Is the EU falling apart?
26 April 2017, 08:14 AM
#31
The original Ampera solved that problem as they did do a real world 50miles on 'leccy and it had a far more efficient gearbox to make best use of motor and engine (no slushy/slippy CVT) ; it replaced the need for two cars situation where one needed one for the short journeys and another for long distances.
Some good lease offers on Teslas at the moment; a better reason to get a good US/UK trade agreement (plus I want to buy a tremec gearbox for my Jag, which by pure coincidence will make it better for the environment LOL)
26 April 2017, 10:42 AM
#33
If you read the articles I posted above, the UK is actively supporting the Chinese steel industry at the cost of our own. Energy subsidies may (although not certainly) break EU rules, but the UK is actually inflating energy prices, essentially penalising the steel and other industries as part of their environmental policies. In addition, the UK blocked higher tariffs for China as an anti-dumping mechanism further stressing the UK steel industry.
Its easy to just blame the EU for everything, but the reality is the UK is often a big part of the problem and the government/press try and cover their failings by blaming the EU and the public suck it up!
The reality is, the UK for the last 30 years or so, hasn't given two ***** about British manufacturing industry, preferring to promote the service sector instead. Germany and Italy's economies are heavily reliant on the manufacturing industry and their government rightly do everything they can to support them. Germany isn't providing energy subsidies to just the steel industry, they providing them to everyone, including the public, which is why its not clear that Germany is providing state aid against EU rules because its not benefiting a particular company/sector.
Its easy to just blame the EU for everything, but the reality is the UK is often a big part of the problem and the government/press try and cover their failings by blaming the EU and the public suck it up!
The reality is, the UK for the last 30 years or so, hasn't given two ***** about British manufacturing industry, preferring to promote the service sector instead. Germany and Italy's economies are heavily reliant on the manufacturing industry and their government rightly do everything they can to support them. Germany isn't providing energy subsidies to just the steel industry, they providing them to everyone, including the public, which is why its not clear that Germany is providing state aid against EU rules because its not benefiting a particular company/sector.
And without the EU, who would they blame? Blame would sit squarely where it belongs and they would soon be voted out. For too long has that edifice been a bully and something for idiots to hide behind. Glad it's on the way.
26 April 2017, 10:57 AM
#34
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We've been over this time and time again.
PLEASE explain to me the usefulness of a club where NO-ONE obeys the rules? Or only obeys those that suit them? Find me a "club" that involves big business/money that's any different.
And of what use is said club to a member who is the ONLY ONE obeying the rules? You said yourself that the French seem to have done very well from the EU (as have several other countries). You just have to play the game, something the UK governement hasn't done.
PLEASE explain to me the usefulness of a club where NO-ONE obeys the rules? Or only obeys those that suit them? Find me a "club" that involves big business/money that's any different.
And of what use is said club to a member who is the ONLY ONE obeying the rules? You said yourself that the French seem to have done very well from the EU (as have several other countries). You just have to play the game, something the UK governement hasn't done.
26 April 2017, 11:06 AM
#35
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I see all the farmers round your chateau voted Macron Jeff
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/F...rtement_T1.svg
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/F...rtement_T1.svg
26 April 2017, 12:49 PM
#36
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every country in the EU has a requirement for EU citizens coming to live and work to register in the destination country
in part not only to have a view of numbers involved but also so that their access to welfare/health can be controlled etc - as is provisioned for in the EU FOM directive
Oh - hold on there is one country that does not do this
any guesses who that might be?
in part not only to have a view of numbers involved but also so that their access to welfare/health can be controlled etc - as is provisioned for in the EU FOM directive
Oh - hold on there is one country that does not do this
any guesses who that might be?
26 April 2017, 02:52 PM
#37
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every country in the EU has a requirement for EU citizens coming to live and work to register in the destination country
in part not only to have a view of numbers involved but also so that their access to welfare/health can be controlled etc - as is provisioned for in the EU FOM directive
Oh - hold on there is one country that does not do this
any guesses who that might be?
in part not only to have a view of numbers involved but also so that their access to welfare/health can be controlled etc - as is provisioned for in the EU FOM directive
Oh - hold on there is one country that does not do this
any guesses who that might be?
26 April 2017, 05:22 PM
#38
We've been over this time and time again.
PLEASE explain to me the usefulness of a club where NO-ONE obeys the rules? Or only obeys those that suit them? Find me a "club" that involves big business/money that's any different.
And of what use is said club to a member who is the ONLY ONE obeying the rules? You said yourself that the French seem to have done very well from the EU (as have several other countries). You just have to play the game, something the UK governement hasn't done.
PLEASE explain to me the usefulness of a club where NO-ONE obeys the rules? Or only obeys those that suit them? Find me a "club" that involves big business/money that's any different.
And of what use is said club to a member who is the ONLY ONE obeying the rules? You said yourself that the French seem to have done very well from the EU (as have several other countries). You just have to play the game, something the UK governement hasn't done.
So you are saying it's OK to cheat the system, so long as everyone does it?
WTF???????
But if everyone is doing it, the system would break all the sooner.
