Felix.

Right, well investigation includes interviews of the parents under a caution with legal representation available for them. As i said a number of times, this is all now being done under Spanish law which will differ from UK.

The UK can have voluntary interviews not under arrest whilst the child is placed into a period of safety whilst the investigation is completed.

Felix.

Have i said i lock everyone up?

Have i not said that in the UK this will have been done differently?

I just don't simply assume that the child will always be fine because he is with his parents. I just think it will need investigating especially after medical advice is that the child should not have been removed in the way he was. This would give concerns as to the welfare of the child.

And is it not the first key point of the police - preservation of life

hodgy0_2

it was all done in the UK

Blue by You

iTrader: (23)

I am aware of the law as it stands. However a European arrest warrant was requested by Hampshire Police. Therefore the application of Spanish law does not apply.
The Kings' arrest is down to the heavy handed actions of the British police.

Felix.

Yes i do have children; and i doubt that the 30 or so professionals looking after him were deliberately giving him excess levels of chemo and put him at risk unless there was a medical necessity for this. What are the parents expertise on treatments for this other than them looking things up on the net - compared to the 30 or so professionals medical training and experience. Do we just ignore their opinions on the matter?

The child being placed into protective police custody enables him to be immediately returned to hospital

Yes, or course they were in their rights to remove their child from the hospital if no court order was in place. But this should have been done by due process (signing him out of their care) as apposed to just leaving (fled) the hospital with him.

I don't understand where you see 'oppression' being exhibited where child safety is in question? The parents do have freedom of choice, but where do you draw the line. If (for example) the parents chose to take the child out of the hospital and allow him to die peacefully at home, do you want the authorities to respect their choice or step in safeguard the child's life. At what point do you want the authorities to have a voice for the child? In this case, nobody really knew 100% what the parents intentions were when they left - hence the hospitals concern and the subsequent missing from home inquiry and welfare/neglect investigation.

Felix.

But they left the UK to an unknown destination - hence the European arrest warrant.
Arrested in Spain which is where their laws kick in

Felix.

However they were arrested in Spain - hence the place of arrest is where their laws kick in

hodgy0_2

you clearly do not understand how the European Arrest Warrant works

Blue by You

iTrader: (23)

Are you a copper Felix?
You plainly don't see any alternative way to handle this situation apart from throw the 'offenders' into jail at the first opportunity, and clearly missing the original point of my first post.
Answer me this. Are you happy that they have been arrested?
If not then you must agree with my first post wherein I made no differentiation between the police forces involved. This is not about British v Spanish law.
It is about the heavy handed application of the law by the police.

jonc

I think in this case, the Hampshire Police misused the European Arrest Warrant. The warrant is intended only to be issued with the aim of enforcing a custodial sentence or conducting a criminal procesuction when there is prima facie evidence for all of the essential facts in its case and not just for interviews and investigation. There was no evidence of child neglect and definitely not enough evidence to pursue a criminal prosecution.

Felix.

See post 62

Blue by You

iTrader: (23)

Ok, so let's stop arguing semantics and get back to the original proposition of my first post.....

Do you?

hodgy0_2

exactly - and I suspect the Spanish authorities will be pretty pissed off - and will be voicing their frustration over being used like this through the correct channels

as soon as the initial spin from the story, presumably given by some pathetic NHS manager was seen for what it was - the whole thing collapsed

comparing it to the case of Baby P or hanging a baby over a balcony is just nonesense

Blue by You

iTrader: (23)

Absolutely on the nail mate.

An0n0m0us

Once again you are missing several points entirely. Firstly those 30 or so experts are only advising on what they can actually offer, that does not equate to the only or the best treatment available. It is merely what the NHS offers which as i've pointed out in a previous post isn't sadly always the best treatment available.

Secondly you are just ignoring the fact everyone here agrees the police needed to be involved to find the child as a matter of urgency, it's what happened then when the child was found safe and in good care that everyone disagrees with.

Southampton General have now accepted and agreed to the child having proton therapy at the clinic abroad and so once again it appears they have bowed to public pressure and the whole bad taste their actions have left with the public feeling on this whole case.

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

I'm pretty sure if one of your child's life were on the line you'd be getting as much information as possible from the net. I'd also add they were only offering the treatments available via the NHS, if the vid of the father is anything to go by they were completely disregarding any other possibilities along with the threat of a protection order if they disagreed, I think that's called Blackmail.
Yet no crime had been committed.
Whilst being blackmailed via the threat of a protection order what would you have done? leave him there to face the possibility of being permanently brain damaged or blinded and have no say what so ever in the process?

Let's stick to the facts of what actually happened or we could go on for years and years worth of what ifs.

What about the hospitals responsibility to the safety of the child's future, where the treatment is known not to be suitable for a 5yr old.
If they would have listened to the parents concerns, wishes and plans as opposed to dismissing them then setting the dogs lose it would have been apparent that there was no cause for concern.

The oppression part comes in when all authority figures involved abuse their positions to get "their" way and basically rail road parents into doing as they say "or else" then do not follow due process and abuse the law to apprehend people who have not been convicted of a crime or even have any evidence of a crime.

But hey lets not let the truth or compassion for the child and his parents get in the way of the machine or dare to attempt to question it's authority.

thenewgalaxy

+1

David Lock

All I've heard recently are shrill reporters shouting out at the parents questions like "Are you going to sue?" "Are you seeking compensation?" etc.

Not once have I heard a reporter asking how their little lad is getting on

hodgy0_2

I suppose we get the society we deserve

Blue by You

iTrader: (23)

Typical!
I seem to remember Spitting Image had the press boys summed up quite accurately....

Felix.

See post 53

Blue by You

iTrader: (23)

So it would appear that you think it's fine to put people in jail without charge.

Felix.

We're back to post 62 again...

And this is Spanish law which placed them in jail until their judge decides on what happens next.

jonc

But they would not have been in jail had the Hampshire Police not misused a European Arrest Warrant.

hodgy0_2

See post 63, you clearly don't understand how the European arrest warrant works

jasey

Felix.

Which bit are you questioning

Blue by You

iTrader: (23)

Give up it's a lost cause.

An0n0m0us

I just hope the UK judge who is dealing with this case as early as tomorrow releases the boy back to his parents so they can leave for that private clinic. I think there is influence from Downing Street in this case with the comments made by Clegg and the back tracking made by the authorities in the last 24 hours.

hodgy0_2

Your whole judgement and logic, and inability to accept responsibility for this shower of ****