chiark

This may be a bit of a spleen vent, but boy am I p'd off with Subaru. I'm posting this in general, as it isn't dealer/3rd party but may be of general interest.

My WRX MY03 wagon has just had its 20k service. All that's done differently on this compared to the 10k is to change the brake fluid. All that's done on the 10K is an oil change and wipe an oily rag around a few things here and there. This is hardly a trying job.

For this 20k service, I was charged 1.9 hours of labour at £64+VAT an hour.

The real kicker? I took the car in at 8:55, and picked it up at 10:10. 1 hour 15 minutes. That included changing front pads, which the garage graciously didn't charge me labour for.

So the garage asked me for 40 quid+VAT which they didn't earn. I have taken this up with the garage, and out of goodwill they have reduced the labour charge to the actual labour spent on my car, so I can't fault the garage really.

However, it does get right up my nose that Subaru put this forward as common practice to all franchised dealers. I spoke with their customer care line, and it seems that it is International Motors that are setting the price for labour no matter what the garage thinks, or actually spends on labour.

I am of a mind that this is sharp practice. Does anyone have any ideas with whom I could take this up? I re-iterate that the garage has sorted me out, but I find the general attitude of IM ("pay for it, that's what the labour is no matter how long the labour takes") is leading to people being charged for work that has not been performed on their cars.

Cheers,

Nick
("people's champion )

P20SPD

iTrader: (1)

Chris L

To put Nick's labour charge in perspective, I only paid £30 more for the labour on my 60K service yesterday, which takes about 3 hours! (Xtreme Scoobies BTW).

Chris

chiark

To give the garage their due, Charlie did sort me out pretty immediately. I'll have a word with him before the car goes in next time though...

(BTW, did you know that Subaru dealers charge over 8 quid + VAT for a litre of Mobil 5w40? That hurts a little too, but apparently all garages enjoy a premium for oil. Mercedes seem partcularly painful with oil charges. At least you're well lubricated whilst they **** you over )

Old_Fart

BMW in London charge £95+vat an hour...whether it's an M3 CSL or a 318.
One of the reasons I got a 911 instead was the cheaper running costs LOL
C

chiark

Cheers Chris

It was 121.60+VAT = £142.88. Plus £50 for oil, about £110 for pads and little bits here and there taking the original charge for a small 20k service after a year up to 315 quid.

The garage has reduced this by 45 quid, so labour cost me £97.88 all in (or 83.30+vat, or 1.3 hours of labour at standard rates if you're playing "follow the lady")

Cheers,
nick.

Chris L

Knowlsey said yesterday that his Dad's Jag dealer were trying to charge £120 an hour

Mikkk

As an aside: if the dealer works on the car for one hour but has two techs working on it during that time can they charge for two hours labour?? I would say yes, anyone know dealer/Subaru policy on this sort of thing??

Genuinely curious.

chiark

Mikkk, I asked just that question before kicking off - there was only one mechanic working on the car...

I would expect that it's perfectly fine to charge 2 hours if 2 mechanics have been working on the car solidly for an hour.

(Although it must be noted that having 9 pregnant women does not get you a baby in a month...)

Subaru say that they allow 1.9 hours "in case a component is difficult to get to, or something like that".

Cheers,
Nick.

Chris L

Wouldn't like to comment on that..

I know that Mercedes were going to start doing express servicing where they would have 4 or 5 guys working on your car at once, so a typical service could be done while-you-wait in about 40 mins. Not sure how they charge for it though.

Chris

IN THE STICKS

Our other car is an Audi A4 , booked it in for an oil change service (can do it myself in about 1/2 hour , but it's that stamp in the book!!!)and they wanted £155 , last time it had an oil service it was £90ish two years ago from the same dealer , Now thats inflation! ..........toss**s

Dave

MattOz

I know that when my BMW goes into the dealer for an oil service, it's done in about 30 mins and I get charged for 30 mins labour, not the full hour or whatever. It cost me £90 for my M5, as I supplied the oil, and the 330d wll be about the same. Both cars take approx 7 litres of oil. If you pay dealer prices for oil, that's a huge chunk.

Bear in mind that the intervals on the 330d are between 18k miles and 20k miles, so it's cheap compared to a Subaru. Even the M5 had 15k mile intervals.

I expect to keep my current car for 3 years or so, doing maybe 60k miles in the process. All in, that mileage will set me back £400 max in servicing, including pads etc. That's just one of the very many good reasons I changed from an my Impreza to something more rewarding.

