davidw

I was watching Crime Watch last night concerning the theft of mobile phones by hijacking lorries full of them.

The lorries were pulled over by unmarked cars with blue lights, the driver assulted and the lorry stolen with the cargo of phones.

The public were advised not to pull over unless the car was officially marked.

It occured to me that the Scooby might be the target of such attacks and therefore it may be best not to stop either

What is likely to happen if the car is a geniune unmarked police car and you fail to stop because it's not offically marked?

ca

What about this....

1. Ackowledge that you understand he wants you to stop.
2. Stop in a suitable place.
3. Lock the doors.
4. Ask to see warrant card.
5. Verify identify.
6. Explain precautions (assuming identify is confirmed)
7. Smile and be friendly.

C

JoeyDeacon

A couple of years ago when I used to own a Rover 220 Coupe I was driving like a tw@t (undertaking 2 cars and proceding to do 70 in a 40 (on a dual carriageway)) I then slowed down to about 50 and I saw a car rapidly approaching in my mirror. As it pulled alongside it matched my speed and as I looked across I was rather shocked to see the passenger looking at me. I was even more shocked when I noticed he had something in his hand pressed against the window and he was pointing to the side of the road.

Of course it turned out they were policemen and they proceeded to do the good cop, bad cop thing (i.e one wanted to ban me and the other was telling me how a car is a lethal weapon and that he hates telling parents their children are dead) and eventually let me off with a warning. That was fair enough I was driving in a dangerous manner and was lucky to get off so lightly. Now I don't know if they were off duty or whether they were plain clothed officers (driving a white Renault Megane) but If the same thing happened today now I drive the Impreza and two burly guys told me to pull over I don't know what I would do?? If I thought they were trying something on and tried to lose them surely I would be in SERIOUS trouble?

Stuart H

David,

If you are not happy about stopping you should acknowledge the police vehicle clearly and proceed slowly to a well lit public place before stopping. If the driver of the police vehicle uses a siren to attract your attention then I would suggest that the vehicle is genuine.

When you have stopped, explain the reason for not stopping to the officer. If you are in any doubt as to his identity ask to see his warrant card.

ca

Stuart H

Err, but if someone has gone to the trouble of installing some blue lights then it would seem to be a logical extension (to me) to install a siren as well.

C

carl

I thought the police couldn't pull you for a traffic offence unless they are in full traffic uniform (which is why they put their hats on when they get out of their car).

Stuart H

ca,

Good point, I'm just quoting from the guidelines I've got in front of me.

Really, the BBC should have clarified what to do rather than just saying "Don't stop unless its marked" - but then that would contsitute a well reasearched programme and we all know they don't do that. I suppose their excuse (in a studio full of policemen) was that they couldn't find anyone to ask.

Your list is spot on BTW

[This message has been edited by Stuart H (edited 14 December 2000).]

JoeyDeacon

So Stuart,

I take it that the police can stop anybody if they think they are doing something wrong even if they are off duty and that they let me off because they couldn't be bothered to do the paperwork??

[This message has been edited by JoeyDeacon (edited 14 December 2000).]

JasonHook

I don't feel comfortable stopping for an unmarked car in the Impreza.
A genuine Officer can always call up a marked car (one might not be available but he can try!). If I know where the local police station is I'll drive slowly toward that.
I realise it might cause a bit of an incident but I'd rather that than risk hijacking and being assaulted.

Just my opinion
Jason

[This message has been edited by JasonHook (edited 14 December 2000).]

davidw

I guess you have to be careful. Even if you follow all of the above you still don't know who it really is unless you stop and check, by which time it might be too late.

I remember many moons ago that my father was confronted by a person who claimed to be an off duty policeman. He flashed a warrant car at him and told him to get out of the car. When my father insisted he had a good look at it, it turned out to be a security pass for the local airport.

I would probably stop if it ever happened to me but if you didn't stop are you committing an offence e.g. resisting arrest etc?

Whatever, I imagine you are likely to annoy the officers involved and therefore any minor misdemeanor my not be overlooked if it took you too long to pull over

Yex

I thought all unmarked cars had blue and red lights in their grills so they could easily be identified when behind you ??? Any idiot can put a blue light on their roof or in their front screen. I wouldn't want to pull over unless there were witnesses, and so following Stuart's advise I would try and find a suitable place for the questioning to take place.

Yex

JoeyDeacon

The car that pulled me over was a White Renault Megane and had NO lights in the grill or anything. I didn't even get a good look at their badges although the fact that one of them was doing a PNC check over his Radio sort of gave it away...

To this day I don't know if they were off duty or plain clothes. If they were off duty then surely they wouldn't have their radios?? Also the Renault Megane seems quite an unlikely unmarked vehicle (they were not in uniform either)

Stuart H

Unmarked traffic vehicles will always be equipped with blue strobes behind the radiator grill. If its behind you, you should see flashing blue strobes and the headlights will probably flash alternately (i.e. left-right-left etc).

If it pulls in front of you, the vehicle will show blue lights as well as red lights to the rear. The boot lid may open with blue & red lights on the inside. There is usually the matrix board on the back window as well.

Joey,

It was probably a CID car. CID use all sorts of weird & wonderful cars and they don't wear uniforms. You wouldn't believe some of the things that are knocking around.

carl

So Stuart, do they have to be in uniform or not?

