Just Bought a P1
05 February 2005, 01:01 PM
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Just Bought a P1
Hi there....
Just bought a 2000X P1.....
Had two SEATs before that, one Cupra then a Cupra R...
So whats first on the list to do???
Induction?? DeCat?? Chip etc??!....
I have no idea where to start on an Impreza..
Any help..
Thanks.
Just bought a 2000X P1.....
Had two SEATs before that, one Cupra then a Cupra R...
So whats first on the list to do???
Induction?? DeCat?? Chip etc??!....
I have no idea where to start on an Impreza..
Any help..
Thanks.
05 February 2005, 01:04 PM
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Join up over at http://www.p1woc.co.uk
Loads of info over there, but I would start with a de-cat exhaust and a remap.
Loads of info over there, but I would start with a de-cat exhaust and a remap.
05 February 2005, 02:40 PM
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tominski,
Nice one mate
Full decat, and panal filter first mate, then take it from there, I would'nt bother having it chipped cos you can do much more without that, not only that P1's have had tendatcy to blow after a chip
Cheers
Colin
Nice one mate
Full decat, and panal filter first mate, then take it from there, I would'nt bother having it chipped cos you can do much more without that, not only that P1's have had tendatcy to blow after a chipCheers
Colin
05 February 2005, 03:51 PM
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Originally Posted by tominski
Hi there....
Just bought a 2000X P1.....
Had two SEATs before that, one Cupra then a Cupra R...
So whats first on the list to do???
Induction?? DeCat?? Chip etc??!....
I have no idea where to start on an Impreza..
Any help..
Thanks.
Just bought a 2000X P1.....
Had two SEATs before that, one Cupra then a Cupra R...
So whats first on the list to do???
Induction?? DeCat?? Chip etc??!....
I have no idea where to start on an Impreza..
Any help..
Thanks.
i luv my p1
Last edited by robby1; 05 February 2005 at 03:54 PM.
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05 February 2005, 05:31 PM
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You have moved on from cars with chips ive had a p1 and there very nice cars and had many good times in it to has we all would i wished i kept it the car only had 8000 miles when i sold it
I suggest getting use to the car 1st then move onto more power.
Just some advice try and run the car on optimax if you can and dont put cheap fuel in it has alot of p1 have blown up due to people not looking after them.
The best way to start modding would be de-cat / STi panel filter /fuel pump/knocklink /tek 3 re-map 3-port soly once the bolt on items are fitted run the car carefully until you have it re-mapped (tek3) maybe unless you have money then go for a ecu Link / motec / maybe .There is a group buy on tek 3 at the moment with (BRD) Bob Rawle is the mapper and very good at it to.
You could do the induction if you choose one of the above ecu`s because they by-pass the maf sensor.
When you have done that maybe a brake upgrade as the 4-pots are very poor for a P1
Enjoy
R.B
I suggest getting use to the car 1st then move onto more power.
Just some advice try and run the car on optimax if you can and dont put cheap fuel in it has alot of p1 have blown up due to people not looking after them.
The best way to start modding would be de-cat / STi panel filter /fuel pump/knocklink /tek 3 re-map 3-port soly once the bolt on items are fitted run the car carefully until you have it re-mapped (tek3) maybe unless you have money then go for a ecu Link / motec / maybe .There is a group buy on tek 3 at the moment with (BRD) Bob Rawle is the mapper and very good at it to.
You could do the induction if you choose one of the above ecu`s because they by-pass the maf sensor.
When you have done that maybe a brake upgrade as the 4-pots are very poor for a P1
Enjoy
R.B
Last edited by R.B; 05 February 2005 at 05:34 PM.
05 February 2005, 06:10 PM
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Thanks People.... As standard, the P1 feels slower than my SEAT!?!..
Not of the Mark..... WOW!... But once going, quite a bit slower..
Need more torque!...
My SEAT was RR'd at 262bhp and 283lb/ft...
Not of the Mark..... WOW!... But once going, quite a bit slower..
Need more torque!...
My SEAT was RR'd at 262bhp and 283lb/ft...
05 February 2005, 06:43 PM
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4wd losses compared to FWD losses.
