Originally Posted by The Dogs B******s
(Post 11799518)
Come on then, give us your usual drizzle to why we should stay in then.
|
Originally Posted by JTaylor
(Post 11799594)
Well I imagine a world where Europe, Australasia and the Americas are one; Britain should be part of that vision.
|
Gods empire knows no boundaries ;)
|
Originally Posted by neil-h
(Post 11799585)
How is that the fault of the EU, sounds more like your local MP was to bone idle to try. Surely if your going to campaign for anything it should've been for your local MP to actually do his/her job and stop making excuses.
|
Originally Posted by Petem95
(Post 11799596)
So you want to build an empire?
|
Fair enough JTaylor, those 'liberal utopia' fantasies eh! ;) I respect your opinion though.
Going to be interesting to see if Boris Johnson comes out in support of the 'out' campaign. I think that would be a big boost if he did, although he'd have to face the wrath of Cameron. I'm actually surprised Corbin hasn't come out in support of the 'out' vote to be honest. I've read a lot suggesting he might be in favour of it, and although I'm not a Labour supporter I kind admire him for standing up for what he believes in. |
To have a proper union wealth and opportunity has to be shared out and somebody has to be in charge or have the fudge we presently commit to .
|
Originally Posted by JTaylor
(Post 11799617)
Sure. Well, I don't personally, but I'd like to see liberal democracy as the dominant force in the world. There's traditionally a hegemony and I'd prefer it to be one that supported human rights. As Churchill said: "Many forms of Government have been tried, and will be tried in this world of sin and woe. No one pretends that democracy is perfect or all-wise. Indeed it has been said that democracy is the worst form of Government except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time...". Still stands, in fact Francis Fukayama claims that Liberal Democracy is "The End of History" in his book of the same name. It's inevitable that in the future there'll be just a few dominant ideologies and I want the one that's best for the most people. A United States of Europe is the next stage in that process.
I don't think America is that good an advert for liberal democracy at the moment And I am very wary of the "American exceptionalism" view - epitomised by Fukayama book |
Originally Posted by Petem95
(Post 11799630)
Fair enough JTaylor, those 'liberal utopia' fantasies eh! ;) I respect your opinion though.
Going to be interesting to see if Boris Johnson comes out in support of the 'out' campaign. I think that would be a big boost if he did, although he'd have to face the wrath of Cameron. I'm actually surprised Corbin hasn't come out in support of the 'out' vote to be honest. I've read a lot suggesting he might be in favour of it, and although I'm not a Labour supporter I kind admire him for standing up for what he believes in. |
Originally Posted by JTaylor
(Post 11799641)
it will be a world where gay and straight, black and white people, men and women, atheists and theists, rich and poor and all manner of other diverse groups can live in relative freedom and security. And it will evolve. It won't be immutable. A coming together of nation states who share similar ideals and aspirations is the next step for our race. Let's not shrink back in to our island. Let's protect what it stands for by reaching out and joining forces with our cousins around the world!
|
Europeans are to become a race ??
|
Originally Posted by hodgy0_2
(Post 11799637)
Yes and I think he is a bit embarrassed by that book now, it seems a little premature
I don't think America is that good an advert for liberal democracy at the moment And I am very wary of the "American exceptionalism" view - epitomised by Fukayama book |
Originally Posted by Petem95
(Post 11799645)
Are you under the influence of a legal high at the moment?! :freak3:
Originally Posted by dpb
(Post 11799646)
Europeans are to become a race ??
You lot seem to think this vote is about straight bananas and fishing rights. Well, actually it's about the socio-cultural evolution of the west. So get it right. |
James out of interest have you ever done a real job , apart from selling dreams that is
(beds) or have I got that wrong |
Originally Posted by JTaylor
(Post 11799660)
:lol1: Sort of.
