john banks

Enjoyed that, thanks.

hodgy0_2

sure, I get that, although I dont think you have understood the points made in the video

try this one

hodgy0_2

and this IS a thread about the existence of a God, that is the claim!!!!!! - unless I have got something very wrong!!!

dpb

We all need something to cling onto in times of stress , shouldn't demonize jt for this

JTaylor

He's at the bottom of the glass; some of you seem to have stopped supping three quarters of the way down.

hodgy0_2

I never seem to get there

I pour half out,

then I pour half of the remaining amount out,

which leaves me with an amount that I pour precisely half out

that amount is then poured out to leave 50% remaining

<loop to top>

JTaylor

Well if you've the hang of infinity you must be on to something.

brendy76

iTrader: (6)

Explained better than I could convey., cheers fella.

hodgy0_2

it's "turtles all the way down" JT

JTaylor

Geezer

But, nowhere in the Bible does it actually distinguish what is moral law and what is not. Again, it is interpretation. So it's easy to say Jesus allowed us to do all sorts of things, but in reality, you can interpret it whatever way you want.


But, whatever floats your boat. If you were killing people for your beliefs, you'd be beneath contempt, but to the best of my knowledge you seem like a decent bloke who just happens to have strong views.

Turbohot

LOL!

Torquemada

Aaaanyway.

No proof that one religion is more true than another's. Zeus totally rocks my world.

No proof that religion does or does not exist.

No proof that Hera wont smite all you *******.

No proof that the ancient earth gods won't rise up against you avec the GreenPeace crew.

No proof of anything supernatural - which is a core of the topic we center on, essentially.

We could argue forever, and the persons who rely on science and fact will never agree with those who believe in 'god' 'fairies' 'jebus' 'santa' 'the easter bunny' 'the green man' mother earth' 'athena' or any other thing that makes them feel better about themselves or worse about others.

I was told by a lady in Dallas that I was going to hell as I was not a believer. Guess what? It didn't matter as I don't believe in hell either. However, I could say that her judgement was wholly unchristian as she went on to tell me that she hated her 'retard' son whom she would have preferred to see dead until he (at the age of 8 months - oh and he was Downs Syndrome, that's all) turned and spoke to her in a beam of light and gave her the lords word which reaffirmed her faith and helped her love her 'retard' child. What a piece of ****. Love your child, whatever. You will tell me she is not in the majority, but her attitude against the minorities is typical. How dare your religions be so arrogant and judgmental. For example , go on, tell me a Gay man should go to hell. Well maybe you just shouldn't be here if you cannot accept your fellow man.

back to the story, what the actual f*ck was that about, I thought. She can be a horrible human being, because she believes in god.....this is widespread among the christian community, here and in the UK and farther afield. I know this through being brought up strictly catholic in Irish, Scottish and English communities. Plus a tonne of time with Church of England peeps and Evangelists. All have a varied level of nastiness in the name of god as do atheists and the rest, of course. However i have never met such self righteousness as from those within the religious community.

Quoting biblical phrases and the like means nothing, it is not a source of historic nor any other fact (seriously stop saying that) nor is it anything that a rational human would base an argument on.

Can someone please say something that makes some ****ing sense...

Love you, bye

neil-h

These arguments rely on the fact we actually know what we're talking about. You look back at Science through the ages and different theories have come and gone, proven and disproven. We can sit and argue the toss all day long but there's too much we don't understand about the universe to definitively prove either way.

dpb

She sounds unfit mother tbh

JTaylor

I don't want to repeat myself as I laid out my case in the link. In a nutshell it's about the Law versus grace.


I'm a wretch who's received grace.

Turbohot

There're some truly horrible God fearing people and their crimes on humanity will never lead them to any heaven. This masked performance is not limited to any specific religion, it's found in all of them.

Then there're some truly wonderful non- believers who will end up in heaven because their actions are kind to other humans.

Don't ask me where that heaven is. To be honest with you, I do not know its post code.

hodgy0_2

lol, and that's exactly the point

science changes as a result of a better theory/evidence - religion does not, that is the point!!!!!!!!!!!!!

yes, we used to think Dinosaurs were Lizards, we now know they are related to birds

and that goes for Earthquakes, Volcanic eruptions - now known to be the result of Tectonic plates (this was only discovered in the middle of last century)

but sure, you can believe in "God of the Gaps, the problem with this is "theory" is that throughout the ages those gaps get smaller and smaller

recently we have discovered organic material (not life) on Mars

recently we have discovered bacteria and other organisms living happily on the outside od the space station

science changes to fit the best evidence, religion and the supernatual does not

JTaylor

Rather than gaps in scientific knowledge being taken to be evidence or proof of God's existence, how about gaps in our knowledge of God being evidence for the existence of science?

Torquemada

So, it really is not about your religious or non religious views. You're just in you're own little sphere....

You people are actually the proof of inbred internet idiocy. It's insane.

I'm out.... fuqktards...<drops mic>

hodgy0_2

yeah, the argument from authority

you really need to watch (and understand) the burden of proof video
I posted

it's all in there

JTaylor

I understand it. I used to post similar when I was a fundamental anti-theist.

hodgy0_2

and before you simply dismiss it has "closed mindedness"

see this link - all explained why you would be 180 deg out

hodgy0_2

yeah, this is sort of where we came in

now your a fundamentalist theist

as explained in the above video - Fundamentalist beliefs are the problem

daviee

Can I put a different slant on it ?, do you think the bible / religion was a tool to control the masses, ie god fearing to do wrong ?. A bit like the law of the land and police state, but if there was no god / law police, it would be anarchy. And if push came to shove the masses could over throw at anytime if they lost belief in both ?.

JTaylor

Neither of us are agnostic, Hodgy.

Turbohot

This slant has been stated by many over and over on SN and outside SN for years; on global level. When the religious control seemed too much and too irrational to handle, then some humans had a collective epiphemy. It wasn't that, actually. In fact, they always knew that all in the books wasn't something to blindly follow, but they just didn't have sufficient guts to reject all that. Anyway, when they did grow their guts, they confidently realised that they also had a very unique tool called wisdom, which could lead them to upkeep this society as a society than a chaos, with the wisdom generated humanistic rules and regulations without planting any God into it. That's the reason why some, even without God know that it's not good to hurt someone because if someone hurts them, they won't like that, would they. Simple logic makes sense to some and they get on with it without any God. Moral code doesn't need to come out of any religion for them. They're good people. They have a God called their own wisdom which they firmly believe in. Now who gave them this in-built tool called wisdom at first place? I honestly do not know. I'd rather not make a diety up responsible for that, as I can't logically carry the burden of proof for that. Could be just some amaeba's internals going frantic, and the result was a complex human with astonishing ability to regulate self and others. I really do not know.

Saying all that, if anyone finds God or Godly books as their tool to help regulate themselves, let them get on with it as long as they do not cause a serious harm to self or to others. They must have their reasons for recognising religious books as their guides, may they be any.

JTaylor

Turbohot

Or, it's quite possible that what does exist that caused the universe can be named as God.

Also, Einstein looks just like my left next door neighbour called Mr. E.

markjmd

iTrader: (11)

It could have been about control to an extent, but you shouldn't overlook the simple fact that as with any organized movement of people even today, one of its major purposes would have been to unite people.