Had my mapping session with Bob this morning, what a morning!
26 June 2010, 03:30 PM
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Had my mapping session with Bob this morning, what a morning!
I'll start with the good news, mapped for 95 RON the made 300BHP. I didn't have to pay for a ECUTek License as the car had previously been mapped (which I nor CVC knew about), which saved me a few ££.The bad news is that I have knackered Piston 3, on the way back to Bob's after the session she let go. The sparkplug tip has been toasted, I've yet to check the cylinder. Bob put it down to the wrong plugs (I fitted NGK: ILFR6B as recommended in the serive guide) I have checked the plugs that were in there and they were NGK: PFR6B.
Expensive lesson learnt, don't realy on free workshop of the internet!! Next step is to pull the block and split it to see the damage caused. At least we'll have another engine build thread in the Wales section!! (Dylan I may be in touch for some advice
)Off to eat and drink beer now
so I won't be back online until tomorrow.
26 June 2010, 04:07 PM
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Sorry to hear about the end result of the mapping session Rich. 
Good news though about the Ecutek licence already being in place.
Hope the rebuild goes well.
Good news though about the Ecutek licence already being in place.
Hope the rebuild goes well.
26 June 2010, 04:21 PM
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Jarvis, I don't think that a remap could cause a spark failure on only one cylinder plus I've done a quick check and the ILFR6B are for the 2.5 engine as I still have a set left from my Hawkeye.
The PFR6B plugs should be the correct plugs for the STi 2.0 engine.
The PFR6B plugs should be the correct plugs for the STi 2.0 engine.
Last edited by Cannon Fodder; 26 June 2010 at 04:31 PM.
26 June 2010, 04:27 PM
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Thats some good news and some bad news all rolled up into one.
Sorry to hear this, A couple of us have been there, it's not nice but onwards and upwards as they say.
Sorry to hear this, A couple of us have been there, it's not nice but onwards and upwards as they say.
26 June 2010, 05:01 PM
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Oh **** Rich, Congrats on the power front , but sorry to hear the engine problem 
- It's not a nice feeling, but you seem positive about it
Hope you enjoy the beers and food Mate - and keep us posted on what you plan/do with her now Dylan's a good bet, to start the wheels in motion - so to speak 
, but sorry to hear the engine problem - It's not a nice feeling, but you seem positive about it Hope you enjoy the beers and food Mate - and keep us posted on what you plan/do with her now
Dylan's a good bet, to start the wheels in motion - so to speak
26 June 2010, 05:04 PM
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Not good buddy 
Been there, done that, bought the bloody shop
Hope you get it sorted soon, bigger and better I say
Been there, done that, bought the bloody shop Hope you get it sorted soon, bigger and better I say
Last edited by mervil; 26 June 2010 at 05:05 PM.
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27 June 2010, 09:37 AM
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Thanks for the support guys. Ty is right about the plugs, the manual I have (being offered free on here) is from the US it seems, hence the difference in plugs.
As many have said before, Bob was a top bloke and was more than happy to swap the plugs out with me so I could limp back home. If any of you were wondering, you can get from Swindon to Llanelli in 3 cylinder scooby!!
Today will be spent clearing the garage, and the engine work will start tomorrow.
Now where's my cheque book
As many have said before, Bob was a top bloke and was more than happy to swap the plugs out with me so I could limp back home. If any of you were wondering, you can get from Swindon to Llanelli in 3 cylinder scooby!!
Today will be spent clearing the garage, and the engine work will start tomorrow.
Now where's my cheque book
27 June 2010, 12:54 PM
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Bad news mate, I have had a nightmare dreaming that my car dies when Ive done all the mods in prep for the map, and driving off boost to my house, 1/2 mile away! Cold sweat time at 3am.
What are you going to do, go big money build or take it back to what it was pre-pop?
What are you going to do, go big money build or take it back to what it was pre-pop?
27 June 2010, 06:55 PM
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Ian, the flat three rumble sounded quite good be honest. Until I know the damage I won't know what to do. I pulled the plug on cylinder 3 again today and it is burnt and full of oil so there is definitely a problem there. I will keep you all posted.
Cheers, Rich.
Cheers, Rich.
02 July 2010, 06:55 PM
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I am splitting the engine tonight, so I'll know in a few hours what the damage is.
Yep, that is the 2nd kick in nuts. Had to hand Bob £300 for the work he done and leave with a knackered engine. I will then need to go back and pay another mapping session once the new engine is run in.
A public thanks to Dylan as well, for his superb advice for splitting the engine from the gearbox after they decided to weld themselves together.
A public thanks to Dylan as well, for his superb advice for splitting the engine from the gearbox after they decided to weld themselves together.
Last edited by redwards; 03 July 2010 at 12:31 PM. Reason: Edited as Bob informed me it won't cost me £300 for a 2nd map, as I assumed.
Good luck with engine split Rich, I hope it does'nt reveal too much of a nightmare for you
02 July 2010, 10:45 PM
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Well here goes. Had a nightmare with the cam sprocket bolts, seems to be common and the guys on nasioc had the answer for me. Took the heads off and found a hole in one of the valves and is was clear the piston ring oil seals have gone, but the bores look fine.
On closer inspection the head has cracked from the valve to the sparkplug hole So at the moment I need 1 valve a set of piston rings and 1 new head.
Here are some pics:
On closer inspection the head has cracked from the valve to the sparkplug hole
So at the moment I need 1 valve a set of piston rings and 1 new head.Here are some pics:
02 July 2010, 11:48 PM
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I just had that thought when i was buying plugs for my hawkeye they are long reach nose on them and thought that clould be nasty if fitted in the wrong engine. Gutted for you did the piston hit the plug and snap the electrode anvil off it and was it that it jammed between valve seat and valve to break it ?
02 July 2010, 11:59 PM
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Similar things to yours. Oil catch can, lightened pulleys, also I need a new clutch.
You're right, the hawkeye plugs are half an inch longer than the blobeye one's
Lucky for me there was enough clearance, so no piston damage occured. The one plug that was damaged had the electrode melted. I'll take a pick in the morning for you. While I am gutted that it happened, I am glad that I didn't fit them to a fellow members car. As they say, you live and learn, this time the learning was expensive!!!
I just had that thought when i was buying plugs for my hawkeye they are long reach nose on them and thought that clould be nasty if fitted in the wrong engine. Gutted for you did the piston hit the plug and snap the electrode anvil off it and was it that it jammed between valve seat and valve to break it ?
Lucky for me there was enough clearance, so no piston damage occured. The one plug that was damaged had the electrode melted. I'll take a pick in the morning for you. While I am gutted that it happened, I am glad that I didn't fit them to a fellow members car. As they say, you live and learn, this time the learning was expensive!!!
Last edited by redwards; 03 July 2010 at 12:02 AM.
03 July 2010, 09:37 AM
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that crack is very normal and unrelated to the failure, its a weakness in the casting..
obviously got rather hot to melt the valve like that and melt the spark plug tip, I wouldn't say the plug tip caused that, although it is possible.
Looks to have seen some heat but both cylinder look to have been running at similar fuelling wise as they are a similar light brown colour on the inlet side but the exhaust valves on the failed cylinder look to have turned red in colour and I would assume seen some heat. Strange as to why as the fuelling would appear the same as inlet colour similar.
Simon
obviously got rather hot to melt the valve like that and melt the spark plug tip, I wouldn't say the plug tip caused that, although it is possible.
Looks to have seen some heat but both cylinder look to have been running at similar fuelling wise as they are a similar light brown colour on the inlet side but the exhaust valves on the failed cylinder look to have turned red in colour and I would assume seen some heat. Strange as to why as the fuelling would appear the same as inlet colour similar.
Simon
03 July 2010, 10:09 AM
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Thank you for your advice Simon, it's always appreciated. Speaking to people I think I got away with a new valve & valve seat and a set of piston rings.
Why that cylinder (no. 3) who knows, but root cause of the failure would have been the wrong plugs I fitted.
Why that cylinder (no. 3) who knows, but root cause of the failure would have been the wrong plugs I fitted.
03 July 2010, 10:13 AM
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cylinder 3 does run a little hotter as it is near the turbo.
what plugs did you fit.
there is a layer of gas between piston and valves / head during combustion that keeps the heat away from them as they melt at the temp of combustion.. so iti s possible that if a partical (plug tip for example) touches say the piston or the valve on it's way out the cylinder that the layer of gas is then broken and the item in this case the valve sees the high combustion temperature.
But I would expect to see bounce marks on the piston etc.. do you have pictures of the piston and ring and cylinder wall damage?
Simon
what plugs did you fit.
there is a layer of gas between piston and valves / head during combustion that keeps the heat away from them as they melt at the temp of combustion.. so iti s possible that if a partical (plug tip for example) touches say the piston or the valve on it's way out the cylinder that the layer of gas is then broken and the item in this case the valve sees the high combustion temperature.
But I would expect to see bounce marks on the piston etc.. do you have pictures of the piston and ring and cylinder wall damage?
Simon
03 July 2010, 10:49 AM
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The plugs I fitted were NGK: ILFR6B as I was following a service manual that was for american cars. 
I'll take some pics, but there is no damage to the piston face or cylinder wall. I haven't taken the block apart yet to check the piston rings as I haven't got a star socket with thin enough walls to fit down the sides of the cylinder walls.
I'll take some pics, but there is no damage to the piston face or cylinder wall. I haven't taken the block apart yet to check the piston rings as I haven't got a star socket with thin enough walls to fit down the sides of the cylinder walls.
03 July 2010, 11:09 AM
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Didn't notice this last night!!
Piston:
Walls look ok though:
Similar damage to the piston on the opposite side of the engine:
Piston:
Walls look ok though:
Similar damage to the piston on the opposite side of the engine: