Matteeboy

A minor service at around 15-20k miles, 30+ mpg, cheapish tax. Only fairly large expense is tyres but they last well.
The BM will depreciate hard but we got over £6k off list which softens the blow.

The van has lost under £5k in three years/22k miles -service intervals are vast, low tax and insurance but it is a thirsty bugger. But overall, if you can set aside the cash, cheapish but fun motoring and the knowledge that no dirty stopouts have soiled the beds before you ;-)

john banks

There is something very easy to live with about a Golf. I hated our MkV because of its initial unreliability, but I think the only unexpected repair costs I've had to actually pay out for were to refurbish two rear calipers and a rear high level brake LED strip, although I did end up powder coating the diamond finish wheels after earlier warranty replacements. In 8 1/2 years it has depreciated by about £1500 a year.

I was averse to a four cylinder engine as something to be properly refined, disappointed to hear that even the four cylinder in the S class hybrid was rough, although that was diesel. However, I have some hope for premium petrol downsizing oddly in the form of active engine mounts and noise cancellation which can make a four sound just as smooth as an eight cylinder.

Matteeboy

I do like the sound of the older Boxer 4s in Subarus (a mate has a Forester XT and it sounds good) but I just can't get excited about any of them - even with crazy power.
They never have the midrange shove of a good six (or even 5), they're more peaky and need thrashing more. Six or above cylinders all day every day.

It's a shame the new Passat (which does look good) only comes with 4 pot diesels, even if the top one is well over 200bhp. The (not yet released) Golf (especially the rather cool Alltrack which looks great) comes with the option of a 1.8TSi engine with around 180bhp which sounds rather interesting IMO. Still a four pot though.

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

I would say the van is a different story as they are well known to hold their money in camper guise, god knows why as they seem to be unreliable if your experience is anything to go by, but what do I know, I went for a 4x4 Mazda bongo, swapped it with my butcher for my Lexus IS200 and a few quid my way did about 20k in it and sold it on for more than the Lexus was worth, a bit slow up the hills in the Alps and a bit thirsty but did the job.


My scoob averages 28mpg and I see 36mpg on a run but you do have to pay attention to the boost gauge to get that, I don't speed about the place and I have no interest in fancy gadgets, I also like that I don't worry about it too much which I would do if I had a £30k car.

Which petrol head doesn't love a V engine, there is no replacement for displacement, on a side note, I have had 2 Ducati's, 2 VFR 400 track bikes, and a VFR 800 f1 all V engines, I just love the torque curve.

P.S; As car sounds go the Subaru burble is right up there with the best of them.

Matteeboy

Bongos are good but just slightly too small - our mates have one and we met up with them in Galicia.
I can't say I worry about our car and van - I just enjoy cleaning/maintaining them. Weird...

Cocker

iTrader: (3)

I've just signed up to lease a Fiesta ST3 £580 deposit + £193 per month. I also used to be anti lease, but now all I want is a car that is fun, and not going to cost me anything in maintainance and tax. List price on these are £19,250, although could probably get one for closer to 17k, what it will cost me over 2 years will be a lot less than if I bought

In the past year of owning a 12 year old Impreza and a 9 year old Clio 182 (which I both bought and sold for the same price) its stlll cost me £3,000 for the year for servicing, repairs and tax

Oh insurance for the ST3 is only £200 for the year as well

MattyB1983

iTrader: (51)

Each to their own I suppose but I just can't get my head around it. You are handing someone 5 grand just so you can drive round (for a limited amount of miles) in a new fiesta for a couple of years.
I'd rather use that 5 grand and buy something outright. Enjoy it for a couple if years and then sell it.

What happens if you get bored after a year, can you hand it back early.
Or if your circumstances change and you can't afford it, can you just walk away .??

Gear Head

iTrader: (2)

Spot on.

If you really don't care about the car itself and just want a fixed monthly cost, it sounds like an appealing way to get yourself a new car. I just couldn't ignore working out that I had spent £7k over 3 years and have nothing to show for it.

MattyB1983

iTrader: (51)

If you really can't afford a lump outright then I'd rather get a good used car on finance. At least you walk away with a car at the end of it.
Or better still, get a low interest personal loan.

