we can't [off topic]
The 205 is great, did an oil change a few weeks ago and took it out for a blast, still bags of fun, came back with a massive grin!
Need to get the stem seals done though! I'm sure when the chance comes for you to get one, you'll have a right laugh!
[/off topic]
07 September 2003, 09:17 PM
#145
You cannot comapre a 1.3 MG Metro to a Pug 205 (didnt arrive until 85 anyway) or Golf GTI, thats ridiculous, it wasnt a competitor but it was popular and deservedly so. 73 bhp in a small agile car, it handled, made the right noises and had a bit of cred back then, remember we are talking 21 years ago here. My mum had one and I used to pinch it and rag it senseless, really good fun.
The later Metro GTI was too much engine for the chassis though. Even the bloody Maestro MG wasnt that bad, ugly yes but again it handled and was as quick if not quicker than a Golf GTI or Astra GTE (the 2.0 one not the ropey twin carb ones)
You have to look at them in context of the time they were around, not now.
The later Metro GTI was too much engine for the chassis though. Even the bloody Maestro MG wasnt that bad, ugly yes but again it handled and was as quick if not quicker than a Golf GTI or Astra GTE (the 2.0 one not the ropey twin carb ones)
You have to look at them in context of the time they were around, not now.
07 September 2003, 09:59 PM
#146
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Hey J4CKO,
Careful now, you're making far too much sense.... I had started a similar response to yours on those unfair and certainly chronologically nonsense comparisons. Thanks, saved me a job. Reassuring to know I'm not the only one who sees things differently to certain parties ....
Careful now, you're making far too much sense....
I had started a similar response to yours on those unfair and certainly chronologically nonsense comparisons. Thanks, saved me a job. Reassuring to know I'm not the only one who sees things differently to certain parties ....
08 September 2003, 10:34 AM
#147
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"Your use of the term "desperation" I feel is wrong because I suggest that ALL manufacturers are at least keen to sell their products by whatever means they feel will work. For survival, MG-R are right to experiment and explore all possibilities. This is simply one of them."
Fine, but it cheapens the brand. Negative advertising always does, and I don't see any other manufacturer sinking to these depths. It is also interesting they compare it to a base level 3er.
By the way, my second car is a Rover, and I have also owned a Rover before this one... I have two problems with Rover -
1. The build quality - the products are fine, I just wish they would pull their socks up in this respect - not talking about breakdowns, but about rattles and bits dropping off. Saying this, the current Rover is better than the one before in this respect, but still well off today's standards. I can't comment on the very current range - i.e. the MGs, but they seem better again.
2. The arrogance of the sales staff is appaling. I had to take my last Rover in time after time after time, mostly for the same things, the service staff made feel they were doing me a favour.
I think very few people are against Rover/MG for the sake of it. In fact I would say the vast majority of the people want it to succeed.
However, the Streetwise, I feel, is not a smart idea. Not because its Rover though... It could have been the Porsche Streetwise, I still would have been as sceptical!
Fine, but it cheapens the brand. Negative advertising always does, and I don't see any other manufacturer sinking to these depths. It is also interesting they compare it to a base level 3er.
By the way, my second car is a Rover, and I have also owned a Rover before this one... I have two problems with Rover -
1. The build quality - the products are fine, I just wish they would pull their socks up in this respect - not talking about breakdowns, but about rattles and bits dropping off. Saying this, the current Rover is better than the one before in this respect, but still well off today's standards. I can't comment on the very current range - i.e. the MGs, but they seem better again.
2. The arrogance of the sales staff is appaling. I had to take my last Rover in time after time after time, mostly for the same things, the service staff made feel they were doing me a favour.
I think very few people are against Rover/MG for the sake of it. In fact I would say the vast majority of the people want it to succeed.
However, the Streetwise, I feel, is not a smart idea. Not because its Rover though... It could have been the Porsche Streetwise, I still would have been as sceptical!
08 September 2003, 11:31 AM
#148
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Skittles - some good points there
I've been involved with Rovers for a while (Not as long as MGjohn, obviously, as I'm still a youngster)
In the main, I like the design of the cars and the attention to detail in the design work. However, the way the cars are assembled is not amusing. They seem to be thrown together with little care!
I test drove the MGTF and the MX5 some time ago, and both are fun cars (OK, no jokes about hairdressing) however, the MX5 seems so much more substantially built and very tidily finished off as though the assembly and QC workers cared about the job they do.
The MG was a bit slap dash, and there were rattles after 250 miles!!
There weren't as many toys, the cabin was more cramped and not as well layed out, but it was still IMHO the better car. There's not that much in it, I admit but then you consider the price and the depreciation over three years...
The dealer was more friendly at Rover, but that's another story!!
I've been involved with Rovers for a while (Not as long as MGjohn, obviously, as I'm still a youngster
)In the main, I like the design of the cars and the attention to detail in the design work. However, the way the cars are assembled is not amusing. They seem to be thrown together with little care!
I test drove the MGTF and the MX5 some time ago, and both are fun cars (OK, no jokes about hairdressing
) however, the MX5 seems so much more substantially built and very tidily finished off as though the assembly and QC workers cared about the job they do. The MG was a bit slap dash, and there were rattles after 250 miles!!
There weren't as many toys, the cabin was more cramped and not as well layed out, but it was still IMHO the better car. There's not that much in it, I admit but then you consider the price and the depreciation over three years...
The dealer was more friendly at Rover, but that's another story!!