The seat would have had far more power and torque at the wheels than your P1. However traction off the line, and in the damp and wet will be miles better in the P1.
I have a jabba'd LCR at 275bhp/290lbft. With 240bhp @ wheels.
To get 240 @ wheels in an impreza you need to be pushing a good 310bhp. My old classic had 260bhp @ flywheel but only 180 @ wheels.
Shows you how much power the 4wd transmission uses.
The seat would have had far more power and torque at the wheels than your P1. However traction off the line, and in the damp and wet will be miles better in the P1.
I have a jabba'd LCR at 275bhp/290lbft. With 240bhp @ wheels.
To get 240 @ wheels in an impreza you need to be pushing a good 310bhp. My old classic had 260bhp @ flywheel but only 180 @ wheels.
Shows you how much power the 4wd transmission uses.
Last edited by Mitchy260; 05 February 2005 at 06:48 PM.
05 February 2005, 07:01 PM
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Seat's power delivery is very peaky, especially when chipped. The P1 will still be making around 260-270 bhp close to the red line(limiter ~8200rpm).
Also I'd advise on using some NF Octane booster, my car feels quicker with it in the tank, also goes better on ESSO SUL + booster, as opposed to Optimax.
Also I'd advise on using some NF Octane booster, my car feels quicker with it in the tank, also goes better on ESSO SUL + booster, as opposed to Optimax.
05 February 2005, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Mitchy260
To get 240 @ wheels in an impreza you need to be pushing a good 310bhp. My old classic had 260bhp @ flywheel but only 180 @ wheels.
Shows you how much power the 4wd transmission uses.
Shows you how much power the 4wd transmission uses.
Tony
05 February 2005, 07:08 PM
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Reasons P1's blow up......
Bad fuel (though this can happen to all scoobs, its very rare though), faulty oil pump (possably the biggest cause but also very rare), high speed driving (definately the most common reason that they blow up, lack of cool air over the intercooler means high intake temps which can cause det, new STi's with big scoobs solved the problem, id suggest a splitter for your intercooler scoop, you may need to do a search but they were the in thing a couple of years back).
Tony
Bad fuel (though this can happen to all scoobs, its very rare though), faulty oil pump (possably the biggest cause but also very rare), high speed driving (definately the most common reason that they blow up, lack of cool air over the intercooler means high intake temps which can cause det, new STi's with big scoobs solved the problem, id suggest a splitter for your intercooler scoop, you may need to do a search but they were the in thing a couple of years back).
Tony
05 February 2005, 07:21 PM
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Tony looking at the scoobynet dyno page, some scoobies are pushing out 320bhp and not even making 240@wheels.
For instance 343bhp @ flywheel 243 @ wheels
346 @ flywheel 221 @ wheels
That's astronomical losses. 30-35% for instance. Compare that to 10-15% a FWD car loses. Imprezas are fairly poor on the move, im sure you don't need me to tell you that. Little clio cups hammering WRX classics for example. Blunoses brother has some video evidence of this and the car only had a power output of 180bhp/150lbft compared with 250/230lbft the scooby had.
Assuming your 259.5bhp @ wheels, shouldn't the flywheel figure be closer to the 350 mark? I always assumed the flywheel figure was governed by what % loss the operator typed in? Of course i may be wrong, you'll know better than me.
http://dyno.scoobynet.co.uk/PEindex/jap.htm
For instance 343bhp @ flywheel 243 @ wheels
346 @ flywheel 221 @ wheels
That's astronomical losses. 30-35% for instance. Compare that to 10-15% a FWD car loses. Imprezas are fairly poor on the move, im sure you don't need me to tell you that. Little clio cups hammering WRX classics for example. Blunoses brother has some video evidence of this and the car only had a power output of 180bhp/150lbft compared with 250/230lbft the scooby had.
Assuming your 259.5bhp @ wheels, shouldn't the flywheel figure be closer to the 350 mark? I always assumed the flywheel figure was governed by what % loss the operator typed in? Of course i may be wrong, you'll know better than me.
http://dyno.scoobynet.co.uk/PEindex/jap.htm
Last edited by Mitchy260; 05 February 2005 at 07:39 PM.
