WHO SAID THE MY98 PPP WAS POO??????
11 June 2001, 07:09 PM
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This afternoon I took CK1 down to Power Engineering for a power run. I know that there's lots of debate about the accuracy of their figures, but at least they've always been consistent. What I really wanted was some figures for the PPP ecu I fitted recently. I have run several times at PE so it was the best place to get a comparison.
I'm also having the Hyperflow FMIC fitted on Wednesday, so it was a good opportunity to get some 'before' figures too.
There's no doubt that since fitting the PPP ecu CK1 has been a different beast. Most of you will know that I was horrified with it's performance at a recent rolling road day at Powerstation. The figures simply didin't do the car's on road performance justice (235bhp & 233lb/ft???).
I had also heard that MY98 cars with PPP had performed poorly at PE, so was half expecting to follow the trend. I was obviously delighted then when the figures appeared on the screen.
Whilst peak power was unchanged (it was actually down but identical after adjustment for ambient temp) at 257bhp, torque had risen from 225lb/ft to an incredible 266lb/ft!
The difference at 3500 revs was an astonishing 48lb/ft!!!!
Peak boost was 16psi, it's been up to 19psi on colder days.
The only mod done between these runs was the fitting of the Prodrive ecu, so whoever it was that said the PPP for MY98's was poo, you were wrong!
Prodrive truly are the Daddies!!!
Stef.
[This message has been edited by Stef (edited 12 June 2001).]
I'm also having the Hyperflow FMIC fitted on Wednesday, so it was a good opportunity to get some 'before' figures too.
There's no doubt that since fitting the PPP ecu CK1 has been a different beast. Most of you will know that I was horrified with it's performance at a recent rolling road day at Powerstation. The figures simply didin't do the car's on road performance justice (235bhp & 233lb/ft???).
I had also heard that MY98 cars with PPP had performed poorly at PE, so was half expecting to follow the trend. I was obviously delighted then when the figures appeared on the screen.
Whilst peak power was unchanged (it was actually down but identical after adjustment for ambient temp) at 257bhp, torque had risen from 225lb/ft to an incredible 266lb/ft!
The difference at 3500 revs was an astonishing 48lb/ft!!!!
Peak boost was 16psi, it's been up to 19psi on colder days.
The only mod done between these runs was the fitting of the Prodrive ecu, so whoever it was that said the PPP for MY98's was poo, you were wrong!
Prodrive truly are the Daddies!!!
Stef.
[This message has been edited by Stef (edited 12 June 2001).]
11 June 2001, 07:25 PM
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Stef,
But I thought you were on your 3rd engine or something like that.......?????
Is it the original engine and gearbox thats in CK1 ? But needless to say, the power figures speak for themselves...
Gastro
But I thought you were on your 3rd engine or something like that.......?????
Is it the original engine and gearbox thats in CK1 ? But needless to say, the power figures speak for themselves...
Gastro
11 June 2001, 07:31 PM
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Gastro.
True, it's not the same engine or transmission as previous runs. However, CK1 is the best 'exhaust & filter' UK car on the dyno site at any rolling road (267bhp) so if anything, losing the previous set-up would be a hindrance.
Stef.
[This message has been edited by Stef (edited 12 June 2001).]
True, it's not the same engine or transmission as previous runs. However, CK1 is the best 'exhaust & filter' UK car on the dyno site at any rolling road (267bhp) so if anything, losing the previous set-up would be a hindrance.
Stef.
[This message has been edited by Stef (edited 12 June 2001).]
11 June 2001, 08:42 PM
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Nice figs Stef.
Was this with a STD Prodrive set-up. Or are there other mods differant to the Prodrive set-up, airfilter exhaust ect.
Having a differant engine might make a differance who knows. But yours is the first and only MY98 I have seen with an improvement.
Differant exhaust and induction kits make a huge differance to the PPP as seen with Andy Tang's car.
Was this with a STD Prodrive set-up. Or are there other mods differant to the Prodrive set-up, airfilter exhaust ect.
Having a differant engine might make a differance who knows. But yours is the first and only MY98 I have seen with an improvement.
Differant exhaust and induction kits make a huge differance to the PPP as seen with Andy Tang's car.
11 June 2001, 10:59 PM
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Stef,
Just to add it into the mix, I got 271bhp, from a standard ECU, SS downpipe, SS backbox, Magnex centre and RamPod inductor. Trust me, I was as shocked as everyone else!!
It was at Power Engineering and the ambient temperature was 4 celius!
Since then, the MY99 PPP ECU and the mods above, produced 269bhp, but the temperature was up to 12 celius that day.