Matteeboy

Call me crazy but if I can't afford a lump outright I consider myself to not be able to afford it. So I won't buy it.

Cocker

iTrader: (3)

All valid points and I used to agree with you, however I know my outlay will be 5k in 2 years regardless. No repair bills, probably only 1 small service, no maintenance costs, no RFL. Buying a 5k car would need to have the below paid on it over 2 years

2 x services (say £500)
2 x RFL (Say £550)
1 x interest on a 5k loan (say £300)
1 x contingency for repairs (£££)
2 x AA/RAC membership (say £100)
1 x contingency for wear & tear items such as tyres/brake pads/disks etc (£££)
1 x get to drive around in a 5k ****ter
1 x depreciation (say £2,000)

So all the above I wont have to pay and by my calculations the lease has 2/3rd paid for itself already plus of course the worry about all the potential unknown costs of a 5k car

Yes drive around in a fiesta, but hardly a crappy one? The amount of toys the ST3 comes with is unreal and by all accounts they are pretty quick. In the unlikely event I do get bored, 2 years is hardly a long time is it? and I doubt i'll be bored 1 week in?

Your point about the financial commitment is valid, however I haven't overstretched myself like people do sometimes, and have more than enough tucked away incase anything goes wrong

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

I'm the same, which is why I don't get the lease thing either, I still have the £4k I spent to buy the car as it's still worth that 3yrs later and in that time it's cost me £700 keeping it on the road Plus a grand in RFL and MOT's, so £1700 for 3yrs and 20k miles.

Works for me.

Gear Head

iTrader: (2)

£500 per service. If you pay that on a £5k car, you are a mug.

Luckyscoob

iTrader: (2)

I think he's saying £500 total so £250 per service. That's how I read it anyway.

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

So what's the stated milage, also cost per mile if you go over, and service costs, also what's the road tax?

Cocker

iTrader: (3)

5,000 per year, I doubt i'll even do that as my wife has a car so we will share the 2 all depending who goes out first and what car isn't in the garage. IF the servicing is mileage based I doubt i'll need a service, and car tax I don't know as I don't have to pay it

MattyB1983

iTrader: (51)

£2500 a year in rent alone and you can only use it for 13 miles a day.
If it works for you then great, I just struggle to get my head around it. I'd always be thinking that I could of bought a lovely newage STI for what you're paying in rent alone. Not only would it be mine and see some money back come sale time but it's also a far far better car than a fiesta and I'd be able to use it as much as I'd like.

hodgy0_2

might be cheaper to get a Taxi everywhere

and then you can get hammered too

Cocker

iTrader: (3)

The last 2 Imprezas ive had have cost me £9,344 in servicing/tax/mods, plus £9,245 in depreciation so some might say that's 20 grand wasted just there

At the end of the day all cars regardless of age/make/model are moneypits. Even my wifes first car, an Aygo that we had for nearly 2 years and sold it for nearly what we bought it for cost us £1,700 in maintainance/servicing.

At this current moment in time leasing a car is a viable option for me and suits my needs which are to have a new, reliable, fun hot hatch with lots of creature comforts,that wont cost me any money on consumables

banny sti

iTrader: (68)

Ultimately as long as you can justify it to yourself, thats all the counts regardless of what anyone else says or thinks

Butkus

I think leasing/PCP is the way to go now with a car. And even more so now that I have less and less interest in them. Our diesel Polo (I know, exciting) costs £153/month, does 70mpg, was free to tax and insure in the first year (now those figures are only £20 and £200 respectively) and doesn't cost anything to service (included). It probably does 110mph top speed on a good day but round here (South East) there is nowhere to drive fast anyway, and it is completely clogged with traffic too!

Why would I tie up £16k in a car that I can lease for less than my gas and electric bill?

Matteeboy

Because 12 x gas and electric bill x the number of years = rather a lot. At the end of which, you have naff all.

"Tie up" £16k on a car? Do you have some stunningly wise investments planned? "Tie up" is code for "afford."

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

I would say the likes of Mattyb and myself are somewhat different than the average poster on this thread, in that we both have no problem getting our hands dirty and in fact quite enjoy the prospect. I can see how those of you that are shelling out for someone else to change the oil and do run of the mill servicing whilst paying through the nose for it would find leasing attractive.

