fatherpierre

LOL

You been at the hard stuff again, John?

bloke

I have every sympathy for rover employees. I hope that one day they have management who do not think it wise to produce tarted up versions of cars that should have been pensioned off some time ago

akshay67

These days the brown bags are more trendy, especially if you've suffered not drinking enough and pulled a minger.

Have you had a brown bag moment?

MGJohn

fatherpierre -

that's no way for a man of the cloth to behave .... and no, I rarely touch it as I have to drive frequently and loss of licence would be a real pain for me......

bloke -

Right then, you're now in charge of MG-R so let's have your plans for new Rover platforms please. Just one little problem; there's no funds available so you'll have to provide a REAL miracle (can you help him here fp?...) or work with what you have already. From your comment "tarted up versions of cars that should have been pensioned off some time ago", can I take it that you have only limited experience of the latest ZR/ZS/ZT range which other car enthusiasts have discovered are vastly IMPROVED and certainly not tarted up? If you are NOT speaking from direct experience, then you should seek specialist advice to have those narrowly focussed blinkers removed. If you are, then there are those who see things differently.

"Anyway, my mate knows a bloke who knows another bloke who read somewhere that they're all "warned over" (sp) crap so it must be true...."

Don't you just lurve the one or two line postings like what fp and bloke just done ....







[Edited by MGJohn - 8/31/2003 11:22:36 PM]

fatherpierre

One or two line postings are the bread and butter of this site

Would I be right in suggesting you're a bit of a brand loyalist where Rover's concerned, John?

And what platform would you suggest they use to re-invent the brand?

There you go; more than 2 lines for you

NACRO

quote: "P.S. Ever had a brown envelope on your desk one morning or do you have that experience to come? .... "

Not really, I've been made redundant twice when companies went to the wall and went straight out and got better and higher paying jobs. Currently I live in the South of France, work part time hours and get paid full time money.

Still onto the subject of MG Rover-there is nothing worse than a blinkered POV like yours. Seemingly some of the management there have the same problem. That car is never going to be successful as it doesn't appeal to its target audience, as it looks crap. Instead of making comments about how "youngsters today" etc etc etc etc, perhaps you could tell me what's good about it.

I'll start you off by telling you what's crap about it- the plastic cladding, the lack of 4WD, the fact it's based on an ancient and out of date supermini, the badge and associations that go with it, it's not regarded as image enhancing to drive a Rover (not that it would bother me if the cars were any good).

The funny thing is that I actually like some MG's, the only problem is they stopped making them decades ago.

As for the BRM Rover- do you really think that it looked good with that stupid orange grill at the front? Personally I think it was an affront to the sensibilities of any enthusiast to take the BRM name in vain. BTW I'm only to aware of what British Racing Motors proud past was as I'm a motor racing enthusiast.

There are none so blind as those who WILL NOT see.

lordlucan

Had a BRM Rover a little while back for a few months. A very underated car, BRM would only allow Rover\BMW to use the name if a proper job was done. Yes the red leather interior and the orange mouth were ott but the car went well and handled well for a fwd car. Even had lsd which it really didnt need with 140bhp ish !!
It was cheap from the auction and I didnt expect to like it as much as I did, sold it at a profit 6mths later with the only expense of a service and MOT.
Each to there own I guess.
J.

NACRO

I think you'll find I said the BRM Rover was quite a good car- just that it wasn't a success and looked terrible.

The Zohan

MG John.
Obviously you are a Rover fan, no problem, we all hav our cross to bear .

Lets let the figures do the talking,
Rover has seen a need for this type of vehicle, their well paid marketing and consumer research agencies have told them this is what people want and they have listened and made their choice.

Perhaps in six months time we can see how quickly this has left the showroom, sale figures will do the talking.

Personally, i see it as the next X90, we will see.

NACRO

see you in 6 months to discuss its failure!

Duck_Pond

Seems that VW are following MG too. They've just unveiled the off-roader version of the Polo.

Any comments about them being crap car makers? Having no resources? Not being successful?

There are some nice double standards on here. On the one hand, we see an Impreza, with big wheels, spoilers and agressive looks, and we all say "Wow, nice car mate". Then in the same breath, look at an MG, with big wheels, spoilers and agressive looks and say "It's horrid, tasteless, who'd want such a thing?"

