No Focus Cosworth Shock
28 October 2000, 01:31 PM
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Just seen internal release from Ford UK at main dealer.
There isn't going to be a 4WD Focus Cosworth. The 230BHP front drive RS will be the flagship. Adapting the chassis to run 4WD would be prohibative cost-wise, as well not fit with rear multi-link suspension?? The front drive model cannot 'take' anymore than 230 BHP - it was originally designed to be 190/200BHP, but has been increased to 230 due to no 'cosworth' model. The mule 300BHP 4WD did exist, and had been tested extensively but disatisfaction of its poor comparibility to the Japanese road-rally cars has added weight to the decision, especially as to cover the cost of chassis redesign alone the retail price would have needed to be in 'excess of £35k'. Ford will not permit a charge of over £35k for a car that is dynamically beaten by Japanese competitors cost £10-15k less!
So with the Scoob gone ugly and soft, Ford admitting defeat, looks like the EVO is the only option - unless the Mazda 626SPS becomes a reality??
There isn't going to be a 4WD Focus Cosworth. The 230BHP front drive RS will be the flagship. Adapting the chassis to run 4WD would be prohibative cost-wise, as well not fit with rear multi-link suspension?? The front drive model cannot 'take' anymore than 230 BHP - it was originally designed to be 190/200BHP, but has been increased to 230 due to no 'cosworth' model. The mule 300BHP 4WD did exist, and had been tested extensively but disatisfaction of its poor comparibility to the Japanese road-rally cars has added weight to the decision, especially as to cover the cost of chassis redesign alone the retail price would have needed to be in 'excess of £35k'. Ford will not permit a charge of over £35k for a car that is dynamically beaten by Japanese competitors cost £10-15k less!
So with the Scoob gone ugly and soft, Ford admitting defeat, looks like the EVO is the only option - unless the Mazda 626SPS becomes a reality??
28 October 2000, 01:37 PM
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Aw man, that sucks. I for one was looking forward to this car, given Fords past success.
How is it that they can produce a rally car then? Do they not need to homologate their competition cars anymore?
Cem
How is it that they can produce a rally car then? Do they not need to homologate their competition cars anymore?
Cem
28 October 2000, 01:41 PM
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On another note, I see Ford botched the Limited Edition Puma Sports too...
Apparently they had an initial run of 1000, but only 350 were produced as the costs of AM Tickford modifying them was so prohibitive, they didn't make any profit on them.
Apparently they had an initial run of 1000, but only 350 were produced as the costs of AM Tickford modifying them was so prohibitive, they didn't make any profit on them.
28 October 2000, 03:14 PM
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WRC does require, some sort of homologation, but only the most basic sort, you must produce a car which the WRC is based on, and the engine must be based on a production engine, other than that its pretty much a free for all, there are a few other rules you have to follow, but nothing much else homologation wise
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28 October 2000, 03:55 PM
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Interesting.
In San Remo, there were rumours that Colin and Nicky were doing some suspension evaluation for Ford, for the new... you guessed it.
This was done in the mountains, far away from the glaring eye of the press and public. The Ford camp had nearly 100 "shirts" as VIP'ing it up at this rally.
In San Remo, there were rumours that Colin and Nicky were doing some suspension evaluation for Ford, for the new... you guessed it.
This was done in the mountains, far away from the glaring eye of the press and public. The Ford camp had nearly 100 "shirts" as VIP'ing it up at this rally.
28 October 2000, 06:38 PM
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Interestingly I spoke to a juinor devevelopment engineer who was part of the Focus 4WD project over one year ago!
He, being nothing like the traditional tight-lipped "Ford Man" who swears to secrecy, told me that the project seemed, "beyond their means". He had described to me how the mule they had to that point was no where near the then new Evo 6, and that he feared that Ford- as absolutly cost-conscious as they are, would never be able to devote the money required to make a comparable car.
This was no surprise to me, nor should this recent update be to anyone else. In terms of developing and productionizing state of the art cars- Ford is a joke.
If anyone at Ford reads this, let me take this time to let you know that your bosses, both in the past as now, could care less about passionate enthusiasts. Indeed, the most your company is capable of building are decent handling mid-level boxes, which on occasion are turned into "hot" cars- by tighting the suspension bits a bit, and throwing a body-kit upon.
And this is the final nail in the coffin. Ford, one of the largest most financially endowed corporations in the world, had the chance to show the world- and more importantly real car enthusiasts, what its fine engineers are capable of, and what a large corporation with insurmountable funds could produce as a show of their true ability and commitment to the most passionate of their fans. But no, what Ford did was limit their budget to such an extent that they could not even match the design of two japanese economy cars.
It is this very philosophy of cost cutting above all, that has led Ford toward building vehicles such as their (SUV)Explorer which are particularly unsafe to drive even at average speeds. (To date hundreds of people have died in these vehicles due to some combination of the ill-handling chassis of the Explorer and its poorly designed tyres.) And more recently which led Ford to design the Focus in such a way, that in recent tests by the American Insurance Institute for Highway Saftey, the Focus, while proven to be a safe car for its front passengers, was found to be potentially deadly in some crashes for those who sit in back- how sad for all those peolple who will soon die needlessly because Ford failed to fully design the structure of the Focus to protect its rear passengers.
My condolences to all the entusiasts across the world who eagerly awaited the arrival of a potentially great sports car- who now must realize that Ford never really intended for it to be that good. And more importantly my condolences to families across the world who have lost their loved ones due to both Fords and Bridgstones cost-cutting addiction.