Since the addition of the HKS EVC 4 holding boost at 17.1psi/1.18 bar, it was up to 280bhp!!
So sorry to say Stef, it looks the 'exhaust and filter' title is mine!!
Andy
PS - I'll get them scanned and sent over to Paul!
Just to add it into the mix, I got 271bhp, from a standard ECU, SS downpipe, SS backbox, Magnex centre and RamPod inductor. Trust me, I was as shocked as everyone else!!
It was at Power Engineering and the ambient temperature was 4 celius!
Since then, the MY99 PPP ECU and the mods above, produced 269bhp, but the temperature was up to 12 celius that day.
Since the addition of the HKS EVC 4 holding boost at 17.1psi/1.18 bar, it was up to 280bhp!!
So sorry to say Stef, it looks the 'exhaust and filter' title is mine!!
Andy
PS - I'll get them scanned and sent over to Paul!
12 June 2001, 08:26 AM
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Jack.
No, didn't see anyone else at all.
Bob.
No, this isn't a normal PPP, just the ecu combined with a full Scorpion exhaust and a K&N induction kit. There's no doubt that the PPP absolutely adores catless exhausts!
Andy.
I was going by the Dyno site. I've amended my post accordingly though. It was certainly the most powerful for a while anyway.
What were your torque figures?
Stef.
No, didn't see anyone else at all.
Bob.
No, this isn't a normal PPP, just the ecu combined with a full Scorpion exhaust and a K&N induction kit. There's no doubt that the PPP absolutely adores catless exhausts!
Andy.
I was going by the Dyno site. I've amended my post accordingly though. It was certainly the most powerful for a while anyway.
What were your torque figures?
Stef.
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12 June 2001, 09:17 AM
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Stef,
You didn't have to edit your post, because as you say going by the site you're right!
The torque figures were a bit low, with my current setup (PPP ECU, EVC & usual breathing mods) it was 252lbft of torque.
Don't worry though I plan to challenge both Nito and Danny Fisher for the most powerful UK car!! Plans are a foot and 320bhp/300lbft of torque would be nice!!! I'll see what gives up first, me, the car or my money!!!
You still have an awesome car, and once the FMIC is in place, I dare say the figures will go up some more!!
Good to see you got your car back, and hope it's looking good!!
Catch up soon
Andy
You didn't have to edit your post, because as you say going by the site you're right!
The torque figures were a bit low, with my current setup (PPP ECU, EVC & usual breathing mods) it was 252lbft of torque.
Don't worry though I plan to challenge both Nito and Danny Fisher for the most powerful UK car!!
Plans are a foot and 320bhp/300lbft of torque would be nice!!! I'll see what gives up first, me, the car or my money!!! You still have an awesome car, and once the FMIC is in place, I dare say the figures will go up some more!!
Good to see you got your car back, and hope it's looking good!!
Catch up soon
Andy
12 June 2001, 09:49 AM
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Andy.
Post re-edited then!
As they say, 'torque does the talking'!
I don't know what to expect once the FMIC goes on, but I'm bloody excited!!
I have no desire to own the most powerful UK car, but I certainly don't want one passing me!
It's the on-road/track performance that I'm obviously more concerned with though.
Stef.
Post re-edited then!
As they say, 'torque does the talking'!
I don't know what to expect once the FMIC goes on, but I'm bloody excited!!
I have no desire to own the most powerful UK car, but I certainly don't want one passing me!
It's the on-road/track performance that I'm obviously more concerned with though.
Stef.
12 June 2001, 10:52 AM
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Stef, great news you got the car up and running again . Figures look very impressive too considering the PPP 98 was bagged by quite a few.
FMIC will no doubt make you a very happy man. Looking forward to reading your comments once the FMIC has been added. Good luck with it all Stef.
WREXY.
[This message has been edited by WREXY (edited 12 June 2001).]
. Figures look very impressive too considering the PPP 98 was bagged by quite a few.FMIC will no doubt make you a very happy man.
Looking forward to reading your comments once the FMIC has been added. Good luck with it all Stef. WREXY.
[This message has been edited by WREXY (edited 12 June 2001).]
13 June 2001, 01:51 PM
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Congratulations Stef!!!
The ppp's biggest hindrance was always the cat exhaust which unfortunately Prodrive could do nothing about. The ppp ecu certainly looks like it's doing the business particularly in the area it was designed to excel in - Torque. As a comparison, when I was running the evc at 1.15 with catless exhaust and induction I got 286bhp on a cold day, but only 251 lbs/ft compared to your 266lbs/ft!! But then again, your car is no longer an exhaust and filter car so now you're in the same league as the big boys -so no excuses 
!