08 September 2003, 10:17 PM
#149
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skittles WROTE:
>>The arrogance of the sales staff is appaling. I had to take my last Rover in time after time after time, mostly for the same things, the service staff made feel they were doing me a favour.<<
I'm appalled to read this too! My local ARG-now MG-R dealership sales staff have always been courteous, helpful, willing to go that final quid to secure the deal and so they've had my business. The same is true of the service department. The exact opposite of your findings..... puzzling that. In fact, over the years I've used dealerships all over the country for my own, family or company car purchases and service follow ups. I can honestly say I've rarely had less than satisfactory service with any of them and often faultless first class treatment. I also help buy the cars for other family members and friends to whom haggling for the best deal is "beneath them", and then there's "You know about cars John, can you help" ....if you know what I mean .....
Why is it that some folks find poor service and attitudes frequently whilst others always appear to get better treatment? My wife made a similar point about this only the other day when we discussed the problems she'd had whilst out shopping that day. She made the point that I rarely have such problems ever! Just lucky I guess or .... Attitudes are a two way thing. Throughout most of my employment and career (now mostly behind me praise be ... I've had to deal directly with the public in all it's various forms .... and boy oh boy do they come in various forms.... From violence threatening nasty types (and the men as just as bad ..)to genuine salt of the earth types across all classes and backgrounds. Maybe that experience has conditioned my way of dealing with other folks and more often than not, brings out the best in them. There again, maybe not ....
One thing is certain, on those very rare occasions I do encounter poor service or arrogance, I let the individuals know politely but, in no uncertain terms plus, if I feel sufficiently strongly about it, take it to a higher level. This rarely happens but when it does, it usually provides a satisfactory outcome. Always try and find or take the time to do this. You will feel better for it and more often than not, the end result is good for all parties involved.
On the other hand, when I do find good service, which to be fair I often do, I thank the individuals concerned and add I will have no hesitation to recommending them to others. Obviously this always generates goodwill so that next time I again use their services, chances are I will be well remembered and again dealt with very satisfactorily or better......That way I rarely get a "cant do it this month" but often "Tomorrow be OK John". The bills are not such a nasty shock too. As I said, it makes a big difference and pays.
For many years it's been the British "thing" to not complain or compliment. That's a wrong attitude. Yes, I know we're all too busy earning a crust or chasing money, but there are still some who need to be reminded it's not their boss who pays their salaries or wages, but you or me - their customers. There are still many out there who simply don't appreciate that. When the chances come along to educate such ignorant folk, take it but do so in a polite manner so not to antagonise or worse ..... More often or not, we'll all benefit in the long run ..... Or,....
Have I been doing it all wrong again? ......
Have a nice one .....
>>The arrogance of the sales staff is appaling. I had to take my last Rover in time after time after time, mostly for the same things, the service staff made feel they were doing me a favour.<<
I'm appalled to read this too! My local ARG-now MG-R dealership sales staff have always been courteous, helpful, willing to go that final quid to secure the deal and so they've had my business. The same is true of the service department. The exact opposite of your findings..... puzzling that. In fact, over the years I've used dealerships all over the country for my own, family or company car purchases and service follow ups. I can honestly say I've rarely had less than satisfactory service with any of them and often faultless first class treatment. I also help buy the cars for other family members and friends to whom haggling for the best deal is "beneath them", and then there's "You know about cars John, can you help" ....if you know what I mean .....
Why is it that some folks find poor service and attitudes frequently whilst others always appear to get better treatment? My wife made a similar point about this only the other day when we discussed the problems she'd had whilst out shopping that day. She made the point that I rarely have such problems ever! Just lucky I guess or .... Attitudes are a two way thing. Throughout most of my employment and career (now mostly behind me praise be ...
I've had to deal directly with the public in all it's various forms .... and boy oh boy do they come in various forms.... From violence threatening nasty types (and the men as just as bad ..)to genuine salt of the earth types across all classes and backgrounds. Maybe that experience has conditioned my way of dealing with other folks and more often than not, brings out the best in them. There again, maybe not ....One thing is certain, on those very rare occasions I do encounter poor service or arrogance, I let the individuals know politely but, in no uncertain terms plus, if I feel sufficiently strongly about it, take it to a higher level. This rarely happens but when it does, it usually provides a satisfactory outcome. Always try and find or take the time to do this. You will feel better for it and more often than not, the end result is good for all parties involved.
On the other hand, when I do find good service, which to be fair I often do, I thank the individuals concerned and add I will have no hesitation to recommending them to others. Obviously this always generates goodwill so that next time I again use their services, chances are I will be well remembered and again dealt with very satisfactorily or better......That way I rarely get a "cant do it this month" but often "Tomorrow be OK John". The bills are not such a nasty shock too. As I said, it makes a big difference and pays.
For many years it's been the British "thing" to not complain or compliment. That's a wrong attitude. Yes, I know we're all too busy earning a crust or chasing money, but there are still some who need to be reminded it's not their boss who pays their salaries or wages, but you or me - their customers. There are still many out there who simply don't appreciate that. When the chances come along to educate such ignorant folk, take it but do so in a polite manner so not to antagonise or worse ..... More often or not, we'll all benefit in the long run ..... Or,....
Have I been doing it all wrong again? ......
Have a nice one .....
08 September 2003, 10:49 PM
#150
The AX GT didnt arrive until 87 (E reg), the point being the MG Metro was a product of the seventies really and cannot be compared objectively to products arriving several years later. The Turbo one wasnt really very good and I preffferred the ordinary one having driven both.
And anyway, since when was the AX GT a paragon of virtue !
And anyway, since when was the AX GT a paragon of virtue !