05 February 2005, 07:37 PM
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Originally Posted by bluenose172
Seat's power delivery is very peaky, especially when chipped. The P1 will still be making around 260-270 bhp close to the red line(limiter ~8200rpm).
Last edited by Mitchy260; 05 February 2005 at 07:41 PM.
05 February 2005, 07:45 PM
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seats
seats
I dunno about seats, but if an M3 evo is faster than a seat, I dont see how a seat can be faster than a P1 really?? (Cupra R 0-62 6.9 secs, shall we read 7 secs) (P1 0-62 4.5 secs ??)
Thrashed an M3 Evo for dead on the M3 and he was really trying, I touched 160 MPH got off at basingstoke, my old P1 had a green cotton air filter in a standard air box, and a Blitz Nur Spec R Exhaust which is outstanding for power jus loud,very loud.
Take my advice and dont ever put an induction kit on it as they are known for blowing the MAF meter as it is so fragile, one thing I found was when i first go my P1 it was slow for some reason, and as ive had 8 M3s to date, i decided to go down the route of cleaning the fuel system, I did this with a substance called BG44k I got hold of this from my former BMW Service agent in Wolverhampton called BM Euro Service,leave it in the tank for 10 days and run the car for 300 miles only on the same tank of gas, if u can, or buy 2 cans and run it for 600 miles over 10 days if u use the car for work etc, once this has been done you will notice a very big difference in power, Ive tried all the rest of the cleaners like redline, stp and the like, so try it and u should see a good power gain, and it lasts for 25000 miles, I use also ZX1 Extra lube and have been using this now for 10 years in all my cars, extra lube is used in F3000 for lube in the engine, and at one time u could only get it from specialists, but stupidly enough u can get it from halfords, DONT USE SLICK 50 it Clogs the oil galleries.
Enjoy the P1! once the power has come back to it it will be fantastic just loved the power and urgency of it all really.
Oh one more thing get the geometry sorted by a good company like Power Station in Tewkesbury or TSL Motorsort, so that you can get the turn in sorted as they under steer badly, once this has all been done you wont want to get out the car, and youll realise, that seats are for *****,.......LOL LOL my little joke sos
I dunno about seats, but if an M3 evo is faster than a seat, I dont see how a seat can be faster than a P1 really?? (Cupra R 0-62 6.9 secs, shall we read 7 secs) (P1 0-62 4.5 secs ??)
Thrashed an M3 Evo for dead on the M3 and he was really trying, I touched 160 MPH got off at basingstoke, my old P1 had a green cotton air filter in a standard air box, and a Blitz Nur Spec R Exhaust which is outstanding for power jus loud,very loud.
Take my advice and dont ever put an induction kit on it as they are known for blowing the MAF meter as it is so fragile, one thing I found was when i first go my P1 it was slow for some reason, and as ive had 8 M3s to date, i decided to go down the route of cleaning the fuel system, I did this with a substance called BG44k I got hold of this from my former BMW Service agent in Wolverhampton called BM Euro Service,leave it in the tank for 10 days and run the car for 300 miles only on the same tank of gas, if u can, or buy 2 cans and run it for 600 miles over 10 days if u use the car for work etc, once this has been done you will notice a very big difference in power, Ive tried all the rest of the cleaners like redline, stp and the like, so try it and u should see a good power gain, and it lasts for 25000 miles, I use also ZX1 Extra lube and have been using this now for 10 years in all my cars, extra lube is used in F3000 for lube in the engine, and at one time u could only get it from specialists, but stupidly enough u can get it from halfords, DONT USE SLICK 50 it Clogs the oil galleries.
Enjoy the P1! once the power has come back to it it will be fantastic just loved the power and urgency of it all really.
Oh one more thing get the geometry sorted by a good company like Power Station in Tewkesbury or TSL Motorsort, so that you can get the turn in sorted as they under steer badly, once this has all been done you wont want to get out the car, and youll realise, that seats are for *****,.......LOL LOL my little joke sos
Last edited by WRXEEEEEED; 05 February 2005 at 08:10 PM.