Most often being cheap helps no one other than that portion within us all in which inate greed lurks.
He, being nothing like the traditional tight-lipped "Ford Man" who swears to secrecy, told me that the project seemed, "beyond their means". He had described to me how the mule they had to that point was no where near the then new Evo 6, and that he feared that Ford- as absolutly cost-conscious as they are, would never be able to devote the money required to make a comparable car.
This was no surprise to me, nor should this recent update be to anyone else. In terms of developing and productionizing state of the art cars- Ford is a joke.
If anyone at Ford reads this, let me take this time to let you know that your bosses, both in the past as now, could care less about passionate enthusiasts. Indeed, the most your company is capable of building are decent handling mid-level boxes, which on occasion are turned into "hot" cars- by tighting the suspension bits a bit, and throwing a body-kit upon.
And this is the final nail in the coffin. Ford, one of the largest most financially endowed corporations in the world, had the chance to show the world- and more importantly real car enthusiasts, what its fine engineers are capable of, and what a large corporation with insurmountable funds could produce as a show of their true ability and commitment to the most passionate of their fans. But no, what Ford did was limit their budget to such an extent that they could not even match the design of two japanese economy cars.
It is this very philosophy of cost cutting above all, that has led Ford toward building vehicles such as their (SUV)Explorer which are particularly unsafe to drive even at average speeds. (To date hundreds of people have died in these vehicles due to some combination of the ill-handling chassis of the Explorer and its poorly designed tyres.) And more recently which led Ford to design the Focus in such a way, that in recent tests by the American Insurance Institute for Highway Saftey, the Focus, while proven to be a safe car for its front passengers, was found to be potentially deadly in some crashes for those who sit in back- how sad for all those peolple who will soon die needlessly because Ford failed to fully design the structure of the Focus to protect its rear passengers.
My condolences to all the entusiasts across the world who eagerly awaited the arrival of a potentially great sports car- who now must realize that Ford never really intended for it to be that good. And more importantly my condolences to families across the world who have lost their loved ones due to both Fords and Bridgstones cost-cutting addiction.
Most often being cheap helps no one other than that portion within us all in which inate greed lurks.
28 October 2000, 07:21 PM
#10
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This is not new information.
Ford make a big deal of the control blade rear suspension - and would have to junk it for 4wd!
Although there are 4wd mules around they are cut and shut jobs on the 2wd platform - as indeed is the WRC.
The homologation rules changed for World Rally Cars from the old GpA rules - which is why Ford had to cut and shut a Sierra platform and stick an Escort body on for the basis of the Escort Cosworth, and the only reason why they had to produce 2500 (I think it was then) for the road - they lost a bundle on them.
If I remember correctly the WRC rules are that they only have to produce around 20 kits for the rally car - so they do not have to make a road car. Ford is cash rich, sitting on billions of dollars, and will not commit itself to projects that do not make money - and a 4wd Cosworth version would not have the volumes necessary.
Ford's intention is that the car will be replaced with the Mk2 Focus late 2002/2003 and they will then engineer the platform to take a mini MPV/SUV etc variants plus POSSIBLY 4wd and the Cosworth 4wd version will PROBABLY appear then, if it happens.
I'm not defending Ford - this was supposed to be my next car!!
Ford make a big deal of the control blade rear suspension - and would have to junk it for 4wd!
Although there are 4wd mules around they are cut and shut jobs on the 2wd platform - as indeed is the WRC.
The homologation rules changed for World Rally Cars from the old GpA rules - which is why Ford had to cut and shut a Sierra platform and stick an Escort body on for the basis of the Escort Cosworth, and the only reason why they had to produce 2500 (I think it was then) for the road - they lost a bundle on them.
If I remember correctly the WRC rules are that they only have to produce around 20 kits for the rally car - so they do not have to make a road car. Ford is cash rich, sitting on billions of dollars, and will not commit itself to projects that do not make money - and a 4wd Cosworth version would not have the volumes necessary.
Ford's intention is that the car will be replaced with the Mk2 Focus late 2002/2003 and they will then engineer the platform to take a mini MPV/SUV etc variants plus POSSIBLY 4wd and the Cosworth 4wd version will PROBABLY appear then, if it happens.
I'm not defending Ford - this was supposed to be my next car!!
29 October 2000, 12:26 PM
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Anyone see the motorshow pictures of the "sporty" Mazda 323 saloon? Anyone else think it looks more like an Impreza Turbo than the MY01 does? Maybe a 200bhp version of that would be interesting....
S
S
30 October 2000, 08:28 AM
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Kevin
This might be a Subaru board, but most people who use it like all great cars. If you limit yourself to just one brand for the sake of some odd principle - well it's your loss IMHO.
30 October 2000, 10:13 AM
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Kevin2000 Right on!
Anyway who wants to wait till 2004 for the Ford Cossie anyway. Ford are so behind the times when it comes to bringing out performance cars, because they are a victim of their own success in that they made the insurance companies their enemy by selling thousands of fast, nickable cars, and now they are scared of the insurance companies. My 250bhp Modded Scoob is Cheaper to insure than a std 4wd 4Door Sierra Cossie.
Trev. (Ex-Ford worker).
Anyway who wants to wait till 2004 for the Ford Cossie anyway. Ford are so behind the times when it comes to bringing out performance cars, because they are a victim of their own success in that they made the insurance companies their enemy by selling thousands of fast, nickable cars, and now they are scared of the insurance companies. My 250bhp Modded Scoob is Cheaper to insure than a std 4wd 4Door Sierra Cossie.
Trev. (Ex-Ford worker).
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