I've got experience of both the Impreza and the MG range, and I can't fault any of them as performance cars. The ZS is fast, handles amazingly for a FWD, and has a wonderful exhaust / engine sound. Sure, on the inside you can moan about the similarity with the Rover base models, but Imprezas haven't exactly got great interiors either!

To start laughing at a company who have performed a miracle so far, simply by surviving, is a bit of a cheap shot.

Yes they are recycling old cars. Agreed, some of the ideas will not suit all tastes, but the more money they generate, and pump back into MG Rover, the sooner they can get new generation models on offer.

NACRO

quote: "On the one hand, we see an Impreza, with big wheels, spoilers and agressive looks, and we all say "Wow, nice car mate". "

Personally I don't like the way any of them (Imprezas) look. I own an Impreza and bought it for what it can do and the AWD. The Impreza is an example of function over form IMHO. It's the cheapest, fastest most effective tool for the job I need a car to do.

As for taking a cheap shot- it hardly matters what we say here on the BBS apart from the fact that some of us represent the demographic Rover is aiming for with the new car. They've missed.

Odd that you should bring up the other MG Rover products- I didn't think we were discussing those. As we are I'll give my purely personal opinions. Based on the fact I've never driven any of them.
They all look a bit "max power" to me, like someone ram raided Halfords and came out with tacky bits of stuff stuck on them. However I'm told they drive extremely well. I've seen a couple in action on track and the Rover 400 based one looked very quick indeed. I'm also told that the 75 based effort is also good to drive if underpowered. As for the 200 based ones- I know nothing about them other than the fact they don't look very good- I'm told the 160BHP model is a hoot. Perhaps you can see from that I'm not biased or wishing a premature end to British car manufacture. I just don't think they have the cars to save themselves.

Duck_Pond

... yet.

what would scooby do

FYI Subaru's parent company made the "kayte" (spelling) fighter which was better than the Zero.

I've owned many many Rovers and they all sucked in some respect.

Anybody who rants and raves about a particular brand must have something to fear (usually depreciation LOL )

Duck_Pond

I drive an Impreza. I just like the MG range.

If they depreciate quickly, just means I might be able to get one next at a huge discount! When the passion for twisties dies down and I still can't afford a 911, then I may opt for the dagger-dagger diesel ZT, and go on holiday more often!

WISHING

Well i think its great, Not cos i like it. But because its another nail in the Rover Coffin !!!!!

NACRO

oooh nasty- harsh but fair after all what is the point in keeping a terminally ill patient alive to the bitter end?

Duck_Pond

Because in that time, they may develop a cure...

WISHING

Not without money, and they aint got that !!

You need to move with the times and rover are unable to, it will always be a 200 or 400 no matter how you dress it up.

Duck_Pond

So how do they get the money to make the new cars? Hmm?

Perhaps they could find a goose that lays golden eggs... Or maybe they have some magic beans that will allow them to find a new kingdom, with a Giant etc...

No, what they can only do is look at innovative ways of selling what they have, cutting costs where possible, and eventually getting new models out.

The 75, MG range and TF are all reasonable motors, but the 25 and 45 are out-dated. There is supposed to be a new 45 on the way, and with any luck (which they need), the Indian-made Supermini will help get some more pennies in.

Considering the state they were left in when BMW pulled out, I think they have done a remarkable job so far, and as such a huge amount of peoples' livelyhoods in the Midlands depend on the company, long may it continue.

Jerry*

Suppose its the wrong BBS to stick up for Rover on but there's some really sad, naff banter on here..

I personally like many of MG/Rover's cars but think that this latest effort looks more than a little cheesy... People on here stating that "it will fail !!" etc.. aren't in any position to comment. I'm not sure that it will sell bucket-loads but many on here rattled on about the MG ZR range when that was unveiled, slagging it off etc.. those cars a disappearing out of the showrooms at a rate of knots.. Good news for MG and good on 'em.

I have owned both a 218iS 16v and the Vi verson of the Rover 200/25 and found that they were both very underrated cars.. quick, fun, well built and reliable..

Just because a car doesn't have 4WD does it mean its cr4p ?? I think not.. who really needs it on normal roads ?? A Pagani Zonda hasn't got 4WD.. is that a crap car ?? FFS !?

Look at the rest of the Impreza range... the GL... its a nasty, bland, Jap nothing of a car.. look at the Sport... its also a bland, slow, nasty-interiored Jap nothing.. but hey.. its cool on here 'cos its a Scooby and this is a Scooby site...

