marty_t3

How the hell can you make an assumption like that about people you don't know?!?!?! I can put in a hard days labour just as must as the next guy. I used to help my grandfather out when he was working as a joiner and i can tell you right now, that i'd have an easier time working as a joiner than working in some of the IT jobs i've had. My grandfather was never particularly fit but he could do the job right until he retired at 65. It was not 'hard graft'.

The reason i decided to choose a career that was more 'thought' based than physical labour was because it paid more at the time... not because i'm scared of hard work or physical labour!!!

Dracoro

tittiecarcar - There's hard physical graft and there's hard mental graft. They're both tough in different ways. If you wish to generalise that i.t. people can't do hard physical work (some can some can't imo) then I'm sure we can generalise that all 'tradesmen' (your hubby included???) couldn't do anything mentally challenging at all. Try working out or formualting a complex mathmetical algoritm and coding that to an ever descreasing timeline else you get sh4t on or sacked.

I prefer mental graft (I have done the physical graft in my time, try a steel flange making factory & out in apple fields for 9 hours a day, 6 days a week in 40+ degree heat in israel for starters) to physical graft (yes I'm an i.t. bloke but can put my hands to many things) so I'm in i.t.(but no job at the mo!) and for me i.t. pays well fortunately but there's no job security so you can be out of work a lot.

I don't think anyone 'deserves' more money than the next person if they work hard (physical or mentally). Personally I think that my g/f should get paid far more than me (she's a doctor - worth far more than a joiner, builder, i.t boffin etc.) but that's not how things work. It's all down to supply and demand how much people get paid, simple. I say to anyone, if you're in the right trade/profession then all the best to ya. There are some who work hard for their money and some that don't & milk it in a cushy office job (we're probably all envious of these types tbh as we'd all like an easier life)

[Edited by Dracoro - 1/20/2003 12:36:57 AM]

tittiecarcar

my husband is a joinTer a joiner is a diffirent trade you dont even know what the trade is and your telling me you could do it . i see its ok for i.t boys to put down the likes of my husband for what they do and asume they can do the job so easily but you dont like it when you get the same treatment back . do you think he doesnt see people like you all the time who think that the building games an easy earner .its not long before their back in there office .no more than he could sit in an office all day doing your job, could you work out in the freezing cold with sh8ty little site agents on your back, saying how long all day.

even if you people had all the retraining in the world you could never make a living in the trade because you clearly cant do the hard graft it takes to get good at the jobs you have been trained for let alone what it takes to earn out in the building trade. if these people were any good they would be at the top of there game & earning as much as my husband not winging because some eles earns more than they do. in the builing trade you only get paid for what you do. that meens if you want to earn you have to work harder than the next guy

[Edited by tittiecarcar - 1/20/2003 9:24:44 AM]

Dracoro

hang on! you've obviously completely ignored or not read my thread before replying. I give up.

carl

Sounds just like IT, IMHO

vel boy

Hi

I am retraining. :-)

My IT contract finishes 07th Feb and I cannot wait

I am completey and utterly pi$$ed off with IT.

Taking a few months off for holidays (1 month in Banff Snowboarding yessss)

Then start May 1st.

Also I'm selling my March 02 MY02 WR Blue WRX anyone interested :-)



[Edited by vel boy - 1/20/2003 11:33:29 AM]

tittiecarcar

sorry dracoro if you thought i was replying to you it was ment for marty-t3

Dracoro

fair do's

marty_t3

vel boy,

I think i might do the same.... getting bored with this IT caper.

Think i might become a JoinTer, sounds like easy money to me How hard can drylineing be after all

Dracoro

as hard as it is to spell it

carl

None of it's exactly rocket science, is it?

logiclee

I'll think you'll find that the engineering, electronics, electrics, plc's, chemistry etc. behind a rocket is a lot more complicated than any IT involvement.

Lee

carl

I know -- I did it at university (but then fell into doing IT). It was a useful grounding because I now reckon I could do most jobs as none of them are as difficult as quantum mechanics, but there are some I just couldn't do (usually involving heights or cutting people up....)

marty_t3

Dracoco,

"drylineing" ... i know it doesn't even look right, but that how tittiecarcar wrote it. Didn't want to offend her anymore by pointing out her mistake

As for rocket science, some rockets (and even the first space shuttles IIRC) used multiple intel 8086 processors that were specially made to very high specs to with stand the rigours of launch/space. The code was written in 8086 assembler. Hardly rocket science is it.

carl

Lots of embedded systems run on 68k microprocessors, too. Software is either hand-coded assembler or Ada (military) or C (everything else) cross-compiled.

NotoriousREV

Let's all hear it for tittiecarcars husband, truly an unsung hero. Nobody on the planet can work as hard as him, an amazing man.

Just a couple of questions, though.

When he works overtime, does he get paid? At what rate?

Does he ever get called out overnight/during the weekend/over holidays? How much does he get paid then?

Has he ever worked more than 48 hours in one stretch with no sleep with customers on his back shouting, screaming and threatening to sue?

Personally, having had all sorts of jobs, from labourer to engineer to salesman amongst others, I can honestly say: I hate working for a living. Given the option to never work again but still have loads of money, you'd never see me for dust.

logiclee

So who had the biggest input then. The engineer that designed the robust 8086 processors, the technician who built them, the engineer who decided what function these processors should perform, the designer of the rocket.......

....or the IT bod who wrote a bit of code?

Lee

ps. have these sorts of discussions with our IT guys, most of whom specialise in one area, thats easy/boring IMO

carl

Certainly the IT bod's code often has the biggest consequences (e.g. first Ariane 5 flight failure, loss of several Mars probes)

BTW I'll put my stake in the ground and point out that I'm not a code monkey, and have also designed and built a payload for a sounding rocket

[Edited by carl - 1/20/2003 4:05:54 PM]

pslewis

TitieCarCar - not quite sure what your attack on me was for?? UNLESS Jye_0 is your husband?? Then you have my condolences

I have NEVER worked in IT - I use IT as we all do, and looking after it has been the place to be for a few years BUT I AM NO IT bod, OK??

Also, I have grafted in my time, physically - working down the pits, steelworks with Blast Furnaces, Black and Decker on the line, eventually - after 12 years training and college I ended up in the Nuclear Missile Design Arena, the LONG way round!!

So, dont come your high and mighty bullsh1t to me!!

A Jointer is a good trade and I am sure your hubby works very hard, smoky ****, reading the SUN, getting dribbly over page3 and generally shouting abuse at the skirt that walks by!!

Pete

logiclee

Was this because they were incompetent and got the code wrong.

They never did say who's fault it was when they got the metric / imperial measurements confused on the mars lander that smashed onto the surface.

Lee

scooby-new

55K sounds fair enough- personally I can't see how anyone could manage on that amount living in the London Area- gotta be at least 75K pa just to get a semi decent pad...........

Skilled manual work is the "new IT contracting"- the only people getting good hard cash for short term contracts I know are plumbers and other tradesman- I'm thinking about re-training in one of these areas 'cos all my old IT contracting buddies are either on the dole or worse have taken perm jobs for a fifth of the pay they used to get!