Stuart H

In order to process you for a traffic offence or require a breathtest etc the officer <I>must</I> be in full uniform.

carl

That's what I thought, so I'd be wary if pulled by a 'plain clothes' police car with 'plain clothes' officers. Also the alternating headlights is a good one -- somebody must be going to real trouble to impersonate if they've got alternating headlights *and* blue lights (or they could have nicked a police car, but then they could also nick a marked police car).

So does that mean if you're pulled by traffic plod you can knock his hat off before he writes the ticket -- then he won't be in 'full uniform'

Stuart H

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by carl:
<B>but then they could also nick a marked police car).[/quote]

Don't joke about it!

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>From Thames Valley Police:
<B>Thames Valley Police have issued a cautionary warning to members of the public following the theft of a Landrover Discovery from the premises of a film company in Eton Wick near Windsor overnight. (Tuesday 5th to Wednesday 6th December.)

The white coloured Landrover Discovery, registration M 987 EGB, was bearing distinctive "Battenburg - blue and yellow chequered square" markings, similar to those used by some police forces, on the sides of the vehicle. It also has the word POLICE across the bonnet in blue tape and has a realistic looking blue bar light across the roof. However the vehicle does not bear a crest representing any police force.

Thames Valley Police does have a number of Landrover Discovery vehicles in its fleet, but they have the livery of an orange fluorescent strip bounded by two blue reflective stripes down each side of the vehicle and also bear the Thames Valley Police force crest and name.

Inspector Steve Thwaites, Regional Traffic Inspector for Berkshire said, "We are naturally concerned in case the people who have stolen this vehicle should attempt to impersonate a police officer. However we would like to reassure members of the public that genuine police officers carry warrant cards clearly showing which police force they represents and Thames Valley Police officers also wear a distinctive metal shield on their uniform showing their name."

"If members of the public are concerned that a police vehicle watching this specific description attempts to stop them our advice is to acknowledge the police officers and drive carefully to a public place before stopping."

"We would like to hear from anyone who may have seen a vehicle matching this description. Anyone with any information about the theft, or who has seen the vehicle is asked to contact 01753 506000 and ask for the Control Room."[/quote]



[This message has been edited by Stuart H (edited 14 December 2000).]

Andy Tang

iTrader: (3)

What's the procedure when you are stop by a police car?

Do you get out of the car, or do you wait for them to come to you?

I normally get out of the car, and go to them, but this may seem confrontational. Also if I stay in the car, they may think I'm going to do a 'runner' when they come to me!

What should I do?

Andy

Stuart H

When stopped by a police vehicle you should remain in your vehicle unless you are told otherwise by the officers. If you get out and start to walk towards the police vehicle you could be perceived as a threat.

Turn off the engine, but leave the keys in the ignition. If the police vehicle is double-crewed then it will be the passenger who speaks to you while the driver remains in the car. The reasons for this are hopefully obvious.

And try and be friendly, we're only doing our job.

[This message has been edited by Stuart H (edited 14 December 2000).]

JasonHook

Stuart
You are right they do differ from Force (Service?) to Force. Cambs don't issue a holder at all just the card (not so professional looking...). These cards don't all carry a warrant number or collar number but do have the word POLICE in big friendly letters.
p.s. echo BlowDogs comment about having you contribute its great...
Jason

Kevin Greeley

So if I'm stopped on the motorway and the officer asks me to switch my engine off, I'll refuse as the turbo has to cool down for at least 2 minutes.

Or if I had a turbo timer, I wouldn't be able to shut the engine off I think.

I doubt that you could be prosecuted for failing to switch your engine off so long as you stopped when requested ?

Kevin.

DavidRB

Would anyone here recognise a real warrant card if it was shown to them?

Stuart H

Warrant cards differ from force to force. For example Metropolitan Police warrant cards consist of a leather folding wallet with a white laminated card on the left hand side and a silver crest on the right hand side.

What ever force the officer is from they will all carry this basic information:
<UL TYPE=SQUARE>
<LI>A photograph of the holder. A full time officer will be in uniform and a Special Constable will (probably) be in plain clothes.
<LI>The warrant cards serial number (not sure if all forces have serial numbers)
<LI>The officers rank (i.e. Constable, Sergeant, Inspector etc)
<LI>The officers collar number
<LI>The officers full name
<LI>The officers signature
<LI>The signature of the Chief Constable/Commissioner of the force of which the officer is a member
</UL>
A genuine officer will never refuse to show you his warrant card on demand whilst on duty. Most officers prefer not to hand you the card (in case you nick it) but will be happy to supply you with (and show you on the card) details from it so you may contact a police station to confirm their identity.



Image Copyright © Metropolitan Police Service

[This message has been edited by Stuart H (edited 15 December 2000).]

mattski

Hi,

I saw that program too, very very worrying, especially as car jackings are supposedly on the up

A friend of my brother had a 'nice' Nova with an silly amount of audio kit inside it. He was boxed in buy a large group of Indian guys, one car in front, one behind and they stopped him and robbed the lot at knife-point.

What the hell do you do in these sort of situations?

Nick

If a plain clothes car stops you, they will use blue strobe lights hidden behind the front grill, also the rear of the car will have red strobes, often pretending to be rear fog lights. The police in the car, will be in uniform & usually in fluorescent jackets.

If the men in the car are not in uniform, I would refuse to stop & make a 999 call on the cell phone.

I remember a few years ago in Bristol, there was a report of a situation, where the driver refused to stop as the plain clothes car did not identify itself. The driver seriously broke the speed limit to get away & was let off in court, because he honestly thought he was being road-raged.