05 February 2005, 07:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Mitchy260
Tony looking at the scoobynet dyno page, some scoobies are pushing out 320bhp and not even making 240@wheels.
For instance 343bhp @ flywheel 243 @ wheels
346 @ flywheel 221 @ wheels
That's astronomical losses. 30-35% for instance. Compare that to 10-15% a FWD car loses. Imprezas are fairly poor on the move, im sure you don't need me to tell you that. Little clio cups hammering WRX classics for example. Blunoses brother has some video evidence of this and the car only had a power output of 180bhp/150lbft compared with 250/230lbft the scooby had.
Assuming your 259.5bhp @ wheels, shouldn't the flywheel figure be closer to the 350 mark? I always assumed the flywheel figure was governed by what % loss the operator typed in? Of course i may be wrong, you'll know better than me.
http://dyno.scoobynet.co.uk/PEindex/jap.htm
For instance 343bhp @ flywheel 243 @ wheels
346 @ flywheel 221 @ wheels
That's astronomical losses. 30-35% for instance. Compare that to 10-15% a FWD car loses. Imprezas are fairly poor on the move, im sure you don't need me to tell you that. Little clio cups hammering WRX classics for example. Blunoses brother has some video evidence of this and the car only had a power output of 180bhp/150lbft compared with 250/230lbft the scooby had.
Assuming your 259.5bhp @ wheels, shouldn't the flywheel figure be closer to the 350 mark? I always assumed the flywheel figure was governed by what % loss the operator typed in? Of course i may be wrong, you'll know better than me.
http://dyno.scoobynet.co.uk/PEindex/jap.htm
As ive been informed, the flywheel figures are normally the accurate ones, but you also have to take into consideration that my car has the A-DCCD, which does help due to less resistance, thus the 15% transmission losses, not quite into rear wheel territory yet
but she still outpaces e43 M3's out of the box , oh and the odd Porsche if they want to move over 
Tony
05 February 2005, 09:55 PM
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I wouldnt bother with any of the power mods to start with!
The P1 in standard form is a pretty quick car anyway.
Have owned mine for two years now, did the exhaust change and air filter change first, then the brakes and a few other things!
Get your brakes upgraded if they are still the standard subaru 4 pots, they simply dont realise the cars full potential at speed!
Also look at getting the Whiteline anti roll bar and solid links next... this was my last mod, wish it was my first! This simple mod totally transforms the car. It enables you to keep alot more speed safely when entering corners etc..
Just my humble thoughts!
Mikey
The P1 in standard form is a pretty quick car anyway.
Have owned mine for two years now, did the exhaust change and air filter change first, then the brakes and a few other things!
Get your brakes upgraded if they are still the standard subaru 4 pots, they simply dont realise the cars full potential at speed!
Also look at getting the Whiteline anti roll bar and solid links next... this was my last mod, wish it was my first! This simple mod totally transforms the car. It enables you to keep alot more speed safely when entering corners etc..
Just my humble thoughts!
Mikey
05 February 2005, 10:20 PM
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I have completely the opposite view Jeff
50 BHP difference between wheels and flywheel is quite common on Bosch or Dastek dynos where the car is not pulled down hard onto the rollers deforming the tyres, and even then there is a power sapping double contact patch. The drag of one axle is not accounted for for a 2WD vehicle, yet the AWD vehicle suffers inflated losses on 2 axles. At 400 BHP, my car was losing 14% only, no DCCD either, and the vehicle speed was decent. The 100 BHP differences shown by some rollers are unrealistic when you consider the acceleration figures and the weights of these cars compared with their 2WD counterparts when things are not traction limited. Transmission losses are also not usually a proportion as well.
In additional support of flywheel figures are that they are compensated for temperature and pressure, and they attempt to remove the effects of gearing, and variations in tyre pressures/compounds/wear/sizes/temperatures, as well as any effects from transmission oil type or temperature and a multitude of other factors.
So wheel HP & torque from a chassis dyno are the last things that could be considered accurate when comparing different cars with different layouts.
