Deep, I'm not sure that Prodrive are demanding trust from their clients but they do guarantee their trust in the product. The ECUTEK STI7 may be a little more sophisticated way of getting 300bhp but if it goes bang then it won't be just 6 weeks of inconvenience to get it fixed, it'll be £3k+ from YOUR pocket too.

Who really cares how much RR power the PPP car puts out? If it performs well on the road then it should be worth it. If Prodrive stated that the PPP gave 280bhp but felt and went as quick as a 340bhp PE RR'd ECUTEK car, would that disuade you from buying it?

F
ps I realise that you (DS) don't have the choice anyway.

 

Mike,your dp findings are interesting(I mean that genuinely)
'I'll have to ask Merv how lean it was to get 340 BHP'.It actually made 325 BHP on their rollers but at 1 bar,now at 1.25bar.It'll be even leaner soon(LOL,c'ant do smilies!)I'm sure the PPP MY03 is very good,never really doubted it.Now when you get the 2.5litre with twin scroll I'll be apologising profusely trying to get my name on the waiting list!!!

 

Group Hug

 

WOW Busy weekend....

Laughing @ Matt



Simon

 

Deep

If you car is running 1.25 bar at peak power, I would suggest you start saving for an engine rebuild because it won't last long at that!!!

Mike

 

That was a very short lived group hug.

 

Mike,

Deep didn't say 1.25 bar was at peak power. I took that to mean he will be running a peak boost of 1.25 (much like the PPP (well close )). I doubt he would be planning on running 1.25 at 7000rpm on a standard engine!!!

Matt

(Trying to keep the Group Hugging together )

 

1.25 br is too much for an STI7 engine ? How can some of these people be running 1.4 - 1.5 bar for 10 of thousands of miles with no problems ? And some are doing this with no uprated internals etc..

I would like to have this cleared up please.

Cheers,
Ray

 

Mike, it seems our research differs from yours but then I remembered you saying...

 

Mike,no not 1.25 bar at the redline! Only where its needed.No need to save for an engine rebuild(touches own wooden head) I have faith in my mapper.I won't be saving for a rebuild(touches wooden head again) even when the cars running 1.35 bar,AFRs of leaner than 11.1 to 1 and 375+ BHP.D'ont forget when we do such things we also spend £££ on other mods to make this feasible safely.My car will also ALWAYS run Optimax/OB,(decent)oil change every3k,everything monitored,low charge temps guaranteed.Due to the nature of some of your customers you c'ant assume such care so I presume you need to be more careful.Also my 375+ will not come cheap.Worst case scenario it does pop..just a good excuse to go internal!!
ps on my fourth Scoob so far with no bangs,hope my luck holds out!

 

Deep

That's a different matter then!!!

I had worked out from your comments that the car was running 1bar at peak power and was now at 1.25, hence you estimated it was giving 340bhp. As peak power will be at a minimum of 6000rpm, 1.25 bar would not be a good idea.

Pete
Are you suggesting that you run engines with this much boost at higher rpm?

Mike

 

Sod the group hug, that's boring, let's have a punch up instead

 

...but then the old farts would get a kicking Dave....

Having said that, I've met Simon and he's a lot bigger than I am (and I'm not talking girth )

Matt

P.S. It looks like the Group Hug is back on again

 

LOL

 

I'm with Dave.........bundle!
Mike yes I can see I was'nt very clear in my first post.

 

Hey Pete,

What is the rough boost you are running on the remapps with the STI-7 JDM in each gear vs. rpms. ? I think this will answer Mike's question as well.

I.E. Standard JDM STI-7 boost profile with ScoobySport full decat zorst:

From delta dash log

1st

3,700 rpms = 4.1 psi
4,400 rpms = 9.4 psi
5,400 rpms = 13.9 psi
6,500 rpms = 12.8 psi

changed up to 2nd gear (obviously way before 8,000 rpm red line but as one can see boost is well under a bar already)

4,800 rpms = 9.6 psi
5,300 rpms = 12.2 psi
5,700 rpms = 13.5 psi
6,300 rpms = 13.1 psi

changed up to 3rd gear (obviously way before 8,000 rpm red line but as one can see boost is well under a bar already)

3 rd gear is similar to above

4 th gear run from 2,000 rpms to 7,000 rpms was as follows:

2,500 rpms = 4.4 psi
3,000 rpms = 8.9 psi
3,500 rpms = 17.1 psi
4,000 rpms = 19 psi
4,500 rpms = 17 psi
5,000 rpms = 16.1 psi
5,500 rpms = 15.1 psi
6,000 rpms = 14.7 psi (1 bar)
6,500 rpms = 13.5 psi
7,000 rpms = 13.5 psi


So anything above 6,000 rpms and it is dropping to a bar and below.

Note 1 bar = 14.7 psi for those that need to do a conversion

Curious to see how the remmap matches up agains't these figures for boost.

Cheers,
Ray



[Edited by Razor2001 - 2/24/2003 4:25:22 PM]

 

bttt

 

bttt

 

Ray I'll try and check for you.Info will be off the Defis though not DD.

 

Hi Deep,

That would be excellent. I'll take whatever I can get

Cheers,
Ray

 

Correction.

1 Bar = 14.537 psi. EcuTek have it as 14.7 on their site, but it's a mistake.

[Edited by WREXY - 2/25/2003 3:35:01 PM]

 

Thanks Wrexy

Ray

 

If the strengthened internals of the STi 7 engines won't withstand 1.25 bar at 6000 RPM then how else are they supposed to make decent power?

What of all the UK 99/00 engines (with open deck block, lower quality rods and cast pistons) running around at this level of boost quite happily long term? I am not hearing of that many blowing up.... certainly it seems no more than completely standard engines.

I know that Prodrive have previously pointed out that we need to be careful with top end boost, obviously they know something we don't, but then why are we not all blowing engines up?

Of course it takes the removal of a lot of the OEM restricted breathing to achieve this safely, along with suitable turbos and intercoolers, but I don't see the issue.

 

JB,given the appropriate mods ie fmic/turbo/breathing whats the highest you would run the boost up top for a customer?

 

The highest I have run at 6000 RPM is 1.25 bar on a customer's car, but if someone had an STi 7 with a knock and boost monitoring, FMIC, fuel pump, the right turbo, suitable injectors, inlet pipe, uppipe and a good exhaust, running Optimax plus booster always or water, and they wanted to push things a bit with a calculated risk I would go up to 1.5 bar at 6000 RPM without lying awake at night worrying (assuming no issues arised and the engine was still happy). There are a lot of ifs in there, but as you point out this sort of customer is different from the turn key and never go under the bonnet type.

 

John took you long enough

I was thinking the same thing (and I don't know diddly ) Figured how can all the older engines be running above 1.25 bar and surving and my MY2001 STI7 JDM can't do it.

Cheers,
Ray

 

Would need to measure charge temperatures even with a FMIC in the Bahamas to make sure though, may need to run water as well or turn the boost lower.

 

JB 'I would go to 1.5 bar without lying awake at night'. I could always prescribe you something if you had problems!
Thanks,Deep.

 

I'd only need more and more every day though for the same effect, bit like power LOL.

 

Sheesh John stop skeeerin me.....its not 1000 degrees here you know

I told Pete to map it concervatively for 98 RON and hot, humid climate. If this means less boost then 1.25 bar at 6,000 rpms then so be it. I will leave it in his and Pat's hands

Cheers,
Ray