The human race, you plonker. You lot seem to think this vote is about straight bananas and fishing rights. Well, actually it's about the socio-cultural evolution of the west. So get it right. this is the problem i was eluding to earlier, lets face it 99% of us don;t know the real implications and just go on what we are told or headlines about imigration |
Originally Posted by dpb
(Post 11799665)
James out of interest have you ever done a real job , apart from selling dreams that is
(beds) or have I got that wrong |
Originally Posted by Tidgy
(Post 11799666)
this is the problem i was eluding to earlier, lets face it 99% of us don;t know the real implications and just go on what we are told or headlines about imigration
As JTaylor as pointed out it is much much more than they would have you believe It is about ascribing to European values - it is not perfect, but leaving won't bring perfection either (leaving the EU won't mean UK will collapse either) Take child benefit, yes it seems odd that a Polish worker gets to send his money back home I lost all my entitlement to child benefit 3 odd years ago The EU rule is not so much that a Polish worker has that right, but rather he has the same rights as any worker working in the UK The government could stop it by simply stopping child benefit altogether - but that is really a race to the bottom Because actually the real kicker is that this is a tiny amount on money in the Grand scheme of things - but makes a great headline You must always be careful of the debating tactic that goes "oh look there's a squirrel" And the out campaign seems to do quite a lot of "Oh look there's a squirrel" |
Originally Posted by ScoobyWon't
(Post 11799437)
Are you immortal?
With the EU lurching from one disaster to another, be it financial, migration, terrorism or even the threat of a Russian invasion of eastern member states, do you really think the EU will last another 100 to 200 years? |
I dont think we have much choice but to stay in to be honest, as much as I want out.
The EU have done alot for workers rights, that would have never happened if we were out of it. |
Originally Posted by JTaylor
(Post 11799687)
I care enough about future generations, the country and humanity to try to see beyond the end of my nose.
Stronger together. Sure. Stronger together. Including non-Christians? Or, will they have to become Christians to be worthy of your full care and compassion? |
Originally Posted by Turbohot
(Post 11799714)
Sure. Stronger together.
Including non-Christians? Or, will they have to become Christians to be worthy of your full care and compassion? |
Originally Posted by Turbohot
(Post 11799714)
Sure. Stronger together.
Including non-Christians? Or, will they have to become Christians to be worthy of your full care and compassion? |
Whilst I'd love to agree with you, JT, we need to look at the bigger picture.
United Europe all singing from the same sheet? great...except what happens when those intent on altering our religion to THEIR way of thinking, start making themselves a nuisance? You have 28 countries who can't agree how to deal with the problem, and lots of them are now sooooo liberal, they don't see it AS a problem..... |
Originally Posted by dpb
(Post 11799631)
To have a proper union wealth and opportunity has to be shared out and somebody has to be in charge or have the fudge we presently commit to .
|
Originally Posted by alcazar
(Post 11799740)
Whilst I'd love to agree with you, JT, we need to look at the bigger picture.
United Europe all singing from the same sheet? great...except what happens when those intent on altering our religion to THEIR way of thinking, start making themselves a nuisance? You have 28 countries who can't agree how to deal with the problem, and lots of them are now sooooo liberal, they don't see it AS a problem..... |
'Stronger together' on the eastern fringes has provoked Russia into stepping into those areas. That'll be a FAIL then ..!
|
Originally Posted by JTaylor
(Post 11799732)
Ask the question on the other thread, Swati.
Answer it on this thread, James. |
Originally Posted by Turbohot
(Post 11799771)
I asked you here, and you well know why. It's perfectly relevant to question the mindset of a man in the very context of this thread, where he shows contradictions (to his own mindset) and gives out conflicting (to his own mindset) statements.
Answer it on this thread, James. Christianity supports secular politics (Google 'Render unto Caesar'), it is not an ideology. No Christian is pushing for a theocracy in this life. Just because we Christians want other people to be 'saved' does not mean we do not love them. Indeed it is exactly because we love them that we want them to be saved. If people want to reject Jesus that's their choice, that doesn't mean I want them to suffer in this life or the next. |
Warren, if you want the above moving just ping a mod' and I'm sure they'll sort it.
|
Boris Johnson backing the out campaign - great news, and should give the out campaign a real boost! :)
|
All times are GMT +1. The time now is 05:25 PM. |
© 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands