SwinYE5

Fair play Saxo Boy. I've done this myself a couple of times. I get very annoyed when people do what you experienced. If I'm in the queue patiently waiting (well not patiently because I'm not a patient person, but I never just steam down the other lane, it's just plain bad manners), then everyone else can queue as well. I'm not adding another few minutes on to my journey because of these inconsiderate @rseholes.

I congratulate you on a job well done!

LG John

Thats quite interesting. Where did you read/hear that and how does it work?

beemerboy

Saxo, you acted as a dork.
If i was behind you, you would still have the imprint of a 5 series up your 4rse!!!

there's NOTHING illegal about undertaking, if the outside lane is stationary!!

it's fools like you that cause tailbacks!!!!

hope this helps!!

BB

johnfelstead

Since when have road planners had a clue about making traffic flow? Typically in the area i live, they spent millions in the 80's widening the roads to make the runs into manchester 2 lane. The 90's they spent millions narrowing the same roads back down to one lane with gallons of paint to make life more dificult for motorists.

Road Planners must have diploma's in causing congestion.

And there is nothing personal to you in my posts SB, if it was someone else saying what you are saying i would say the same thing to them to. It's you that started the topic, so it's you i am talking to in reply, if thats what you mean by personal then fair enough, guilty as charged.

marty_t3

SB,

I must admit that i wouldn't do the same in that situation. However, I'd have been sitting along side you applauding your actions and i'd be the first one to let you back in when you had to merge.

I may be wrong but i believe the term used in the highway code (and on road signs at roadworks where a similar situation occurs) is "merge in turn" which to me, means "no overtaking stationary traffic up the inside lane then excpecting someone to let you in at the front when it's not your 'turn'".

V5

[Scouse voice]
Ok, calm down, calm down
[/Scouse voice]

I think we're in general agreement that once in our cars we don't drive as we should (and I do include myself in that one). If people want to sit in a queue then I don't think we'll change that, but those of us who do the "zipper" are going to continue, and risk the (IMHO undeserved) wrath/ire of those who don't.

Then, we can have a cuddle

TomM

Saxo - people are not having a pop at you personally matey, its just that everyone has been in that situation or seen it and look at the anger it causes when people are not even in thier cars!!

I have to be honest, I see your point but what you did would have caused me and you to fall out mate, Iam not a patient driver at all and Iam the first to admit it, I hate it but its true.

I respect your objective but what you did proved nothing and caused hightended anguish for motorists trying to get to work, all it takes is one little thing to kick off road rage, think about it, people have been stabbed for less!!

Its not your crusade and unfortuantly there isnt much we can do about it, the driving standards inthis country are appaling - no two ways about it and Iam the first to hold my hand up that I sometimes do daft things which Iknow are daft as soon as Ive done them.

I drive to work on the M3 / M25. When approachint the M25 in the morning people sit in the inside lane queing for miles!!, I kid you not, the queues go on forever, I sit in the middle lane and cut in at the last minute easily shaving 10-15 minutes of my journey, not quite the same I know but Iam trying to point out that people will not sit in one line of traffic when there is an empty one, regardless of how little distance they make.

I wouldnt do that again, really mate for your own safety. Turn the tunes up and let them get on with it.

[Edited by TomM - 10/18/2002 12:44:48 PM]

Andrew Dixon

Problem in this country is that we seem to love queuing up for things ... and it's the people queueing up way before the merge point who are creating the problem situation.

It's not for me to take it upon myself to 'force' other drivers to behave in a certain way. I find it easier to take a more philosophical view of things!

Andrew

Foot_Tapper

Good on ya SaxoBoy; it really pi$$es me off when ppl,
use the lane to "legitimately" jump traffic. And pi$$'s a lot
of ppl off by pushing their way in at the end.
I dont think you are holding up a lot of traffic, cos the stuff
in the other lane will go faster anyway.
Ive done it, and see lorries doin it all the time.
It just evens up the flow.
If they get road rage , tough. should've left 10 mins earlier.

Little Miss WRX

Would it not have been fairer to put "At times all drivers in the UK can ACT like w@nkers"??????
After all, not all of the nation drives do they?

LG John

Your right you know, they don't The problem is they are under pressure to slow people down because when we're doing 5mph we're not killing people - usually.

Beemerboy <personal mode on> I'd kindly remove your 5 series from my rear bumper and beat you around the head with whats left of my spoiler. I must admit I'm tempted to make a comment about your attitude relative to the marque of car you drive but I won't cause there are number of beemer drivers on SN that I like </personal mode>

How do you get that I acted foolishly??? I sat and contemplated the situation and then took what I felt was appropriate action. This may be wrong but not hot-headed or foolish.

Loved the scouse voice

Dream Weaver

I think there are a few points here.

Saxo - dont take offense, some are agreeing some not, and as you point out we dont really know that road so cant comment too much.

I think what everyone has moved on to *really* is how crap lane discipline and general driving is in this country.

When I used to do 40k miles + a year, I was a real one for queue jumping - Used to do it everywhere, but so did others on the "commute" run. Back then I drove a Rover, wore a suit and had a mobile which I used whilst driving (whoops). People labelled me as a sales rep, even though I just lived a long way from work.

I therefore started acting like one. My car was also a pile of crap, so I would do all the lane hopping, jumping etc, then when someone tried to block me I would go mad. I would also get far too close as i wasnt arsed about my car.

Anyway...whats my point.. cant remember now damn.

I think we are all just mad about UK driving standards now, nothing aimed at you personally. If we were educated to use all the lanes, be courtious, pull in when not using a lane etc etc these probs wouldn't happen.

Neil Smalley

Fluffy scoobynet experiment on..

Beemerboy/SB

Please flame in private. I hate the smell of charbroiled muppet.

Fluffy scoobynet experiment off..

LG John

Tom M said....

I said....

Tom has an M3...anyone see the link

Good thing your weren't there Tom I'd hate to fall out....don't know why but your muppet wit really agrees with me For example, the 2k of coke and hookers comment

Ok, I admit the subject title wasn't very PC but often I write the title in a way that attracts attention to get views and get the thread up and running. Maybe I should have just called it '****'

NDT

I can see the merits of both sides in this (ooh, fluffy)

I'm often tempted to do what SaxoBoy did, but normally resist the temptation, as it's not helpful - incidentally someone did this to me on the A1 in roadworks a couple of weeks ago, while I was in the 'fast' lane, wanting to move to where the roadworks were and then merge in turn, the car in fron decides to crawl along to stop me. Not helpful. Being a rational individual, I restricted my violence to language (contained within car) and imagination (contained within brain). I can see how this causes roadrage.

Another way of looking at this is that we need a few more people to take the left hand lane - that way a few of more of the people on the right hand lane might join in (say about half of them?) and then all they've got to do it learn to merge properly, and by accident we've achieved the European way of doing it.....

I apply the same thinking to heavy traffic on the motorway. After years of getting wound up by people undertaking', if I'm in heavy traffic on the motorway and the 'slow' lane is empty, I'll happily undertake people - at a reasonable (i.e. not excessive) speed. My thinking is that if more people did this then we might actually get to a stage where the correct lane discipline is used on the motorway - the left hand lane is the normal lane, the other two are overtaking lanes, not 'sitting waiting for the traffic to go faster' lanes

rant over.
/fluffy mode
I love you all.
/fluffy mode off

The Crushinator

They were on the A8 just before the Gyle roundabout this morning with a speed camera

Not that it bothered me, because i was doing the 40mph limit. All the usuall tossers doing 50-60 were getting busted at about 1 per second. Oh! how i laughed!

Suresh

Quote from JohnF: "The older i get, the more i want to move to Europe, they understand lane disipline/manners/co-operation there. "

Maybe on the 'ring they do . .
I get to experience the Dutch rush-hour daily and disagree quite strongly. Suggest that the grass on the otherside is not always as green as it appears. It seems to me that at least 50% of drivers do not use their indicators here and in the city, at least two cars will jump the lights when they change to red. In fact you have to be mindful of the car behind you rear-ending you if you actually want to remain inside the law and stop. And don't get me started about the fooking cyclists ..... [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]

On the otherhand, I saw a program about Nottingham on beeb one last night and am pretty glad that I live where I do!!

Suresh

LG John

Your right DW and that was the point of my post, to discuss the way our nation drives. I've got a message for all the undercutters, lanes hogs, etc....try and chill out. I too have let myself get angry on the roads (very rare for me) and have driven like a total nutter (anyone remember my thread the day after I got my scoob) but I find I don't get anywhere that much quicker but I'm way more stressed and uptight. Whatsmore, I'd then waste all the time I saved and more explaining how rover guy did this and BMW dude did that on the way to work!!! Had I just remained calm and driven normally and correctly I'd arrive happier and get stuck into my work straight away.

Stephen Read

Interesting one this....

IMO tailbacks are caused when a road reaches its 'capacity' and this governed by a number of factors: width, visibility, weather, speed limits etc.

To me it makes no difference if you merge at the last moment or at some arbitary point 100m back up the road. If the capacity of the raod has been reach then a taliback will follow.

If the tailback is 90 cars long then it doesn't make a big difference to me whether it is two equal queues of 45 cars, or a queue that has 30 cars at the front in single file and the remaining 60 cars side by side.

The queue might be physically longer but it won't take any longer to clear.

The point about 'cheeky' / highway code cognocenti carrying on up to the last point to merge is a question of culture and upbringing as much as the law. It is also about the insulating effect of being cocooned inside a metal boxe with the stereo up (with or without pimp-tints).

IMHO 'Bad drivers' are probably 'bad pedestrians' too.

ie. if I am in a hurry on the way to Boots, I may overtake and under take dawdling peds on the way up the High St. (pavement !) occasionally cutting them up and crashing into/rubbing shoulders with them.

However, once I get to the queue at the checkout I normally paitently wait my turn at the back of the queue and don't try to cut-in.

This is probably because I am A). Impatient but, B). British! and would hate to be subjected to the tutting and critical glares of disapproving co-queuees. Other nationalities may not be bothered.

The difference is that when you are in your car, your try your best not to touch anyone else but you are happy to sneak in here and there to gain an advantage because it's far easier to avoid the embarrasment of eye content or ear bashing than if you were in any other sort of queue.

Given that a section of road congestion takes a predetermined time to clear the people who carry on down the inside lane are at worst 'rude'.

They don't care that other people may have to wait slightly longer to get through the congestion.

Take my example with 90 cars. If it takes 90 seconds to get 90 cars through at point of restriction and MrRude turns up at the end of this line and undertakes everyone and sneaks in at the end the 89 drivers are delayed by 1 second. No big deal but I thinkg it qaulifies as rude behaviour

Dream Weaver

Oops - Unfortunately I am a serial undercutter. Not in a dangerous way, swerving about and driving like a loon, but on the motorway I like to make good progress, without too many hinderances.

If I come up behind a car doing 65-70mph in the fast lane, I will patiently wait for them to pull in, but if they haven't after a while, I slowly cruise down the left hand side, then pull back out when I have to overtake cars. Or if I am in the left lane, with no cars in front doing 75 ish, and someone is in the right lane doing 65ish I just carry on my way down the left hand side. Dont see why I should slow down just becasue they wont pull in.

Have to say though, as you get older you start not caring about it, though I still cant help having a go with Nova/Saxo boys No pun intended.

LG John

One of the funniest things I've seem was two cyclists in Amsterdam nail it round a 90 degree bend and collide at 20mph They were ok though

I should point out that nobody got angry or flashed, etc this morning. They saw me and qued up without complained. Towards the end of my stunt a few people qued behind me but showed no signs of visible rage, etc. Then an audi guy drove on the kerb but he again made no attempt to react to me...he just ignored me Had someone got all heated I'd probably move over cause I'd be too concerned about my car and more so about what I'd do to anyone that did anything to my car

TomM

You know what Saxo, I think you have a fair point there.

Iam sure if I drove normally like most others my journey to work would be much more relaxed with less w4nker signs being made and insults hurled. I occasionally just take the slow route and sit in the inside lane on the way home and it makes zero difference in time!

Iam thinking of getting the train to work just because IAm so agitated by the time I get into work!, **** it, maybe I will just quit work and me and Saxo Boy can start a school for **** drivers!!

Amanda-Jane

Wow!

Gone from Saxo Boy making a fair comment about todays drivers to personal insults, slagging off road planners and BMW drivers!

Come on folks, have you never once in your life been angered when patiently sitting in a queue of traffic and some idiot flies along the empty lane right up to the last minute? I for one ALWAYS block them as I have been waiting and don't see why they should just barge in !

I know we should sometimes just sit back and have a look at our our driving as we are not perfect, and that means everyone! <flame suit is now on>

Saxo Boy was making a fair comment and to be honest the women going onto the pavement does not surprise me at all, probably my sister and it is drivers like that who give women drivers a very bad name indeed.

AJ

106rallye

Ok what about this situation? Large queue of traffic wanting to go left at a rounabout and someone goes in the right lane (which is completely clear!) all the way round the roundabout? to the original left exit with the big queue.

What would anyone do? This gets on my nerves sometimes! but is quite clever

As to the original post I can see both sides really it depends what mood I am in! Though mounting the pavement is quite silly!!


Cheers

Andy

MarkO

Me too.

Funniest thing I saw was when a stream of cars had all very politely moved into the single lane well before the roadworks, and some idiot came up the inside expecting to dive in at the last minute. Every single car 'closed ranks' to stop him getting in, and I counted at least 30 cars go past him before I lost sight of him in my rear-view mirror.

TomM

Go round the roundabout and into the lane with all the traffic, I do it all the time in Frimley!!

Little Miss WRX

Likewise, I do the roundabout thing.

There are so many doddering old people in their small, round-about-town cars who sit and wait till it is clear for 5 miles around them in all directions before doddering off at 5 mph, possibly pushing the boat out and getting to 20mph if we are lucky.

LG John

LOL...what will we call it (this is where muppetisation begins)

DW I do the same if provoked long enough. I'll undertake if someone is doing less than 70mph and isn't overtaking anything at all - and has been doing so for quite some time >45 secs. I'll close in to an 'uncomfortable' distance but not dangerous and give a single flash of the lights. After a while longer of waiting I'll move to the inside lane and the accelerate quickly past (to reduce time exposed to danger - given that I'm in the wrong after all and any collision would be from my insurance). I've only had to do this twice in 3 months of scoob ownership and I drive the bypass every day so I'm not a weaver (no pun)

Actually, recently on the bypass this happened and a women in a micra was doing 50 in the outside lane with nothing in the inside lane for at least 300m in front of her. There was a few cars very close behind her then me. I again took it upon myself to act. I indicated into the slow lane and undertook the other cars to pull along side her. I peeped my horn and indicateded with my finger to the inside lane. I then dropped back into my original position in the outside lane. Sure enough she moved over and me and the other cars got passed <flame suit on>

Little Miss WRX

I have to admit, in that situation SB, the red mist descends on me

LG John

Yeah, thats a clever one and perfectly legal I think. I'll do it if I'm in a hurry and think it'll make a difference but I can't remember the last time I did. I've been known to do mini-launches onto roundabout to aid flow.....the joys of 4wd

What really worrys me is that I know sipie drives this route every morning and that he hasn't made any comment....its ok mate, your allowed to disagree with me