2.5L CDB from Litchfield - opinions?
Just seen these on their website, seems like a new product from them.
Anyone tried one yet? Looks like a nice set up: http://www.litchfieldimports.co.uk/s...7_upgrades.asp |
Read through Bob Rawle's project in the projects section, you will find it includes what your looking for.
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Surely this is the holy grail of 2.5s?!
Ringland issues no more (given a decent ECU map of course)?! |
I'm guessing it's even more expensive than a CDB 2.35l?
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Originally Posted by Turbovin
(Post 10438122)
I'm guessing it's even more expensive than a CDB 2.35l?
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It looks good :)
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Can't you achieve the same result as in the picture, if you rebored a CDB to a 2.5 or had some deck plates put into a S-CDB OR ODB 2.5, converting it to a CDB 2.5?
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Thanks for the responses folks. I noticed the Bob Rawle has been using one of these for a while, I was wondering if there are any others.
I've asked Litchfield for some prices but haven't heard anything back yet. I'm not sure how the insert actually works, it looks like a single piece that gets somehow secured to the deck. It might still be that a bored out EJ22 CDB would be stronger since it's a solid closed deck rather than an insert. I was actually sort of hoping this would be a cheaper option than a 2.35, but I could be wrong... |
Originally Posted by joz8968
(Post 10438107)
Surely this is the holy grail of 2.5s?!
Ringland issues no more (given a decent ECU map of course)?! We'd all like to think this is a fix for the issue, as always, time will tell! It's certainly a neat piece of engineering. |
Originally Posted by Tazz
(Post 10438151)
Can't you achieve the same result as in the picture, if you rebored a CDB to a 2.5 or had some deck plates put into a S-CDB OR ODB 2.5, converting it to a CDB 2.5?
I'm just not sure how the insert is actually bonded to the block, I could imagine the insert lifting from the deck under changes in temperature, which could be trouble. |
Originally Posted by Alan Jeffery
(Post 10438173)
Being fair, strictly speaking the ringland issues with the 2.5 are more to do with piston quality than open/closed deck.
We'd all like to think this is a fix for the issue, as always, time will tell! It's certainly a neat piece of engineering. 1) To secure the headgasket more firmly (larger area for it to mate to) 2) To provide more support for the tops of the cylinders, to stop them distorting under high pressure But I'm just guessing here... |
Originally Posted by MadUsa1
(Post 10438178)
I guess the main benefits of converting the 2.5 to a CDB are:
1) To secure the headgasket more firmly (larger area for it to mate to) 2) To provide more support for the tops of the cylinders, to stop them distorting under high pressure But I'm just guessing here... I think we all wish Subaru made them strong to start with. Somewhere there's an executive with a lot to answer for! |
Originally Posted by Alan Jeffery
(Post 10439556)
I think we all wish Subaru made them strong to start with. Somewhere there's an executive with a lot to answer for!
;) :D |
Originally Posted by Alan Jeffery
(Post 10439556)
It's 2) rather than 1)
I think we all wish Subaru made them strong to start with. Somewhere there's an executive with a lot to answer for! You're right about the exec though - imagine the money they've spent replacing all those broken 2.5L engines, not to mention the reputation damage. Would it not have been cheaper in the long run to use a CDB 2.5 and a set of forged pistons? |
Did we find out how much these blocks cost?
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Originally Posted by MadUsa1
(Post 10439754)
Thanks Alan. I always thought the CDB helped to seat the HG better than the ODB so there's less chance of blow through.
You're right about the exec though - imagine the money they've spent replacing all those broken 2.5L engines, not to mention the reputation damage. Would it not have been cheaper in the long run to use a CDB 2.5 and a set of forged pistons? Subaru are by no means the only manufacturers making expensive mistakes. We have a 55 plate Audi A4 diesel in now with a broken oil pump drive. It's a single row chain and wouldn't look out of place on your toddler's pedal car. Apparently these cars are dying like flies with only 70/80 thousand on the clock. Worse, the parts are back order, and haven't been available for three months at least due to demand! |
Originally Posted by Alan Jeffery
(Post 10440028)
It would, and then some I think. It's a classic case of college educated idiots overruling engineers.
Subaru are by no means the only manufacturers making expensive mistakes. We have a 55 plate Audi A4 diesel in now with a broken oil pump drive. It's a single row chain and wouldn't look out of place on your toddler's pedal car. Apparently these cars are dying like flies with only 70/80 thousand on the clock. Worse, the parts are back order, and haven't been available for three months at least due to demand! |
i thought main failures with 2.5 were liners ballooning and/or moving? would a custom linered 2.5 not do a job?
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Originally Posted by toyney83
(Post 10440366)
i thought main failures with 2.5 were liners ballooning and/or moving? would a custom linered 2.5 not do a job?
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Fitting new liners is very expensive
Back to this Lichfield CDB if u follow bobs project he had the block chemically treated to stop movement of the heads so not sure if it is just a liner prob creating movement ? Anybody |
Alyn at ASPerformance is also doing a similar closed deck block modification, price is circa £500-£600 I believe.
http://bbs.22b.com/cgi-bin/ultimateb...=001901#000009 |
How do these inserts actually woke though? Are they welded into the block or do they just sit there? Is there any concern about different rates of expansion between the two different materials?
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Just a light interference fit from a material with similar expansion rates to the block.
Will let you know how it performs when I get my closed deck EG33 block fitted shortly, anything under 1300bhp will be considered a 'fail' ! |
Originally Posted by Andy.F
(Post 10442776)
Just a light interference fit from a material with similar expansion rates to the block.
Will let you know how it performs when I get my closed deck EG33 block fitted shortly, anything under 1300bhp will be considered a 'fail' ! Holy $hit 1300 :lol1: I hope you have bigger brakes on it since the last time i saw them :thumb: |
Originally Posted by Andy.F
(Post 10442776)
Just a light interference fit from a material with similar expansion rates to the block.
Will let you know how it performs when I get my closed deck EG33 block fitted shortly, anything under 1300bhp will be considered a 'fail' ! Not sure i like the sound of that, particularly since they machine away the standard cylinder strengtheners to fit these. |
If it has any clearance it will fret due to the combustion pressure causing movement at the interface. Don't see a problem with a light interference fit considering the liners will be rebored and honed after plate fitment.
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Any up date guys?
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