Should we take on more assylum seekers
03 September 2015, 12:08 AM
#181
What crimes? Nicking food 'cos they are starving? And where would you suggest they are deported to - Syria?
Someone suggested that the UN establish a small state in a suitable part of Africa where they can live until the ME is sorted, if that ever happens. A tricky logistical problem and a huge amount of support would be required but something as radical as this is needed.
Never forget that there but for the grace of God...... It could be me or one of you.
dl
Someone suggested that the UN establish a small state in a suitable part of Africa where they can live until the ME is sorted, if that ever happens. A tricky logistical problem and a huge amount of support would be required but something as radical as this is needed.
Never forget that there but for the grace of God...... It could be me or one of you.
dl
It is self evident, if you have any compassion and empathy at all, that it is right to help people who are in desperate need, and ASYLUM SEEKERS are obviously in great need. If I'm honest, I don't really understand why this is being debated at all, tbh.
If I was in e.g. Syria myself, I'd get the hell out of there as quickly as possible with my family as well, if I had the means. Either by walking to somewhere else (and let's not forget, this carries a lot of risks on its own), by sea or by plane or any other means available.
madscoob, you point out that the people who get to calais etc have paid a lot of money to get there. This is true, but it's also a self selecting set, as if you didn't have any money you couldn't possibly get there, i.e. everyone who has got to Calais has (at least at some point) had enough money to make that journey.
03 September 2015, 12:16 AM
#182
According to Oxford University's research, in 2014:
* The UK received 5% of all asylum applications to the EU + Norway + Switzerland
* The total number of applications received in the UK was 24,914.
* 59% of asylum applications were initially refused. A majority of refused applicants lodge appeals. In 2014, 28% of appeals were allowed.
From the above, I conclude that there were 10215 successful applications (initial applications), and 14699 failed applications. Of the failed applications, 4116 were allowed under appeal. I.e. a total of 14331 applications were successful in total.
14331 asylum seekers with successful applications. Doesn't sound like an awful lot to me, tbh.
Source: http://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk...tion-uk-asylum
* The UK received 5% of all asylum applications to the EU + Norway + Switzerland
* The total number of applications received in the UK was 24,914.
* 59% of asylum applications were initially refused. A majority of refused applicants lodge appeals. In 2014, 28% of appeals were allowed.
From the above, I conclude that there were 10215 successful applications (initial applications), and 14699 failed applications. Of the failed applications, 4116 were allowed under appeal. I.e. a total of 14331 applications were successful in total.
14331 asylum seekers with successful applications. Doesn't sound like an awful lot to me, tbh.
Source: http://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk...tion-uk-asylum
03 September 2015, 03:45 AM
#183
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's joke man, the way people spout on about it its like we're overun with them em - fundamentally altering our values / quality of life
03 September 2015, 08:16 AM
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03 September 2015, 10:25 AM
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Clearly those fleeing Syria are genuine refugees and their plight can't be ignored, but surely even you have to admit a significant proportion of the migrants coming to Europe are essentially classed as 'economic migrants'?
Europe is sending out the signal that if you get into Europe through whatever means, you're granted residency. With an almost infinite amount of people in developing countries with booming populations able to see this, and improve their standard of living by getting to the EU, then of course more and more will come. Do you honestly not see any issues here?
Sadly Europe is facing an almost perfect storm right now. Almost all EU countries are deeply in debt, and borrowing vast sums to continue with their unsustainable welfare services which were already overstretched before migration levels started to skyrocket. Economic outputs are stagnant at best despite years of quantitative easing, near zero interest rates. Unemployment rates are high to very high, especially youth unemployment rates in countries like Spain, Italy and Greece all with 25-45%. Vast numbers of extra people is going to create even more pressure on overstretched services, increased competition for jobs, school places, healthcare, housing. Social unrest is almost a certainty.
I don't know what the solution to this situation, but it's clearly unprecedented and is certain to have profound implications on the future of many European countries.