It's one reason they have NEVER had their books signed off.
26 April 2017, 05:48 PM
#39
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Not quite. Yeah morally it's all varying levels of wrong but at the end of the day the system isn't changing anytime soon so you may as well make it work for you.
27 April 2017, 05:45 PM
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27 April 2017, 06:40 PM
#42
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https://infacts.org/mythbusts/auditors-havent-refused-sign-off-eu-accounts/
28 April 2017, 10:46 AM
#44
How many times are you going to keep peddling this rubbish. I must of told you a dozen times now it's not true, but you can't (or won't) stop repeating it
https://infacts.org/mythbusts/audito...f-eu-accounts/
https://infacts.org/mythbusts/audito...f-eu-accounts/
Did you read the bit that says there are errors? But not indictaive of fraud? LOL, and are there any fairies at the botttom of YOUR garden, Martin?
28 April 2017, 11:28 AM
#46
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Leaving aside your grammatical, (LOL), you quote from a site called "Stop Destructive Brexit", and we are meant to take them seriously?
Did you read the bit that says there are errors? But not indictaive of fraud? LOL, and are there any fairies at the botttom of YOUR garden, Martin?
Did you read the bit that says there are errors? But not indictaive of fraud? LOL, and are there any fairies at the botttom of YOUR garden, Martin?
Go check the facts for yourself then, and stop just posting up typical baseless anti-EU propaganda.
28 April 2017, 12:52 PM
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Has the EU budget NEVER been signed off?
You seem to believe so, yet the facts say otherwise, why not focus on that?
28 April 2017, 01:01 PM
#49
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28 April 2017, 04:23 PM
#50
NO business accounts would be allowed to be signed off "with errors"...as you well know. Nor would YOUR tax accounts. Or mine.
So, as far as MAKES SENSE, the accounts have never been ratified.
Still, if you believe that all is well, continue on your deluded way.
28 April 2017, 05:18 PM
#51
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Not properly. They are fudging it.
NO business accounts would be allowed to be signed off "with errors"...as you well know. Nor would YOUR tax accounts. Or mine.
So, as far as MAKES SENSE, the accounts have never been ratified.
Still, if you believe that all is well, continue on your deluded way.
NO business accounts would be allowed to be signed off "with errors"...as you well know. Nor would YOUR tax accounts. Or mine.
So, as far as MAKES SENSE, the accounts have never been ratified.
Still, if you believe that all is well, continue on your deluded way.
Ok I give up
You say what you like, and like what you say - I actually love your impenetrable logic and confidence in the world as you see it
28 April 2017, 09:26 PM
#52
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29 April 2017, 10:18 AM
#53
So yes, we all pay into the club, but everyone plays by the same rules, or suffers the consequences**. As it should be.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for the strong supporting the weak...as far as that goes, but quite why we are supporting the eastern Bloc countries when we cannot afford to pay for our own old people to have decent healthcare etc, is beyond me.....
**And please tell me what punishment has been meted out to Germany and Italy for their illegal (by EU rules and law) support of their state owned steel companies?
The answer, by the way, is "none".
29 April 2017, 12:47 PM
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Partly...but you arte forgetting that welfare cheats are pursued and punished.
So yes, we all pay into the club, but everyone plays by the same rules, or suffers the consequences**. As it should be.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for the strong supporting the weak...as far as that goes, but quite why we are supporting the eastern Bloc countries when we cannot afford to pay for our own old people to have decent healthcare etc, is beyond me.....
**And please tell me what punishment has been meted out to Germany and Italy for their illegal (by EU rules and law) support of their state owned steel companies?
The answer, by the way, is "none".
So yes, we all pay into the club, but everyone plays by the same rules, or suffers the consequences**. As it should be.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for the strong supporting the weak...as far as that goes, but quite why we are supporting the eastern Bloc countries when we cannot afford to pay for our own old people to have decent healthcare etc, is beyond me.....
**And please tell me what punishment has been meted out to Germany and Italy for their illegal (by EU rules and law) support of their state owned steel companies?
The answer, by the way, is "none".
29 April 2017, 01:54 PM
#56
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"If you have to insist that you've won an Internet argument, you've probably lost badly."
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Danth's_Law
29 April 2017, 10:59 PM
#57
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Not from where I'm sitting in the EU!
If anything Brexit has made people think about the real value the EU has given them and strengthens their belief in the EU.
Its no accident that the in re-run of the Austria election post Brexit, the far right anti EU candidate lost by bigger margin. In Holland, Girt Wilders was less successful than the polls had suggested and now in France, Le Pen has also lost ground coming second to the most Pro-EU Liberal candidate.
The right wing British press paints a very skewed picture of the reality in Europe, sensationalising the Anti-EU feelings. Yes there are some Anti-EU sentiments out there, particularly since the immigrant 'crisis', but the vast majority in Europe have more freely embraced the EU and realise the benefits and since the Brexit vote the sentiments are dying as the people realise which side their bread is buttered.
The EU is everywhere in mainland Europe, the civic buildings all fly the EU flag along with national and regional flags, we have Euro coins and notes in our pockets and people pass freely across borders spending the same currencies and like it! The UK has never really tried to embrace the EU or to really integrate.
