superstring

Hi Guys

Haven't posted for many a moon but I'm hoping you folks are still as helpful as ever!

Does anyone know the spring rates for the P1 suspension? I seem to remember 220 lbs. front and 175 rear?? (I know everthing's metric now! )

I recall, in its' day, it was highly rated as a great compromise street/performance package for the Classic.

In today's terms, is there another suspension kit that garners the same kind of praise for the same purpose? (BC or KW maybe?) And what spring rates do folks in the UK use for fast B-road driving in their Classic? In other words, what would someone with a P1 replace the original suspension with to achieve the same (or better) results?

Thanks guys. Looking forward to your responses!

bonesetter

iTrader: (9)

Hi there, and welcome back

When deciding on what suspension would be the 'best' for my classic, I went for P1 set-up. I considered coilovers, but would only really go for something like KW V3 which while bieng quite pricey, are still a coilover. I've tried a couple of coilover combos (albeit the lesser priced Taiwanese offerings) and they didn't seem to work together as well as a damper & spring

The fixed perch 'late' red STi inverted monotubed damper and Eibach P1 spring seem perfect for fast UK B-road intensive hooning I couldn't imagine anything being better. They are firm, but comfortable, while giving a degree of 'float' for UK's pitching roads.

The standard STi springs are just too harsh and firm. The hardcore folk here will say the P1's set-up (and in fact the whole car) is a watered down of the STi, but the STi Type R I owned was too manic

You'll find alot of BC (coilover!) love on here. I think alot of comes down to their price point seeming to suit the current values of a classic Impreza. Who's going to spend £1.5K on a damper/spring set-up on a car which is worth £2.5K?

I don't know what the spring rates are for the 'Prodrive' (Eibach) springs. Here's a pic of my front spring, not sure if the numbering helps

bonesetter

iTrader: (9)

I was forgetting the Bilstein option, arguably better than OE, serviceable too.

You see sets knocking around, some brand new for decent money (~£600 which is an absolute bargain)

asjasj

P1 spring rates are 215 F and 195 R from the data I have........this is not from Prodrive so can't say 100% it's right though!

superstring

Thanks for the replies (and kind "welcome back", bonesetter )

I have the original Prodrive "Fast Road" suspension (circa 1996 - later renamed the Performance or GT kit) on my car, not the WR - which I think is the Bilstein option bonesetter mentions. AFAIK the spring rates on the Performance kit are 180 lbs/in Front and 145 Rear. Pretty wimpy by some peoples standards!! But I remember John Barker from evo magazine testing the WR suspension when it came out and saying that it was too stiff for fast B-road driving. But I also know that lots of people run far stiffer springs than even those on the WR kit these days.

Now that I see the numbers, asjasj, I think you're correct. If I could find a quality modern kit based on those kind of spring rates, I think I'd be happy!

bonesetter

iTrader: (9)

I've never heard of the Performance or GT kit. So, basically it's softer springs than the P1's and presumably still on the red V5/6 inverted monotubed damper?

Evo seemed to say the WR set-up was closer the original STi's - 'lacks the impervious feel of its more modestly shod brother [P1]...have to back off for fear of been thrown off line'.

Sounds similar to the JDM STi which was criticised for being not suited for UK roads - too hard up front and too soft in the rear, suffering front end bounce

Can you not change your springs?

superstring

The original Prodrive "Fast Road" kit was Prodrive spec Eibach springs and inverted Bilstein dampers, just like the later WR kit.

The problem I have is the dampers are old and at least one is leaking. I don't believe they can be re-built. The springs should be fine though. One solution, I suppose, is a set of KYB AGX adjustable dampers with the original springs. Cost effective for sure, but I haven't heard a lot of good reviews of this set up.

bonesetter

iTrader: (9)

You could have your present dampers refurbed. There is a US company who does this. I can't remember their name just now, but could find it if your interested.

The KYB ones are quite a decent damper, but my understanding of them is that they are very temperature dependent. When cold they are too harsh, after 10 minutes driving they are quite nice but after a bit of hooning they do overheat and lose quite a bit of damping. This on both the normal replacement as well as the adjustable AGX.

You could go the Koni insert route. This set-up is well rated...?

Arnie_1

Is there no one in Britain who rebuilds Bilsteins? Could you just send them to Germany, worst case scenario? There has to be dozens of companies in the UK who can rebuild billies. Any motorsport company who specializes in damper setup should be able to rebuild them.

bonesetter

iTrader: (9)

Thanks for coming in Arnie, OP has 'GT' or 'Performance' suspension which I don't think are the Billy's

Also, OP's location is stated as British Columbia, hence the Feal suggestion

Arnie_1

Ah, didn't notice that he was in canada. Yes, send stuff to Feal or direct to Bilstein in California for a rebuild.

Prodrive, back in, hmm 1999, maybe 2000 also had a GT Bilstein spec, it was indeed a softer setup than the WR, I believe. Definitely softer, though more controlled, than the P1. You could buy it from SPD back in the day as they were the only one's importing the Prodrive stuff. Mike Shields of SPD was the man back then. What a wealth of knowledge.

bonesetter

iTrader: (9)

^ great stuff

So just how many Impreza Bilstein variants were there?

There's the P1's WR (firmer than the P1 red damper), the GT and the Performance spec, softer than the P1, and are there some rally sport variant too I have seen knocking around on eBay?

Arnie_1

Ok, been asking around and it seems (despite various vendors descriptions) there was only the one WR Bilstein setup developed by Prodrive in 1999. Purely developed for road. So despite some vendors description that people use this for Group N, they don't run the sort of damping you really need for a rally car.

Yup, guess I learn something new every day!

So for the road Prodrive had the WR featuring the Bilstein dampers/Eibach springs (not sure on the specifics of these springs only that they are about 15% softer than STi V5) and the P1 featuring the STi V5/6 strut and specially developed by Prodrive, produced by Eibach P1 springs.

bonesetter

iTrader: (9)

Good work

And as if some folk on here are still not satisfied ( ), the only piece missing is how much stiffer (approx) the WR Bilstein damper is aver the V5/6 red strut...?

Arnie_1

Right! So who's got a shock dyno laying around? I'm very curious as to how these dyno against each other.