I give credit to MG Rover for trying something a little different with a very limited budget - I'm not totally convinced by the Streetwise but at least they're trying something new... to me its got far more about it that many euro-bland, computer-drawn, character-free efforts of late from Ford and the French peeps..

good luck to 'em !!

NACRO

I don't think protecting vested interests in the midlands is enough to keep this sick puppy alive.

Let's wait and see, I predict a lot of redundancies in the near future unless they do something a LOT better than the "streetwise" in future.

Duck_Pond

Nacro - why so negative about MG Rover? Did they sack you or something?

Or is it because Skoda have bucked their ideas up (under VW) and are no longer worth the jokes?

NACRO

quote: "Just because a car doesn't have 4WD does it mean its cr4p ?? I think not.. who really needs it on normal roads ?? A Pagani Zonda hasn't got 4WD.. is that a crap car ?? FFS !?"

The point is the "streetwise" (which it isn't) is mocked up to look like a 4WD. Whereas it's that most awful of things a supermini based soft roader lifestyle vehicle.


quote: "Nacro - why so negative about MG Rover? Did they sack you or something? Or is it because Skoda have bucked their ideas up (under VW) and are no longer worth the jokes? "

I've never had any affiliation with that company nor would I want any. As for Skoda I've always liked them, even more so now they make the VRs and Superb. I'm negative about MG Rovers products because they produce mostly crap cars.

Duck_Pond

So may I pry further? How many Rover cars have you owned, to come to your verdict of them being "crap"?

My Old Man has had 2 Rovers, for the last 10 years, and never had a problem with them. They've been reliable, comfortable, very economical, and they're not bad looking cars.

As for the new Streetwise not having 4WD... What percentage of the people who buy these "off-roaders", including those with 4WD, ever actually go further off road than mounting the odd curb? It seems to me, that the "style" of off-roaders is popular. (Not to me mind, before you say anything!) So by having a FWD car, it's likely to be more economical, and hence be more attractive.

NACRO

quote: "So may I pry further? How many Rover cars have you owned, to come to your verdict of them being "crap"?"

I've never owned any Rover, although I came very close to buying a SD1 Vitesse and still think they are a very good motor car. I've used Rover 45+400 pool cars that were just plain nasty and old fashioned. If you try reading my comments in the thread you'll see I have some appreciaiton of the higher end MG badged cars they produce at the moment.

My opinion on them generally being "crap" cars is based on their cynical badge engineering and their track record of commercial and critical failure. In the case of the streetwise I'm prepared to wait and see who's right.

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

Come on do you really think the average 4*4 Soft Roader gives a toss about whether their CRV, HRV or Rav 4 are four wheel drive, do you think half of them know what it really entails ?

No they see big chunky Tonka Toy with plenty of kit that they think makes them look good, a Rav 4 is about what, 15 grand, not all suburban mummies can afford a brand new Rav 4 so for 5 grand less you can get a jacked up Rover 25 with similar styling cues, do you think that most car buyers even know which set of wheels pulls or pushes their motor along, get real.

As for credibility, Porsche have just put a 911 nose on a Volkswagen and seem to be getting away with it and to be honest the Streetwise though 1/7th of the price could arguably called better looking cos it cant be any worse.

All those creaming over the M3 CSL, whats that about, throw out all the goodies, chip it by 17 bhp and then charge 12 grand more, no stranger than what Rover are doing, now I fully expect some comments about revered 'CSL' badging, Carbon whatnots, Nurburgring honed handling, all bollocks of course.

Duck_Pond

Nacro, I have read your threads, and I haven't yet seen you say that you personally like the MG cars. All you say, is that you have been told that the cars are good.

You said that you like the "MG" badge, but it's obvious that you are a fan of the old MG cars, like the Midget etc., not of the new range.

And, before you mention the likes of the Maestro, Montego etc., yes, they did use the MG badge in vain, and it cost them dear.

All I hope is that the current range of products from both Rover and MG, allows the company to stay alive, and create more exciting motors for us to drive.

When you consider that the MG ZT was rated much more favourably than the Bugeye Impreza UK300 in terms of driver appeal in Performance Car magazine, it does make you wonder what, given the right resources they can do in the future.

jonc

Lets see if Rover can do the same thing with the MGF, I would love to see that just for the comedy value!

jonc

They could market it towards Toni & Guy employees and call it Stylewise or the ******* or something.