If anything Brexit has made people think about the real value the EU has given them and strengthens their belief in the EU.
Its no accident that the in re-run of the Austria election post Brexit, the far right anti EU candidate lost by bigger margin. In Holland, Girt Wilders was less successful than the polls had suggested and now in France, Le Pen has also lost ground coming second to the most Pro-EU Liberal candidate.
The right wing British press paints a very skewed picture of the reality in Europe, sensationalising the Anti-EU feelings. Yes there are some Anti-EU sentiments out there, particularly since the immigrant 'crisis', but the vast majority in Europe have more freely embraced the EU and realise the benefits and since the Brexit vote the sentiments are dying as the people realise which side their bread is buttered.
The EU is everywhere in mainland Europe, the civic buildings all fly the EU flag along with national and regional flags, we have Euro coins and notes in our pockets and people pass freely across borders spending the same currencies and like it! The UK has never really tried to embrace the EU or to really integrate.
This post is utterly hilarious! Are you actually Jean Claude Juncker himself?! Anti-EU sentiment across Europe is close to all time highs and you're making out everyone is walking around proudly waving the EU flag!
Lets look at the horrific facts;
France - 10% unemployment, and close to 25% youth unemployment
Greece - 25% unemployment and almost 50% youth unemployment
Spain - 20% unemployment and over 40% youth unemployment
Italy - 12% unemployment and 45% youth unemployment
These figures are utterly shocking, and look at what this is resulting in - Spain has just topped 40% of children living poverty.
Even worse for Greece;
Eurostat data showing 22.2 percent of the population were "severely materially deprived" in 2015.
These countries are being forced to use the Euro currency which is far too strong for their economies. Result? Their economies have been absolutely destroyed. Greece's economy is still 25% smaller than before the financial crisis, Spains is still smaller and Italy's is almost 8% smaller.
Who is the winner from all this? Germany. They get to use a currency which is much weaker than the Deutschmark would be, so as a result their export driven manufacturing based economy is thriving, with unemployment under 4%.
The next financial crisis will quite possibly be triggered when Italy's banks collapse, as a result of non-performing loans. 18% of loans are non-performing, amounting to something like 360bn euros. Again the root cause is the Euro currency. By comparison in the UK only 1.5% of loans are non-performing.
So to the topic starter, yes the EU is falling apart and it's already beyond the point of no return, unless you're reading cherry picked stats from some BS Guardian article of course
On the positive side, once the dust has settled after the collapse, Southern European economies will be unleashed once they return to their own currencies and will see some very rapid economic growth once freed from the shackles of the EU.
Last edited by Petem95; 29 April 2017 at 11:05 PM.
29 April 2017, 11:24 PM
#58
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Taken as whole eu unemployment is a couple percent above developed nations average ,
but lets not take away from the german take over theme
but lets not take away from the german take over theme
Last edited by dpb; 30 April 2017 at 09:22 AM.
29 April 2017, 11:33 PM
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So you're not too bothered that the Southern European countries are suffering from massive unemployment and deprivation then?? Can understand you probably didn't read about that in the Guardian as they probably consider it 'fake news' as it doesn't meet their agenda
30 April 2017, 12:39 AM
#60
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This post is utterly hilarious! Are you actually Jean Claude Juncker himself?! Anti-EU sentiment across Europe is close to all time highs and you're making out everyone is walking around proudly waving the EU flag!
Lets look at the horrific facts;
France - 10% unemployment, and close to 25% youth unemployment
Greece - 25% unemployment and almost 50% youth unemployment
Spain - 20% unemployment and over 40% youth unemployment
Italy - 12% unemployment and 45% youth unemployment
These figures are utterly shocking, and look at what this is resulting in - Spain has just topped 40% of children living poverty.
Even worse for Greece;
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu...-idUSKBN15Z1NM
These countries are being forced to use the Euro currency which is far too strong for their economies. Result? Their economies have been absolutely destroyed. Greece's economy is still 25% smaller than before the financial crisis, Spains is still smaller and Italy's is almost 8% smaller.
Who is the winner from all this? Germany. They get to use a currency which is much weaker than the Deutschmark would be, so as a result their export driven manufacturing based economy is thriving, with unemployment under 4%.
The next financial crisis will quite possibly be triggered when Italy's banks collapse, as a result of non-performing loans. 18% of loans are non-performing, amounting to something like 360bn euros. Again the root cause is the Euro currency. By comparison in the UK only 1.5% of loans are non-performing.
So to the topic starter, yes the EU is falling apart and it's already beyond the point of no return, unless you're reading cherry picked stats from some BS Guardian article of course
On the positive side, once the dust has settled after the collapse, Southern European economies will be unleashed once they return to their own currencies and will see some very rapid economic growth once freed from the shackles of the EU.
http://www.cpag.org.uk/child-poverty-facts-and-figures
There were 3.9 million children living in poverty in the UK in 2014-15. That’s 28 per cent of children, or 9 in a classroom of 30.1
we are catching up