The fmic should yield a little bit more although the natural progression on from this will be to fit a larger turbo which will compliment the fmic perfectly, but I bet plans are already in place for this with my setup I didn't notice much increase in lag from the fmic just a very slight delay in initial throttle response but it felt awesome at high revs. If you're bored stef and to make the time go by quicker, how about fitting an inlet temp sender between the i/c and the manifold to record what temps you are seeing before and after. I regret not having taking temps with my old i/c although the new fmic consistently sees temps from 2-3 degrees above ambient and never any higher.
Good luck with the fmic..I'm sure you'll love it and the aps system looks like a really well sorted fmic.
Rgds
Nito
The ppp's biggest hindrance was always the cat exhaust which unfortunately Prodrive could do nothing about. The ppp ecu certainly looks like it's doing the business particularly in the area it was designed to excel in - Torque. As a comparison, when I was running the evc at 1.15 with catless exhaust and induction I got 286bhp on a cold day, but only 251 lbs/ft compared to your 266lbs/ft!! But then again, your car is no longer an exhaust and filter car
so now you're in the same league as the big boys -so no excuses ! The fmic should yield a little bit more although the natural progression on from this will be to fit a larger turbo which will compliment the fmic perfectly, but I bet plans are already in place for this
with my setup I didn't notice much increase in lag from the fmic just a very slight delay in initial throttle response but it felt awesome at high revs. If you're bored stef and to make the time go by quicker, how about fitting an inlet temp sender between the i/c and the manifold to record what temps you are seeing before and after. I regret not having taking temps with my old i/c although the new fmic consistently sees temps from 2-3 degrees above ambient and never any higher.Good luck with the fmic..I'm sure you'll love it and the aps system looks like a really well sorted fmic.
Rgds
Nito
13 June 2001, 03:25 PM
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Stef,
I am interested in knowing why you went for the FMIC before a larger turbo, I've read several articles which say that order to go is Turbo then FMIC.
Mind you, FMICs look coolll!
Andrew...
I am interested in knowing why you went for the FMIC before a larger turbo, I've read several articles which say that order to go is Turbo then FMIC.
Mind you, FMICs look coolll!
Andrew...
13 June 2001, 03:29 PM
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Hyperflow FMIC!!!!! is going on Stef's car.
I know, I know, Typing error (by Nito)
[This message has been edited by WREXY (edited 13 June 2001).]
I know, I know, Typing error (by Nito)
[This message has been edited by WREXY (edited 13 June 2001).]
13 June 2001, 04:40 PM
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Yeah Nito, it's a Hyperflow not an APS!!!
Bigger and better my friend, bigger and better!
Anyway, it's just been fitted at Tyres Northampton. FAPPIN HELL!!!!!
Words completely fail me. It looks absolutely flippin mental, and goes even mentaller?!?!
I'm off to PE first thing in the morning for another power run, and I've taken some pics which I'll post later on.
I had the i/c and hoses all done black, which really suits the car. I wanted to keep it fairly low key, but it still stands out a mile.
I'll definitely be testing the temps. I didn't bother before because there are loads of cars with top mounts and they'll all be roughly the same won't they. What we need to do is do back to back tests on the same day, on track perhaps.
And talking of big boys, I look forward to seeing you out on track Nito!!
Andrew.
I don't really care what the right order is. It pulls like a train and looks the dogs danglies, so that'll do for me! Besides, I like to be different.
Stef.
Bigger and better my friend, bigger and better!
Anyway, it's just been fitted at Tyres Northampton. FAPPIN HELL!!!!!
Words completely fail me. It looks absolutely flippin mental, and goes even mentaller?!?!
I'm off to PE first thing in the morning for another power run, and I've taken some pics which I'll post later on.
I had the i/c and hoses all done black, which really suits the car. I wanted to keep it fairly low key, but it still stands out a mile.
I'll definitely be testing the temps. I didn't bother before because there are loads of cars with top mounts and they'll all be roughly the same won't they. What we need to do is do back to back tests on the same day, on track perhaps.
And talking of big boys, I look forward to seeing you out on track Nito!!
Andrew.
I don't really care what the right order is. It pulls like a train and looks the dogs danglies, so that'll do for me! Besides, I like to be different.
Stef.
13 June 2001, 05:44 PM
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Great news Stef, Happy for you m8, glad it pulls hard and looks good too.
I know you got it installed, by Tyres Northampton, but was their kit easy to install and apart from the bumper mods, did anything else need modding? Was their kit complete I mean was everything there without you having to add anything extra?