Europe is sending out the signal that if you get into Europe through whatever means, you're granted residency. With an almost infinite amount of people in developing countries with booming populations able to see this, and improve their standard of living by getting to the EU, then of course more and more will come. Do you honestly not see any issues here?
Sadly Europe is facing an almost perfect storm right now. Almost all EU countries are deeply in debt, and borrowing vast sums to continue with their unsustainable welfare services which were already overstretched before migration levels started to skyrocket. Economic outputs are stagnant at best despite years of quantitative easing, near zero interest rates. Unemployment rates are high to very high, especially youth unemployment rates in countries like Spain, Italy and Greece all with 25-45%. Vast numbers of extra people is going to create even more pressure on overstretched services, increased competition for jobs, school places, healthcare, housing. Social unrest is almost a certainty.
I don't know what the solution to this situation, but it's clearly unprecedented and is certain to have profound implications on the future of many European countries.
The solution to this is a long term commitment to develop these countries’ economies and infrastructure. This will be expensive and no doubt unpopular, but I cannot see another way.
03 September 2015, 10:39 AM
#187
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http://news.sky.com/story/1545899/mi...-station-opens
So just what is the answer to stopping this level of migration? The military? Then what shoot those who don't obey?
I've always been against taking in more migrants because of the pressures already on the UK's public services/housing/benefit system but what do you do when it gets to the level it is now across Europe?
The picture of that small child in that news report makes me sad, to see children having to suffer the way they are is unacceptable (not to mention the recent pics of dead children washed up on beaches) and this isn't just a European problem this is a global issue that needs to be tackled as how bad is going to get if left to continue?
Personally I am having to rethink my attitude because the more I see children suffering and being put at risk because of the migrant issue and the extreme lengths people will go to the more I struggle to understand how the civilized world sits back and does nothing.
So just what is the answer to stopping this level of migration? The military? Then what shoot those who don't obey?
I've always been against taking in more migrants because of the pressures already on the UK's public services/housing/benefit system but what do you do when it gets to the level it is now across Europe?
The picture of that small child in that news report makes me sad, to see children having to suffer the way they are is unacceptable (not to mention the recent pics of dead children washed up on beaches) and this isn't just a European problem this is a global issue that needs to be tackled as how bad is going to get if left to continue?
Personally I am having to rethink my attitude because the more I see children suffering and being put at risk because of the migrant issue and the extreme lengths people will go to the more I struggle to understand how the civilized world sits back and does nothing.
03 September 2015, 11:06 AM
#188
I, too, am rethinking.
I now want anyone who puts the lives of children at risk by illegally emigrating, prosecuted and jailed for life.
These are economic migrants. They aren't asylum seekers...or if they are, they are breaking asylum laws.
They have paid, probably large sums of money to board the boats and rafts. They have money for train tickets across Europe...but still they want more.
Get them gone. We neither need, nor want them, we've enough Eastern European miggers to last us, thanks.
I now want anyone who puts the lives of children at risk by illegally emigrating, prosecuted and jailed for life.
These are economic migrants. They aren't asylum seekers...or if they are, they are breaking asylum laws.
They have paid, probably large sums of money to board the boats and rafts. They have money for train tickets across Europe...but still they want more.
Get them gone. We neither need, nor want them, we've enough Eastern European miggers to last us, thanks.
03 September 2015, 11:08 AM
#189
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I, too, am rethinking.
I now want anyone who puts the lives of children at risk by illegally emigrating, prosecuted and jailed for life.
These are economic migrants. They aren't asylum seekers...or if they are, they are breaking asylum laws.
They have paid, probably large sums of money to board the boats and rafts. They have money for train tickets across Europe...but still they want more.
Get them gone. We neither need, nor want them, we've enough Eastern European miggers to last us, thanks.
I now want anyone who puts the lives of children at risk by illegally emigrating, prosecuted and jailed for life.