Matt

MattW

Swings and roundabouts surely. If a clutch change was booked at 5 hours, and they took 7, how much would you be willing to pay.

When I have taken my old Sti in for service, half the time was taken up by the guy walking back and forward for parts\tools\cup of tea\natter with his mate.

jgevers

As an independent garage operator, catering for all makes and providing customers with a full set of services incl. aircon, electronic diagnostics, digital imaging wheel alignment etc. We charge between £30 and £35 per hour, which is normal for our area.

If you put this into perpspective, the local plumbers and carpenters charge £30 per hour. These guys have a van and a bag of tools as overheads.

Our overheads consist of software updates (£2000 per month approx.), Rent & rates (£2000 per month approx.), capital investment programme for tools of the trade (£1500 per month), staff training (£500 per month approx.) and so on. You can work it out, is this a good business model?

I am not saying that some garages don't overcharge. But the constant whining about garage costs is a bit annoying, when you try do do a decent job for a reasonable price. Because the overheads and investment for a modern garage are so high, more and more independents are closing down. Before long there will be areas in the UK with so few garages, and guess what will happen to the prices then?

If I had to use a garage, I would find one that communicate correctly, do a decent job and seem honest. AND STICK WITH THEM! This way the garage will get to know what your expectations are, and you will benifit from this in the long term. A small amount of money saved short term could cost much more long term.

regards,

Job

chiark

MattW,

Good question. "Dunno" is the answer, though I'd expect a price to be set to start off with and then stuck to. I did not get a quote - I was told this was a cheap service.

I guess this is all down to expectations... The dealer told me that the service was not an expensive one, but I found 315 quid for a small service to be expensive. If I had been told that I'd be charged 1.9 hours labour when I booked it in, I'd probably have been happier. Expectations, assumptions (on my part) and a genuine lack of understanding how I could be charged an extra 40 quid for labour which had not been earned.

I still cannot reconcile how Subaru reckon that a small service will take nigh-on two hours...

Job, I do appreciate the overheads and am actually wondering if Subaru are being generous with the labour to allow garages to claw back some investment they have made in being franchise dealers, which is "not insignificant" to put it mildly.

However, when a garage can do the work specified in two thirds of the time, is something wrong with the work the garage is doing (no) or in the standard charge that is set?

Cheers,
Nick.

TAINTON

Im not sure where all you guys are based but can recommend Scoobyclinic @ Chesterfield.

Labour is only £20 per hour

Compare that to your Subaru/BMW/Jag Prices.

Ashley

jgevers

Booktimes are charged by most garages nowadays. Unfortunately, because on a lot of jobs other then servicing the book time lcan be very short. The book times are based on a new vehicle. As the car gets older you might find rusted solid bolts etc. For instance, a timing belt on an Impreza is an easy job (although we still see quite a few with cam timing a tooth out). But when one or two timing cover bolts break, you can spend an hour or two drilling and time-serting the broken bolt. Yet as a customer you will only get charged book time and maybe the Time-Sert.

Therefore, some garages (NOT MINE)are making this lost time up by rattling through a service in double quick time. I agree that some things included in the service might be missed out.

regards,

Job

Fangoria

iTrader: (1)

Yep predominantly 'book' or standard times

A mate works at Renault (yeah I know but nevermind) - they always charge book time for servicing but they nearly always do the job in less than half the time!!!

My new wrx comes with free servicing for parts and labour for the first 36k miles (read first 30k then!!)
- available to all Scoobs registered I believe from April to end June 04....

Can you not take your new cars though to any Vat registered garage and the warranty should be honoured if they use official Scoob parts

stevey

iTrader: (2)

chiark does seem expensive charlie does normally do good prices but the downside with them in my oppinion is that there a bit laxy daisy when it comes to returning phone calls and such

ozzy

You *should* be able to take the car to any VAT registered garage, but IM are very particular with their warranty. They could refuse a claim and then leave it up to the owner to fight them.

Also, a lot of potential buyers will look for a full Dealer service history when buying a 2nd-hand car.

Stefan

micared

Chiark, you can consider yourself very fortunate to have recieved such restrained, considered posts in response to your thread.....look at mine from a couple of days ago, also in general, on broadly the same theme, if you want to see how it could have gone ( apologies to the people who did respond coherently, you know who you are ). As I said at the time, in my dealings with I.M., they couldn't have been more disinterested....hope you enjoy more success, if you choose to pursue the matter with them.