Less hassle and generally no real worries, my only issue is the dead money but I can still see the attraction, hence my looking into it a few months back for the wife.

In the end I figured it's still cheaper to have her run around in a sh1tter and if the worst happens she is under strict instructions to leave the keys in it and call a taxi, as the cost of an oil change at a franchised dealer is more than the car is worth.

In that event I would just search the net for something with uber low miles and a decent rep and bung her in another £500/1000 sh1tter. current one has done over 70k and cost about a grand to keep on the road in almost 5yrs, I purchased it for the princely sum of £800. does 40mpg and has been pretty reliable and never let us down, even came out to Croatia and back and humbled the local Ferrari.

Butkus

We are all different. I know from your other posts that your priority is a nice car that is paid for and a rented house, and that is obviously your approach and what works for you. For us, property is more important.

Yes, I have a 'stunningly wise' investment plan which makes better use of the £16k.

Matteeboy

Our aim is to pay no interest - ever.
Been working well for 10 years now.

Butkus

Sometimes you can pay interest and still get ahead.

Matteeboy

Yes but then some w4nker makes money too.
I have such contempt for the bank and financial institutions that I plan never to let them make a bean off us.
And "get ahead" is incredibly ambiguous. Nothing more hideous in our eyes than doing the usual "property ladder" cr4p for decades.

RS Grant

I agree, a WRX (PPP'd I assume..) is a quick way cross country and won't be far behind the likes of MK2 FRS, Golf R etc... and with 400bhp and the correct supporting mods, it will be fantastic as you say.


For me, insurance is half what I paid for a 2011 335i Touring.

However if the current rate of Golf R thefts continue, then by the time I'm ready to insure my car I may find that saving has vanished?!


Sadly, a lot of lease cars will have the same oil in them for up to ~20k miles if they are on the long life service plan. I'm planning to be on that plan so that I only have to pay for one service in the two years, however, will be doing a couple of extra oil changes between delivery and the first/only service in my ownership because I'm also a bit OCD when it comes to stuff like that regardless of what car it is on... my Transit Connect gets the same treatment that my 'fun/occasional' cars do.


Not sure I agree with you there, the MK1 FRS that I owned had quite a muscular midrange punch (amplified by the FWD/LSD set up) and the MY07 STi which I owned had spectacular midrange grunt.. in fact, the mid range of c400lb/ft, was arguably more impressive than the peak power of c360bhp. On the flip side of that, the E46 M3 which I owned (343ps) needed its **** kicked right round to ~8k to get the best from it and the mid range wasn't that great at all.


I agree and assume it's because of group politics, if they fitted it with the 3.0T and 3.0TT diesels then it'd certainly take sales away from Audi brand.


If you can't afford to cover any penalties that would arise if your circumstances changed that drastically, then you shouldn't be signing up for it in the first place... in my humble opinion.


I'm a coded welder to trade and also do some removal and fitting of pipelines if/when it is called for.. so getting my hands dirty is something I'm definitely 'comfortable' with.

However, given the limited amount of spare time I find myself with these days, I can no longer justify crawling around in the garage/driveway/unit for hours replacing old or worn X, Y or Z... added to the fact that the whole 'scene' which I used to be involved in locally; racing, runs in countryside, working in cars with mates, car shows, etc has all been replaced with dinner parties, baby play dates and family days out.


It is definitely dead money and I'm playing for hassle-free motoring and the convenience of it all... not quite the amount which some assume it'll be, but a service and worst case, a set of front pads, is something which I can live with.


I need to reply to this thread more regularly, these multi-quote replies are hell of a long.


Cheers,
Grant

Butkus

I understand if you have a moral issue about the banks, but you can't deny that sometimes there is sense in paying interest. What if you're in business and you can buy 100 widgets for £10k and sell them for £15k. Let's say you don't have the £10k but you can borrow it if you pay back £12k. Would it not make sense to borrow the money and make £3k profit?

Matteeboy

I'd find another source other than a bank.

So far we've never had to borrow anything for our business. We're that hell bent on NOT paying interest!

The truly successful people I know borrow very little or preferably nothing. The "fly by nighters" borrow heavily, make a quick buck then lose it all again.
Of course some are very wise and/or lucky and do very well but I can't be ar5ed to risk it. Or pay interest.