These are economic migrants. They aren't asylum seekers...or if they are, they are breaking asylum laws.
They have paid, probably large sums of money to board the boats and rafts. They have money for train tickets across Europe...but still they want more.
Get them gone. We neither need, nor want them, we've enough Eastern European miggers to last us, thanks.
03 September 2015, 11:33 AM
#191
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This crisis was entirely predictable. The rich world has basically ignored the plight of the poor world for decades. This is the consequence, people want to live better lives, and the opportunity to do that in their own country often doesn’t exist.
The solution to this is a long term commitment to develop these countries’ economies and infrastructure. This will be expensive and no doubt unpopular, but I cannot see another way.
The solution to this is a long term commitment to develop these countries’ economies and infrastructure. This will be expensive and no doubt unpopular, but I cannot see another way.
03 September 2015, 11:37 AM
#192
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I, too, am rethinking.
I now want anyone who puts the lives of children at risk by illegally emigrating, prosecuted and jailed for life.
These are economic migrants. They aren't asylum seekers...or if they are, they are breaking asylum laws.
They have paid, probably large sums of money to board the boats and rafts. They have money for train tickets across Europe...but still they want more.
Get them gone. We neither need, nor want them, we've enough Eastern European miggers to last us, thanks.
I now want anyone who puts the lives of children at risk by illegally emigrating, prosecuted and jailed for life.
These are economic migrants. They aren't asylum seekers...or if they are, they are breaking asylum laws.
They have paid, probably large sums of money to board the boats and rafts. They have money for train tickets across Europe...but still they want more.
Get them gone. We neither need, nor want them, we've enough Eastern European miggers to last us, thanks.
Last edited by JTaylor; 03 September 2015 at 11:44 AM.
03 September 2015, 12:12 PM
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03 September 2015, 12:33 PM
#196
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not sure why that image would change anything, its been going on for months and will carry on, 13 deaths is a quiet day by comparison to some. Another media storm that will diaspear within a couple of weeks.
What was the name of that lion again? no one give a crap about that any more.
I'm not saying they shouldn't be reported on, what im saying is people only give a toss when its fashionable to.
What was the name of that lion again? no one give a crap about that any more.
I'm not saying they shouldn't be reported on, what im saying is people only give a toss when its fashionable to.
03 September 2015, 01:16 PM
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not sure why that image would change anything, its been going on for months and will carry on, 13 deaths is a quiet day by comparison to some. Another media storm that will diaspear within a couple of weeks.
What was the name of that lion again? no one give a crap about that any more.
I'm not saying they shouldn't be reported on, what im saying is people only give a toss when its fashionable to.
What was the name of that lion again? no one give a crap about that any more.
I'm not saying they shouldn't be reported on, what im saying is people only give a toss when its fashionable to.
03 September 2015, 01:19 PM
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03 September 2015, 01:26 PM
#202
Anon: Keep posting filth, it shows who, and what, you are.
J-Taylor: I don't need to reflect. I know exactly what and who they are. But they have no right to take their better life off others in this country. get them gone.
And as for that photo, let's prosecute the parents, ten years inside ought to deter a few.
J-Taylor: I don't need to reflect. I know exactly what and who they are. But they have no right to take their better life off others in this country. get them gone.
And as for that photo, let's prosecute the parents, ten years inside ought to deter a few.
03 September 2015, 01:32 PM
#203
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It reminds me of the picture of dead babies from the sinking of the Lusitania during the First World War. It's haunting and tragic in the extreme, and was one reason why the Yanks signed up.
There is no answer to this one, and hand wringing isn't going to count for anything. Until the source of the Syrian mess is dealt with, (so called IS v Assad, who both need a kicking) we're going to be seeing more of the same. PLUS of course all the others from all over Africa, who may have "refugee" status or not.
It would have been easier to accept the 10,000 figure that's been bandied about if we hadn't already had the 300,000 who sneaked in while we weren't looking due to slack EU rules last year.
If I were in charge, I'd want to close our borders to any more uncontrolled EU migration before I offered to take any refugees on a permanent basis.
There is no answer to this one, and hand wringing isn't going to count for anything. Until the source of the Syrian mess is dealt with, (so called IS v Assad, who both need a kicking) we're going to be seeing more of the same. PLUS of course all the others from all over Africa, who may have "refugee" status or not.
It would have been easier to accept the 10,000 figure that's been bandied about if we hadn't already had the 300,000 who sneaked in while we weren't looking due to slack EU rules last year.
If I were in charge, I'd want to close our borders to any more uncontrolled EU migration before I offered to take any refugees on a permanent basis.
03 September 2015, 01:37 PM
#204
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Anon: Keep posting filth, it shows who, and what, you are.
J-Taylor: I don't need to reflect. I know exactly what and who they are. But they have no right to take their better life off others in this country. get them gone.
And as for that photo, let's prosecute the parents, ten years inside ought to deter a few.
J-Taylor: I don't need to reflect. I know exactly what and who they are. But they have no right to take their better life off others in this country. get them gone.
And as for that photo, let's prosecute the parents, ten years inside ought to deter a few.
03 September 2015, 01:40 PM
#205
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I find what you post is filth. And for the record the 3 year old's 5 year old brother and his mother also drowned. You clearly lack any understanding of how bad these people's lives in their place of origin must be to risk everything. Has it not sunk in they risk death because if they were to stay in Syria or Iraq they would be killed by ISIS or Assad's forces and so have no choice? That little boy and his family had fled a town in Syria recently taken by ISIS. I would have done the same in those circumstances.
Last edited by JTaylor; 03 September 2015 at 02:09 PM.
03 September 2015, 01:41 PM
#206
This crisis was entirely predictable. The rich world has basically ignored the plight of the poor world for decades. This is the consequence, people want to live better lives, and the opportunity to do that in their own country often doesn’t exist.
The solution to this is a long term commitment to develop these countries’ economies and infrastructure. This will be expensive and no doubt unpopular, but I cannot see another way.
The solution to this is a long term commitment to develop these countries’ economies and infrastructure. This will be expensive and no doubt unpopular, but I cannot see another way.
Just to play Devil's advocate here for a minute, supposing I was a young guy with a family living in a relatively impoverished part of the UK. I decide to up sticks one morning, abandon all of my wordly possessions except for what I can carry on my back, and walk or a catch a bus down to London or some other borough in the South-East, because I think I have a better chance of making a good living there. How much help do you think I should be entitled to from the local authorities of the area I've just moved to?
03 September 2015, 01:47 PM
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Anon: Keep posting filth, it shows who, and what, you are.
J-Taylor: I don't need to reflect. I know exactly what and who they are. But they have no right to take their better life off others in this country. get them gone.
And as for that photo, let's prosecute the parents, ten years inside ought to deter a few.
J-Taylor: I don't need to reflect. I know exactly what and who they are. But they have no right to take their better life off others in this country. get them gone.
And as for that photo, let's prosecute the parents, ten years inside ought to deter a few.
There but for the grace of God go I.
03 September 2015, 01:52 PM
#209
Playing Devil's advocate again, how many million migrants of any description do you think it would be sustainable for Europe to assimilate, if you even think there's a limit to this number at all? If not, what happens to all those places eventually left completely depopulated by everyone leaving them to come and live here?
03 September 2015, 01:55 PM
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Just to play Devil's advocate here for a minute, supposing I was a young guy with a family living in a relatively impoverished part of the UK. I decide to up sticks one morning, abandon all of my wordly possessions except for what I can carry on my back, and walk or a catch a bus down to London or some other borough in the South-East, because I think I have a better chance of making a good living there. How much help do you think I should be entitled to from the local authorities of the area I've just moved to?