Looking forward to those power figures m8
Regards,
WREXY
[This message has been edited by WREXY (edited 13 June 2001).]
glad it pulls hard and looks good too. I know you got it installed, by Tyres Northampton, but was their kit easy to install and apart from the bumper mods, did anything else need modding? Was their kit complete I mean was everything there without you having to add anything extra?
Looking forward to those power figures m8
Regards,
WREXY
[This message has been edited by WREXY (edited 13 June 2001).]
13 June 2001, 05:50 PM
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Stef,
The trouble with any cooling mods and RR runs, is that your hoped increase on the rollers will not be as directly comparable as your *real* road figures. As you can appreciate your RR figures anywhere, will be less than your *real* on-the-road figures. Any help on the cooling front will improve your RR figures, but on the road may not be as comparable. You have already said your car is now better, so at the end of the day that's all that counts. The trouble is you really need an unbiased view.....if your at SPOD on Sunday, you will have to trow me the keys, as I will be able to make an unbiased view from the last time i drove it with just the PPP!!!!
I've also got a temp sensor *thingy* if you want to borrow it. At least then you can quote nice ACT figures to people (People might than think you actually know what your on about then)
Anyway, why am I being so nice to you.....U BELLEND!!!!!!!!!
Shaun.
The trouble with any cooling mods and RR runs, is that your hoped increase on the rollers will not be as directly comparable as your *real* road figures. As you can appreciate your RR figures anywhere, will be less than your *real* on-the-road figures. Any help on the cooling front will improve your RR figures, but on the road may not be as comparable. You have already said your car is now better, so at the end of the day that's all that counts. The trouble is you really need an unbiased view.....if your at SPOD on Sunday, you will have to trow me the keys, as I will be able to make an unbiased view from the last time i drove it with just the PPP!!!!
I've also got a temp sensor *thingy* if you want to borrow it. At least then you can quote nice ACT figures to people (People might than think you actually know what your on about then
)Anyway, why am I being so nice to you.....U BELLEND!!!!!!!!!
Shaun.
13 June 2001, 05:51 PM
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Stef,
I/C sounds good - what sort of price are people looking at who want one ?
Andrew,
Regarding "order of upgrades", if you have a smallish turbo it is going to generate more heat when running higher boost. If you improve the intercooling, the gains are going to be pretty good I would have thought....
Thanks
Gavin
I/C sounds good - what sort of price are people looking at who want one ?
Andrew,
Regarding "order of upgrades", if you have a smallish turbo it is going to generate more heat when running higher boost. If you improve the intercooling, the gains are going to be pretty good I would have thought....
Thanks
Gavin
13 June 2001, 06:04 PM
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WREXY.
Cheers mate.
The kit was designed around a MY99, so there were a few minor alterations required. The kit was complete though.
I'll post more details in the new thread tomorrow.
Shaun.
I'm not expecting huge gains tomorrow, but a fmic should perform better on the dyno as the cooling is geared up for them better.
On the road today the difference was staggering, and you're right, that's enough for me.
Gavin.
Prices for the UK are still being sorted. As soon as they are, I'll let you know.
Stef.
Cheers mate.
The kit was designed around a MY99, so there were a few minor alterations required. The kit was complete though.
I'll post more details in the new thread tomorrow.
Shaun.
I'm not expecting huge gains tomorrow, but a fmic should perform better on the dyno as the cooling is geared up for them better.
On the road today the difference was staggering, and you're right, that's enough for me.
Gavin.
Prices for the UK are still being sorted. As soon as they are, I'll let you know.
Stef.
13 June 2001, 06:33 PM
#21
POD, Sunday??
is that a RWYB day and is anyone actually going???
I fancy breaking that westie record, just need to find 0.3 secs.
Must be nice to have a big fat front end I am looking into a chargecooler setup, costs a mint though. My current intercooler is hopeless. 
is that a RWYB day and is anyone actually going???
I fancy breaking that westie record, just need to find 0.3 secs.
Must be nice to have a big fat front end
I am looking into a chargecooler setup, costs a mint though. My current intercooler is hopeless.
13 June 2001, 08:17 PM
#22
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John you rag a r s e !!!!
Loads are going off the RS BBS, as 3 main regional groups are using it as a meeting place (due to the foot & mouth scuppering all the shows). Should be loads going.
Get your hairy a s s down!!!!
Shaun.
Loads are going off the RS BBS, as 3 main regional groups are using it as a meeting place (due to the foot & mouth scuppering all the shows). Should be loads going.
Get your hairy a s s down!!!!
Shaun.
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