J_sca001

They all seem to be around the 600 quid mark (Give or take what ECU or mods) for 1-2 hours work and a abit of rolling road use.

Yes i know they have to buy and upgrade the software but bloody hell do they charge for it!!

Donīt get me wrong Richard at Powerstation is a mapping god but the price is just no way value for money.

Iīm sure itīs the fear factor that makes people pay outrageous prices like this!

Ah, thats better now.

Any opinions??

Mocom Racing

iTrader: (2)

At around Ģ400 I wouldn't say our maps are expensive for the time and expertise involved, and at Ģ550 for an EcuTek remap the agent will be receiving around the same money.

Prior to the mapping session I will check the car over; I will check fluid levels and the condition of the spark plugs to get an indication of how the engine's currently operating, I'll then visually check the engine bay area as so many cars come in with obvious faults such as incorrect plumbing of the boost control system.

Once I'm satisfied all is well I'll connect the monitoring equipment which as a minimum consists of

• Wideband lambda sensor
• Detonation listening device
• PC with datalogging software

Some vehicles will also require further monitoring with a mechanical calibrated boost gauge, Exhaust Gas Temperature gauge etc.

With all this connected we can begin the mapping process although the vehicle will have been with me for over an hour by now and sometimes two.

I do have a base map for each model and/or modification but it is only a base and needs good time spent on it to ensure full optimsation to your vehicle and it's current state of tune. Subaru's will vary from one to another, even with similar mods, and without this optimisation you'll never receive the full potential from your car.

Take your time and be very selective as to who carries out your mapping work, if they're good, they'll have nothing to hide, will not attempt to baffle you with alien terminology and will be more than willing to explain exactly what it is they're doing.
I have mapped cars after they've received maps elsewhere as the owners weren't happy with the results, they've then gone onto explain that their car was ready 45minutes after handing over the keys

bibo_boy

Trust me.... for what you get..... this is a bargain

Or you could risk it and spend a few K's getting over the mistake......

I did

You paying for the best service you can get for your car......

As Zak said, it's more than 30 mins run down the road..

You pay for the mappers experience and if they do it properly they should monitor and adjust everything....

Gutmann pug

It is so expensive because it can be

When someone starts doing GOOD remaps for Ģ200 the price will fall, but until then it will stay at the higher price.


I like your number of posts by the way 666

funkyspider

What do you mean by 'fear factor' ?

My car was mapped because the modifications made meant that the fuelling from the standard ecu map would be incorrect. I chose to modify the car and factored in the mapping fee. There was no fear involved, just common sense that if the ecu was calibrated for a particular set of variables then changing the variables by a significant amount would mean it wouldn't have the ability to understand the new values.

Any highly specialised profession demands high fees, I'm in a job which could see me charged out for 750+ a day. It's the knowledge and years of learning you are paying for as much as the end result.

There are many people who map their own cars with relatively inexpensive equipment and free (OpenECU) software, and I dont know if the results are comparable to experienced mappers, but if you are prepared to put in the time to learn the skill then it can be done.

J_sca001

Only just noticed that!

Itīs true though, If a good mapper drops his price the rest follow,itīs like everything in business.

Mocom Racing sounds the business mind, may have to give them a call.

frayz

iTrader: (7)

I would mate, Zak @ Mocom Racing as good as any of the so called top mappers.

Better than 99% of them in my opinion but them im bias.

pslewis

Mapping is expensive because a simple job is clouded in mystery.

It is steeped in mystery and black box mentallity and the average owner doesn't have a clue whats going on ....

All this stuff with Det.Cans. and other extra bollox is just there for the punters ....... there are sets of Data Logs which just need inputting into the ECU Map - simple.

Adjust a few numbers and jobs a good 'un.

Anyone who programmed their ZX Spectrum to write their name across the screen a million times could do it.

I don't dispute that a Re-Map may be necessary for some high end modifications ..... but, the Re-Mappers would have you believe (and fleece you too) that you need a Re-Map if you use a different pump at the petrol station!!!!

And, in answer to the question, YES it is too expensive - but you lot are paying the silly prices and therefore keep them high!

Neanderthal

iTrader: (6)

Another vote for Mocom Racing and Zaks skills here

Rice Rocket

iTrader: (23)

Do all mappers do what you do Zak? As it sounds a good idea to give the car a good clean bill of health before the transformation starts?

funkyspider

They aren't det cans - they are actually listening to music you know. Probably the Wee Pappa Girl Mappa's (groan - sorry!)

[Davey]

I agree there is a lot of money paid for what isnt an overly high amount of labour but there are generally licensing costs for the software used and the equiptment is expensive to purchase and maintain.. But still considering all factors I think they ask a little too much

MaDaSS

Look, have money, will pay, simple!
No one is gonna charge Ģ200 when they can get Ģ550 for the same work, its human nature.
And at the end of the day, Ģ100 an hour aint bad is it? LOL.
I dont see many 'normal' cars getting the full day or even half day mapping sessions you read about in the magazines. Yet my mod's were as important to me as the chap who spends 5k more, so why dont i get the same mapping treatment? It can only make a good difference. S'funny how it happens

frayz

iTrader: (7)

Youre paying for their knoledge and time...

Simple.

Booma

supply and demand

Mikkel

It is a rip off like at around Ģ200 an hour on average (that's removing the costs).

In comparison I am a web developer and charge my time, expertise and software licencing costs out at around Ģ30 an hour and make a healthy profit. Unless it takes about 4 men to do the job you can't justify the costs IMO.

Still I want it done and have no choice but to pay. If there was quality low cost alternatives I would use them and they would probably make a killing.

Look at that other thread about a company going to the wall recently... drop the price get the numbers, make a profit whilst providing a top service.

TheJesus

not been on here for a bit, but just to add my 2p... mapping is something that a lot of people get ripped off for, as others have said, if you dont understand what's going on you'll just pay through the nose. I dont pay ANYWHERE near what some of you are quoting to get my Clio remapped and that's usually a full days effort from my tuner trying to get the perfect balance, so when my mate went to Ric Wood and got his MY99 classic remapped the other day I was shocked that he'd paid Ģ500+ for a crappy Dastek unichip and a couple of hours RR work. I know Ric Wood is considered expensive, but to his credit he did say he inspected the car, it needed a new center section for the exhaust and to bring it back with a new system and decat and he'd not charge him.

I think they will get away with what you allow them to get away with. The guy that tunes my 172 is a really close friend though, so I suppose he wouldn't charge me usual retail prices. Having said all that, I'd never contemplate mapping my own car, not with all this ignition advance, fuel points and AFR nonsense going on, it's baffling!

AlexJReid

Plenty of people say that classic STIs need need a remap to be safer on UK fuel. Whether this is scaremongering or fact I don't know. I do know it would be cheaper to spend ~Ģ800 for a PowerFC and remap than potential rebuild.

As long as I got my car setup well, I'd personally have no problem paying Ģ200-300 as you are paying for their knowledge and skill. For perspective, I have worked for companies that charged junior web developers out at that rate for half a day's work!

I'm not interested in spending a fortune on this car so if I got poor service from the 'respected' mappers due to my lack of inclination to spend big bucks with them I'd be less happy.

funkyspider

Does your Clio172 require an Ecutek license to be paid for when you map it for the first time ?

Thats where part of the money goes on the first subaru newage ecu's map. Following maps are usually around 200-ish, depending on the time (or cheaper) which is what I'd expect you to be paying for a clio.

For a newage impreza you obviously have the choice which mapper you use and can choose one who uses OpenECU, license free if you object to paying the Ecutek fee.

Why is no-one directing their 'rip off' comments towards Ecutek for their software license fees ?

andythejock01wrx

This is spot on. My first remap with Andy F was Ģ585 (including licence). The second was Ģ200. So you can see where most of the money goes !

Ģ200 anint bad for Andy's expertise.

GazTheHat

I've not qualms paying the remap fee. Sure, the one including the license is pricey Ģ600, but at Ģ200 after that it's not bad.

The price you pay for someone who knows exactly what they're doing and making the most of the modifications to the car, at the same time making it still safe.

TheJesus

oh, I'm not using an Ecutek chip, I'm running full stand alone on an Omex600 due to the mods it's running...



Software is called MAP3000 which iirc is Gems based. The software comes with the ECU though, I even have installed on my laptop in case I get brave (well, stupid! lol).

If it's the case that the chip makers make you pay for the software separately then that's a bit off imo, the chips themselves are less advanced than the stock ECU and merely fool it into allowing values to be changed... has no one tried someone like ChipWizards? He maps the OEM ECU's directly using WinOLS and charges a flat rate of Ģ350... hard to get hold of, but seen a few cars he's done and they have always impressed me. I just loathe the idea of spending all that money on a piggyback type ECU, I'd prefer to spend a bit more and go standalone.

J_sca001

So if i bought an Apexi PFC and controler from Ebay and had it fitted profsionally what would the fitting and subsequent mapping costs be in the region of folks???

funkyspider

Can you get Apexi FC ECU for 01> ?
If so what would it offer over the OEM ECU which can be fully mapped anyway.

I should imagine subsequent maps would be the same as any subsequent mapping costs which don't involve a license fee. Around 200.

R4LLY

iTrader: (1)

Should be around the 300 mark, and then about 100 for any tweaks thereafter....

Matt_taylor

i got a quote for 150 quid!!!!! place in essex, think he works for a firm, borrows their kit on the weekends and does it on the side!!

R4LLY

iTrader: (1)

Exact prices below:

Zen Performance - ECU Mapping

davedipster

Why don't we all start using that free open ecu thing, and start posting our mods and data files on here?
It can't be that hard to copy a map, and then load it onto another car can it.

Matt_taylor

should be a prob dave, i know someone who mapped his car himself, went horribly wrong at a point but put it back to standard and started again!

GazTheHat

A good idea in practice, but If cars of the same model, MY would be the same and react to the same modifications the same, then it would work. I wouldn't like to try otherwise.

Hence the mapping being customised to YOUR car.