In terms of modifying the P1 I suggest as a first stage:
AP 4 pot brakes
Stiffer rear antiroll bar
Geometry
"Anti-lift" kit
Power FC with hand commander
Fuel pump
New age STi TMIC and scoop
Full exhaust including manifold
Panel filter and resonator removal
After that most things you do will reduce the driveability IMHO for a road car.
50 BHP difference between wheels and flywheel is quite common on Bosch or Dastek dynos where the car is not pulled down hard onto the rollers deforming the tyres, and even then there is a power sapping double contact patch. The drag of one axle is not accounted for for a 2WD vehicle, yet the AWD vehicle suffers inflated losses on 2 axles. At 400 BHP, my car was losing 14% only, no DCCD either, and the vehicle speed was decent. The 100 BHP differences shown by some rollers are unrealistic when you consider the acceleration figures and the weights of these cars compared with their 2WD counterparts when things are not traction limited. Transmission losses are also not usually a proportion as well.
In additional support of flywheel figures are that they are compensated for temperature and pressure, and they attempt to remove the effects of gearing, and variations in tyre pressures/compounds/wear/sizes/temperatures, as well as any effects from transmission oil type or temperature and a multitude of other factors.
So wheel HP & torque from a chassis dyno are the last things that could be considered accurate when comparing different cars with different layouts.
In terms of modifying the P1 I suggest as a first stage:
AP 4 pot brakes
Stiffer rear antiroll bar
Geometry
"Anti-lift" kit
Power FC with hand commander
Fuel pump
New age STi TMIC and scoop
Full exhaust including manifold
Panel filter and resonator removal
After that most things you do will reduce the driveability IMHO for a road car.
Last edited by john banks; 05 February 2005 at 10:23 PM.
05 February 2005, 11:51 PM
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glad to see you bought a p1 mate any pics, ill show you mine if you show me yours
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...s/DSC05497.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...s/DSC05497.jpg
06 February 2005, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by mike petts
glad to see you bought a p1 mate any pics, ill show you mine if you show me yours
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...s/DSC05497.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...s/DSC05497.jpg
Nick
06 February 2005, 01:44 PM
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John
How do you know that your car has a 14% loss ? Have you taken the engine out and put it on a engine dyno and compared it with your chassis dyno results ? if you haven't then you don't know....
have a look here to see where I'm going with this...
http://www.pumaracing.co.uk/power3.htm
How do you know that your car has a 14% loss ? Have you taken the engine out and put it on a engine dyno and compared it with your chassis dyno results ? if you haven't then you don't know....
have a look here to see where I'm going with this...
http://www.pumaracing.co.uk/power3.htm
06 February 2005, 05:38 PM
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Originally Posted by mike petts
glad to see you bought a p1 mate any pics, ill show you mine if you show me yours
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...s/DSC05497.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...s/DSC05497.jpg
Mike
That is a seriously nice car. V temptred to upgrade from my decatted MY00to a P1. Stunning, don't care what the P1 knockers say.
BAZ
06 February 2005, 06:17 PM
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Thanks baz .......as for people who knock my p1 i could not give a sh*t what anyone says either it be my choice of car, cloths or anything if i like something i like it end of story 
.
.......as for people who knock my p1 i could not give a sh*t what anyone says either it be my choice of car, cloths or anything if i like something i like it end of story .
06 February 2005, 10:23 PM
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Jeff I am saying I have a 14% loss because those were my measured coastdown losses, the closest cheap proxy I can come up with, and to illustrate how different claimed losses can be. I know Puma Racing's views as I've read them before. I won't be so arrogant to say that I alone don't agree with them but state that Dave Walker (designer of Emerald ECU, runs a dyno, ex-technical ed Car & Car Conversions) amongst other "experts" doesn't in some of the most well read engine tuning literature available, for some of the reasons I've already stated.
You can also pick holes in engine dyno figures until the cows come home, 20% differences between dynos for the same engine anyone? Artificial loading, dyno exhausts, different rad/intercooler not in a real road going airflow.....
So I still disagree with everything you've said on the topic Jeff
You can also pick holes in engine dyno figures until the cows come home, 20% differences between dynos for the same engine anyone? Artificial loading, dyno exhausts, different rad/intercooler not in a real road going airflow.....
So I still disagree with everything you've said on the topic Jeff
